"Green" policies are destroying this country

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121552852#Comment_121552852

There are two things the U.N. are good at, talk and sending around the begging bowl. Other than taxpayers funding 28 expensive jaunts around the world generating carbon footprints the begging bowl and talk is all that has been achieved by the U.N.

Where did you come up with the idea that I was proposing the E.U. slaughter cattle. Crazy and all as some of their meanderings have been they never came up with that. That was an Irish Green Party brainfart all of their own where the E.U. agriculture commissioner made it clear that their concern was not slaughtering cattle, but food security.

I haven`t proposed that Europe burn more coal, oil and gas, even though that is what the former green heroes Germany are actually doing due to them shutting down the last of their nuclear plant and are back exploring for more gas. The reality is that increased use of coal, oil and gas are inevitable at lest for the forseeable future under the present plans as renewable generation by wind and solar are not even keeping pace with demand let alone them not being economically viable.

But then I cannot understand how some greens can keep up the hypocrisy of pretending that 60% of the E.U. green energy from biomass is carbon neutral. Or indeed that when it comes to climate change telling us that it is a global problem where us flushing our economy down the toilet will be a game changer, rather than it not making one iota of differnce, while happily turning a blind eye to countries that produce the green tech beloved by them using coal. China alone has now 247 GW of new coal burning power plants under construction and permitted (29 August 2023 Centre for Research on Energy and Clean Air). And that does not even including the coal new coal burning smelter plants and foundries needed to provide all this green tech. That "legal binding" Paris Agreement from the U.N. talking shop really has forced China to change their ways on global emissions.

antoinolachtnai

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121553942#Comment_121553942

So what are you proposing, from up there on the ditch?

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121553346#Comment_121553346

Necks like jockeys behinds comes to mind.

Nearly two years ago when wind turbine manufactureres were losing money hand over fist was pointed out but many as to where this offshore wind plan was heading, it was either ignored or we were being told that economy of scale would sort it out in jig time. Now when the writing is clearly on the wall for a plan that greens here backed to the hilt and could not give a figure for when it was clearly shown that even the offshore part of this plan was financially nuts, they are asking others for their opinion on solving the problems.

Have you ever heard the expression "Your pig from your farm" ?

antoinolachtnai

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554031#Comment_121554031

I have no idea what you are going on about to be honest. It’s obviously agricultural, is it something to do with not sitting on a ditch?

Let us know when you have something to propose.

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554067#Comment_121554067

You know exactly what I have being "going on about". I have made it very clear on any number of the green policies favored by both the E.U. and the Irish Green Party backed by you but you have just chosen to ignore them as it doesn`t suit your agenda.

I do find the irony of you now looking for other to come up with suggestions as to how to get out of those holes particularily amusing when you or others here were not interested in listening to the warning of digging yourselves into them in the first place.

My proposal is the same as it has always been. Even before so much money was poured down that hole. A coherent costed plan that is not going to beggar our citizens or ruin our economy.

antoinolachtnai

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554172#Comment_121554172

Let’s hear it. Tell us your costed plan.

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554220#Comment_121554220

As I said, necks like a jockey`s behind.

Years of being asked for the costs of their own proposals with nothing forthcoming, where verifiable costings have been provided for just a section of this proposal showing how economically disastrous it would be to further pursue it, it`s back to "Show us your figures so I can again attempt to distract from how fcuked up what I favor is while again not showing a single cost for mine."

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121553832#Comment_121553832

The greens want us to take diesel buses instead of electric cars though don't they?

As ridiculous as that statement sounds we need buses to be running for it to happen

ps200306

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121552938#Comment_121552938

All the anti environment people are the same, no plans. Just waffle on it's terrible what is happening and it's all "dA GrEeN pArTy" fault.

Thread is just turned into an anti Green Party waffle by a few posters who seem totally unaware that every party in Ireland has a Green Agenda.

