"Green" policies are destroying this country

It should be clear now from recent inflation that things are not going to get cheaper, renewables or anything else. What is likely to happen is the cost gap between renewables and traditional fossil fuels will widen in favour of renewables.

Once the true cost of carbon is added to the price of everything through carbon social credits and taxes things will shake out. Basically everyone is going to get poorer due to the lack of action years ago. Serves everyone right. Successful, smart people with enough money to carbon offset, or even trade carbon, will still enjoy a good lifestyle so its not all doom and gloom.

deholleboom

From the afore mentioned report:

"The EU’s own statisticians, Eurostat, remark of this phenomenon:

…outsourcing of production and services from developed countries to low-cost developing countries…is closely related with the industrial restructuring which has been one of the main economic developments in Europe and other developed countries in recent decades. This is seen both in the context of deindustrialisation and concerns regarding social and environmental standards.

The character of the economies in Europe has changed, and it is not unjust to characterise this quite simply as deindustrialisation. Consequently, the reduction in emissions intensity cannot be considered in isolation from the overall context. It reflects, in all probability, the closure of higher emitting industries. A very similar phenomenon was seen in the former Soviet Union states, and notably in the former East Germany, as observed above.Comparison of European industrial emissions intensity with a less flexible sector, such as transport, the emissions of which cannot be exported to another location, is instructive, and is discussed in the following section.

conclusion

It would appear, therefore, that the emissions reductions observed in the EU member states are only indirectly related to climate-change policies. The principal effect of those policies has been to suppress energy demand and hasten a trend towards economic restructuring, perhaps economic decline, and it is this that has caused the reduction in emissions. This conclusion finds further support from consideration of EU manufacturing and employment, with particular reference to ‘green jobs’'. End of quote

To summise: we stopped developing our industries, outsourced production to the east (which has a much lower standard of care in regards to clean production but ok, not our problem) including renewable production, while patting ourselves on the back that we lowered emissions. So, a deliberate range of policies that lowered industrial output to the detriment of everybody in the EU except those in Green tech. It made the EU more dependant on imports which caused more CO2 emissions due to dirty production methods elsewhere and longer transportation lines. And instead of seeing the reality and take the opportunity for a reversal of policy the EU is doubling down on the road taken. Well, as the ad says:' when it's gone it's really gone'.

It makes me really angry..

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887330#Comment_119887330

Wind turbines do not provide anything when there is no wind. The French will get back to where they were providing 70% of their needs from nuclear, and yet this year when they were not exporting electricity, (top exporters year on year in Europe due to nuclear), Sweden took the top spot. Another European country with nuclear. Is it any wonder that both are going to increase their nuclear capacity.

Japan is getting back in the game re-opening mothballed plants and has announced it`s intention to develop and build next-generation nuclear power plants, and U.K. will have Hinkley C providing electricity to the equivalent of our total population and plans to build as many as eight new nuclear plants.

The three you mentioned France, Japan, and the U.K. do not appear to share your concerns. Neither does Poland, Egypt, UAE or Turkey all getting into nuclear for the first time.

Now if we only knew the cost of that increase from 389 TWh to 2894 TWh in 11 years, but for whatever reason when it comes to nuclear greens can quote pounds shillings and pence when it comes to their own favourites it`s smoke and mirrors with never a complete figure to be seen. But even from the limited figures we have seen the ESB, again an uncosted plan, is financially unviable.

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887353#Comment_119887353

Great, and if they can do that with aviation fuel, and it being carbon neutral, then the same would be possible for motor fuel I presume

JRant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887482#Comment_119887482

There's another reality where the general populace stop buying into the Green agenda and that's being driven by inflation. Contrary to your idea that renewables will get a lot cheaper to fossil fuels, it will actually be cheaper to maintain and upgrade existing fossil plants. The Netherlands is running at 15% inflation. Three years of that will see real earnings and spending power decrease by nearly 50%. You think average people are going to accept the existing carbon taxes, nevermind all these new ones with that type of squeeze being put on them?

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119886649#Comment_119886649

A 30% - 40% drop in usage each time it is recycled

How is that not a finite resource ?

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887026#Comment_119887026

Say a farmer had a ton of wood pellets he didn`t want and decided to burn them in a big bonfire, he would be grand though would he not ?

They are designated as carbon neutral after all.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887703#Comment_119887703

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/irish-people-have-strong-appetite-for-scaled-up-climate-action-survey-shows-1.4751612

Support for action is everywhere, for example do you see any push against greater proportion of apartment living. More and more hybrids and electric cars on the roads too.

People are on board with doing the right thing.

MightyMunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119872126#Comment_119872126

No we can sue everyone that didn't buy one though

JRant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887776#Comment_119887776

A study carried out a year ago before inflation was a thing by a completely unbiased body, the EPA. Anyhow, the divil is in the detail. This little beaut shows just how strong the green message has been in getting across a message that has ZERO basis in reality

"Irish people strongly support a range of policies to address climate change while 78 per cent also think climate action will increase jobs, economic growth and quality of life"

78% is a staggering amount when you consider that there is zero evidence that this will happen and any available data indicates quite the opposite.

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887612#Comment_119887612

Japan has 80% of it's plants offline. When do they expect to have 40 plants opened or replaced ? (hint 11 years and counting)

Finland had delays of a decade while waiting for the plant that produces 50% of it's nuclear power. Costs skyrocketed.

France has been trying to build ONE plant for the last 20 years. The have also shown how interconnectors are keeping the lights on.

The UK has had plans for 8 new nuclear plants for the last 20 years. The ONE plant they are building is already 10 years late.

The US hasn't completed a plant in the last 30 years except to complete 3 started in the 1970s.

Recent nuclear plants have quadrupled in price during construction, though doubling is probably more usual. Since 2010. Solar and Lithium battery costs have dropped 90%.

Costs of offshore wind have plummeted, during Hinkley-C's delays.

Hornsea-1 had a strike price of 140.00£/MWh (2012) now 164.96£/MWh (construction started 2018 - fully operational 2019)

Hornsea-2 had a strike price of £57.50/MHw €63.31/MHw (July 2022 contract awarded - August 2022 full production )

Hornsea-3 strike price is £37.35 (2012) (July 20222 contract awarded )

Our normal peak demand is 5GW , with 30GW of wind we'd be getting at least that three quarters of the time directly from wind. Of the remaining quarter of the time a lot of it would be when demand was between 2.5 and 5GW so again covered directly by wind. Then there's solar during summer, imports, and the other generators, and finally there'd be hydrogen to fill in whatever was missing.

There is some wind most of the time, 6.6% 90% of the time means 2GW from 30GW which would cover our summer night valley.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887721#Comment_119887721

You misunderstood, those figures are for copper usage from recycled materials, as in that's the amount that comes from recycled materials as opposed to newly mined materials.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887813#Comment_119887813

any available data indicates quite the opposite.

Care to share that data?

paddyisreal

https://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2022/11/16/eamon-ryan-chosen-to-officially-switch-off-christmas-lights-in-dublin/

Not as far fetched as it reads, lol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119888191#Comment_119888191

In fairness they are a needless vanity that is destroying the planet. Dooming us all for some shiny lights.

Sheer madness

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119888259#Comment_119888259

I find it hard to walk around in the dark without the shiny light.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119888272#Comment_119888272

you need christmas lights to get around??

and not everyone cares about christmas anyway, less and less go to mass and we have an increasing portion of non christian and atheist backgrounds

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119888347#Comment_119888347

I'm not a Christian. I mean street lights.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119888349#Comment_119888349

The link was about Christmas lights, but maybe getting around with an LED flashlight would be better for the environment rather than leaving the lights on all night long. Or those sensor street lights. How on earth do the country folk manage

"With growing demand for smaller social housing, apartment-style living will be the norm in a rural county like Kerry and the ideal of the small cottage and garden will be limited, the council's director of housing Martin O’Donoghue told a meeting of the Castleisland /Corca Dhuibhne (Dingle) area."