The thread title is about "Green" policies. Any party pushing the same nonsense will come in for the same criticism. The "anti environment" slur is pathetic. No green utopia will come to pass without an economically sustainable environment. The current "plan" doesn't deserve the title since it is crashing and burning as we speak. It's also a bit rich coming from the poster who doesn't even know what the "plan" is, due to ignoring all the links provided. In terms of workable approaches, there is no plan. Eamon Ryan jetting off to COP28 and announcing a transition away from fossil fuels is not a plan, it's a magic spell from the Green cult.

Plus the nonsense about nuclear and still they can't answer two questions. Which parties in Ireland are supporting nuclear? and which location in Ireland is willing to have a nuclear plant slapped into it?

Why are you obsessing about Ireland? It's a global problem, remember? Whether Ireland gets nukes or not makes no difference to anyone except the Irish. Same with 50GW of offshore wind or a rapid expansion of natural gas plant. It has big implications for our economy, but none for climate change. I suppose it could be good for burnishing Eamon Ryan's green credentials when he rubs shoulders with the great and powerful. But as far as climate change is concerned, it's one giant nothing burger.

You're right, Ireland probably won't get nukes. There are too many hysterical voices against low-carbon reliable baseload power. There aren't enough legislators with any clue about energy economics. But cold, hard reality will bite them soon enough. A minor consolation from the whole affair is that things that can't happen won't happen. Let's hope that becomes apparent before too much damage is done. Meanwhile China, India and a whole bunch of east Asian economies -- the place that do make a difference to global carbon emissions -- already have nukes or plan to build them.

You want a plan? How about we create a level playing field for all forms of energy, to include both market pricing and dispatch priority. Impose carbon taxes and/or credits based on whole lifecycle emissions, and ensure that any changes are signposted well in advance (at least several years). That allows everyone to compete with confidence, and prevents damage to the economy by having governments betting on particular technologies. Greenies will probably realise that this would immediately decimate the wind industry. They are free to advocate for a higher carbon tax to save it, but at least they will then be forced to show their cards and come clean on the costs.

Neither nuclear nor renewables will save the planet. We'll need all of those and new technologies we haven't yet thought of for that. Ireland isn't going to be at the forefront of that, so a wait-and-see attitude is the only sensible one. We have time. The planet doesn't need as much saving as the more hysterical greenies bleat about.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554774#Comment_121554774

"Green policies" which all parties have and you go off waffle about Eamonn Ryan.

In regards to why am I talking about Ireland, well I live in Ireland, I vote in Ireland and the thread titile is "destroying this country"

What exactly in the thread title says it's only the Green Party and that we shouldn't be talking about Ireland?

FYI "nukes" refers to nuclear weapons. We are talking about nuclear power which I have never seen in my life refered to as nukes and if you google it will confirm it is nuclear weapons

ps200306

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554776#Comment_121554776

"Green policies" which all parties have and you go off waffle about Eamonn Ryan.

Eamon Ryan is a leading spokesperson on green policies, is he not? As well as an EU policy negotiator at COP28? Don't worry, I'm happy to lambaste anyone with the same views.

In regards to why am I talking about Ireland, well I live in Ireland, I vote in Ireland and the thread titile is "destroying this country"

Yes, that's all good and proper. As long as you separate anything that happens in Ireland from any implications for global climate change. There aren't any, therefore our local concerns should be primarily economic.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554798#Comment_121554798

All parties have an environmental spokesperson. All parties have green policies. The department of environment head went to COP28.

If you are trying to lambaste anyone you really are not doing a good job of it.

No idea what last point is, thread is about Ireland. Why would our concerns be primarily economic on a thread about green policies?

JRant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554817#Comment_121554817

Boom, there it is, the complete disconnect between green policies and the economy that so many in favour of said policies suffer from.

It's like the magic money tree will just wish all those 100's of billions into existence and everyone will get this mythical cheap reliable renewable energy we keep hearing about.