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/munster/arid-40748940.html

Steps in the right direction but for other reasons. This needs to expand to all new construction with mandated portions in co living setups. There should be carbon taxes/levy on square footage in order to keep places within an acceptable size.

Solve the housing crisis while minimising damage to the environment

"UN Secretary General Antonio Guterres has said that the most efficient way to re establish trust between the richer and poorer countries - the so-called Global North and Global South - is by finding an ambitious and credible agreement on loss and damage and financial support for developing countries.

Ministers from poor nations on the frontlines of fiercer floods, droughts and storms said the COP27 talks would let down their hard-hit people if they end without agreement on a fund to deal with worsening "loss and damage"driven by climate change.

"Climate justice delayed will be climate justice denied," said flood-battered Pakistan's climate change minister, Sherry Rehman.

She called for "a bargain between the Global North and the Global South" to set up a fund that would later channel billions of dollars to those bearing the brunt of climate change impacts

"Vulnerability should not become a death sentence, because that is what many economies and countries and people are facing," Ms Rehman said, adding that parts of the world could become uninhabitable if climate change continues unchecked

Mr Guterres said the time for talking on loss and damage finance was over and urged action.

"No one can deny the scale of loss and damage we see around the globe. The world is burning and drowning before our eyes," he told journalists"

From:

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2022/1118/1336828-cop27-egypt/

Posters are hardly doom mongering when world leaders are using the phrases above like the world burning. death sentence, parts of the world becoming uninhabitable.

Government policy (and not just green policy) is looking likely to change due to inaction. Pouring billions into poorer more vulnerable nations is the only defence now

namloc1980

What does handing over billions to corrupt governments in poorer countries actually achieve other than lining the pockets of the privileged few in those countries? The average citizen there won't see a cent of this. Feels like a scam.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887776#Comment_119887776

You know silly- I wonder have you ever lived in an apartment?

It’s not all it’s cracked up to be.

From not owning the land the building sits on compared to a house, your neighbour upstairs doing workouts and dropping weights on your ceiling while your kids are trying to sleep, your neighbour two floors up from him throwing down cigarette butts onto your patch of garden, a bunch of neighbours not knowing how to put a black bag in a fcuking bin and just throwing it on the ground to rot, the management company going bust time and again when people start asking for things to be done, fire protection standard issues etc etc.

I’ve lived in both an apartment and a house and I can tell you now what the majority of people aspire to- and that’s no disrespect to people living in apartments.

You just can’t depend on your apartment neighbour living above you or sharing your communal spaces.

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889006#Comment_119889006

All I get from this green crack and sustainable this n that is a very lower standard of living for everyone except the really privileged of course.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889073#Comment_119889073

Care to show the correlation?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889006#Comment_119889006

none of that matters to the the zealots

Pa ElGrande

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119888617#Comment_119888617

Don't forget the commission for NGOs and university academics. What do you think their business model is? It is the NGOs and academics that drive the press releases onto wire services that are then recycled by churnalists and media noise merchants as click bait. They learned their lesson from the Ozone crisis, they signed the Montreal protocol and the funding disappeared. The Ozone hole is still there, it never went away, but there is no money in it and no alarmism. There is no intention to solve "climate change", too many vested interests with hands in taxpayers pockets.

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889084#Comment_119889084

If ya read what I quoted for starters

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887353#Comment_119887353

Isn't that a bit shocking and against much of Green thinking - a proposed 23.2 million hectares of monoculture with practically zero levels of bio diversity.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889113#Comment_119889113

Ah ok, so nothing to show any correlation, thanks for the clarification