PommieBast

@Blut2

It'd be funny if it wasn't so tragic. This attitude/behaviour is exactly why the Greens are facing electoral wipeout in the next election.

As much as I want to line them all against a wall I think they won't be wiped out. They are a south-Dublin regionalist party (read: port barrels) and voters in that area can afford stuff.

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121552938#Comment_121552938

Seeing as this post was about me but posted to another poster I did not see it until I noticed @ps200306 reply.Your posting record on this thread may be pretty dismal, but that is no excuse to you now resorting to lying.I never posted anything "about getting Sinn Fein into government". In fact I made it clear to you that I was no Sinn Fein supporter.

You were the poster that brought up your "trajectory" of Sinn Fein following Green Party policy. When that was pointed out to you, by not just me but others, for the nonesense it was you then doubled down on Ryan`s energy security review somehow believing it was the plan to see us having net zero emissions by 2050 rather than what it actually was. Ryan finally having to concede that he got it completely wrong on LNG and gas storage even with him having been repeatedly told by both the CRU and Eirgrid he was wrong. You didn`t do yourself any favors either when you didn`t know the difference between carbon neutral emissiond and net zero carbon emissions. Next up it was the sale and registration of ICE vehicles where you somehow came up with the idea that negotiations would be on-going for the next two years before you were shown Timmermans tweet of March showing that for just more of your nonsense and you ducked off to hide.

Rather than now resorting to lying, if you wish to be looked on as having any credibility, you would be better off holding your hand up to your own nonsesense and acknowledging it for what it was.

prunudo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121553804#Comment_121553804

Was same on Christmas eve and Day. God help anyone relying on pt to get around. If they are serious about encouraging people away from private cars they need to revamp the schedule and remove Sunday service as a defacto service for public holidays. Should be the same schedule 7 days a week with extra services during commuting hours.

WishUWereHere

To everyone, both greens and anti greens can we at least wish each other a prosperous 2024.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554842#Comment_121554842

Yet the most of the people on here complaining about the current government trajectory are voting for Sinn Fein who want to speed up the process. Just those people haven't bothered to read the documents released yet.

The only people I see talking about mythical energy is the nuclear posters.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121554949#Comment_121554949

You posted about Sinn Fein, I pointed out Sinn Fein plan was to speed up renewable. Then you went off on some tangent which had nothing to do with Green policies to cover up for the lack of knowledge.

Now you accuse me of lying. As I said already for someone who has posted for years on this thread the lack of knowledge is astounding. Now go off on another rant about the Green party seemingly totally unaware the thread is about green policies and not the Green party

Vote for Sinn Fein, I couldn't care less, but at least read the f**king policies they plan to implement beforehand.

WishUWereHere

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121555156#Comment_121555156

May I place on record, while I’m one of those complaining about the current government, I certainly will not be voting SF.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121555173#Comment_121555173

As I said on other thread, vote for which party you think is best. Left, right, centre etc

I am just pointing out about the amount of people complaining on boards and across social complaining about the Green party seemingly unaware of what the Sinn Fein plan is.

JRant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121555156#Comment_121555156

SF??? You must be having a laugh. I've been following this thread for a long time and SF barely come up. You are correct though, their plan is even crazier but I'm not surprised because they think it's the current popular thing to do.

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121555163#Comment_121555163

You really cannot hrelp yourself can you.

You posted that Sinn Fein were on the same green "trajectory" as the Green Party. Along with telling you I am not nor ever have been a Sinn Fein supporter, as well as with others pointing out how wrong you were with links supplied, you just kept doubling down making yourself look even more foolish on energy security, 2050 net zero carbon emissions, carbon neutral emissions and ICE`s. yet here you are accusing me of a lack of knowledge on subject you clearly had not a clue on.

But you keep rambling away. It`s not making you look any more creditable,and I have better for doing than wasting my time on them.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121555539#Comment_121555539

We have already discussed this multiple times, you do this on every topic, it's repetitive and boring at this stage. Do you have anything new to add on the topic or just want to continue repeating the same nonsense in the hope posters will believe your version?

FYI you didn't understand the difference between carbon neutral and net zero and that's why you keep throwing in it now to cover up for yourself. It's hilarious as I said after years of posting on this thread the lack of knowledge is astounding.

Maybe stick to rambles about Eamonn Ryan.

InAtFullBack

What's all this NET-Zero talk about?

Sounds very much like the rich will buy their right to pollute off the poor.

Either cut out emissions altogether, rich and poor alike or feck off up the garden path.

Sounds very much like the 'purchases of pardon' or 'indulgences' that the catholic Church scam they used to employ.

FFS, are we still adhering to this system albeit recycled?

ps200306

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121555185#Comment_121555185

Not sure where you are getting the idea that people who dislike the Greens are planning to vote SF. I'd have said they both have a similar authoritarian socialist streak. Personally I couldn't bring myself to vote for any current party so I fill my ballot in order of dislike from the bottom up, and see what sort of turd floats to the top. Traditionally I've always filled in SF first (i.e. last preference) but for the first time ever the Greens are threatening to dislodge them from my bottom spot.

Again, presumptuous of you to assume people don't know about the climate change part of Sinn Fein's manifesto. I've read it -- it parrots the Green's very closely along with some additional populist stuff. Speaking of turds, they advocate generating energy from outflows of sewage treatment plants. They somehow imagine it will prevent impact on fish stocks and the environment. They must envisage one helluva backed up sewer pipe.

As for yourself and not knowing about future plans, have you figured out your mistake yet that you posted here? ...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121465502#Comment_121465502

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121555816#Comment_121555816

Easy enough for anyone interested to see who the spoofer posting nonsense is by just scrolling back.

But if you want to keep pulling that chain and flushing any little credibility you may have left on this thread, then you work away. I have better for doing than wasting my time on fantasists.

patnor1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121553560#Comment_121553560

"Decarbonising" energy system according to greens means re-labeling - like burning imported "biomass" and claiming it is a green solution.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121556262#Comment_121556262

This thread is full of people who don't know the Sinn Fein proposal so it's an educated guess. If you have read their policies then you are in the minority.

I posted the link to the document released by a government department which said the grid would be a mix. Which I repeated numerous times because it didn't click with a few people. Not sure what you think is a mistake by linking to a government document?

patnor1011

Why do some people have feeling that world is going to burn or freeze (depending on which side of nonsense they believe) and posting statements like we are doomed if we do not do something right now?

Things like "2023 was the hottest year since records started" should not be used on Irish forums only if you want to rile up people since we had no summer that year anyway.

And pressing for "solutions" to problems we do not have anyway since their plan is not a solution to anything but a science fiction which create headache for generations to come and we can not afford it anyway?

Because they did not realize until now that one need a stable and performing economy to be able to waste money on ideology and dreams. Implementing good reliable and tried technology to transition when and where we can afford it is a way to go. Instead they are trying to portray experimental technology or stuff which was not proven to be able to hold, function and survive at a scale required as something we must do.

No, we do not need to do any of that. We can add on wind and solar where we can and where it may be needed while we keep upgrading our infrastructure and grid when we can afford it without putting unnecessary burden on people and future generations. We are not facing any immediate danger of roasting or freezing to death as it is being time and again shouted in our faces by people who succumbed to ideology. Even if we decided to go back to caves and horses or decided not to do anything and keep using fossil fuels, our influence on global climate or temperature change will be so meaningless we can easily call it zero.

It was summarized nicely by economy minister of one of developing countries where she said that they need and will use cheap energy from fossil fuels to fuel growth and if western world think fossil fuels should not be used they can go ahead and stop if they want to. Basically a finger to whole green ideology from a people greens claim they are trying to save.

People are quite good at adapting and will adapt.