Forget the prices, just hold enough stock to make the schemes!

paddysdream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118081735#Comment_118081735

Could you tell me a better way to do it ?

See absolutely nothing wrong in the article you linked to .Its actually concerned with scutch etc in a cropping situation .Even if its all grass you have what would you suggest to destroy the old sod when reseeding if not roundup ?

Good loser

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118081923#Comment_118081923

Would expect scutch to feature only in a tillage scenario.

Yours is probably creeping bent. Tight grazing, if lime is adequate, will promote ryegrass and clover.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083333#Comment_118083333

You're probably right, I see my bad paddock improving with every grazing.

Glyphosphate is a great aid to reseeding though,

n1st

Maybe this thread is just relevant to part time farmers like myself.

Here's my story:

I don't need to make any money from the farm but it cannot cost me anything.

The schemes are enough for me to keep the hobby going.

I have too much grass. I can manage 20 bullocks easily on 50 acres.

I will not be storing any cattle or making silage or spreading anything that increases grass growth, why would I.

Ill probably reduce the herd to 10 units or so.

Weeds are not really priority for me either, as I said I have too much grass, the birds and insects can have the weeds.

Hard Knocks

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083570#Comment_118083570

I understand your point, but a little money spent each year to maintain Lime, P’s, K’s, fences, weeds, drainage etc is better and easier than having to spend 1000’s in years to come trying to fix things

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083727#Comment_118083727

Apparently there's a breed of farmer out there where that's not important, plenty of fields around here with accidental mixed species.

each to there own I suppose. One thing I've noticed abut that style of farming is tha Ragwort won't tolerate it....nor docks either

Anto_Meath

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118081410#Comment_118081410

True, rented a bit of ground 3 years ago that had a few cattle tipping about on it for the previous 2 - 3 years. First year I was very disappointed with the weight gain of the cattle on it. But the last two years I have kept it grazed tight. Cattle are preforming far better on the fresh grass. But it took the first year clipping it to the clay with cows into mid November to get the scutch out of it.

Dinzee Conlee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083570#Comment_118083570

Not saying what you are doing is wrong - but you might need a bit more of a plan…

regenerative grazing is grand, and it’s supposed to give life back to the soil by trampling grass. But it’s daily moves, small paddocks. You need wire and water in place…

without this, you might need to consider a topper to keep things under control…

50 acres is a nice bit of land. Would you consider only working some of it for a while? Say 10-15 acres, get that sorted as to how you want it and then roll out your system to the other 30 odd acres. Plus any money you from letting the 30 off acres would finance any changes you make on the bit you keep…

yosemitesam1

Lots of lads cant tell the difference between scutch, cocksfoot, Yorkshire fog or bent grasses.

ap was banned from here years ago did basically the system you are talking about op. There was a heap of money in it.

jaginsligo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083570#Comment_118083570

What stock are u planning on getting? R u going to finish them?

jaginsligo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083727#Comment_118083727

Agree, I inherited 28 acres here & hedges & drains haven't been touched in ages (30 years) so it going to take a few euros to sort & I'm eager to get it done before the greens but a stop to any reclaiming or tidying so trying to get it done this winter

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085957#Comment_118085957

I never had it in grazing before, didn't bother differentiating, it's shite grass thats all I know, Two paddocks got ahead of me last year and had to strip graze it last november so it appeared in those paddocks this year, It seems to be gone out of those paddocks now by hard grazing. Very difficult to manage grazing without the option of cutting for silage.... most paddocks here are less than an acre. Not really fair to ask a contractor to cut

farawaygrass

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085925#Comment_118085925

What’s the difference between regenerative farming and a paddock system? Both require frequent moves. Is it a longer rotation length in regenerative there for less fertiliser or letting them into stronger grass?

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118086907#Comment_118086907

Better grass quality in the paddock system 80 DMD compared with low 60s in regenerative farming with a reduction in animal performance

Dinzee Conlee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118086907#Comment_118086907

Ah, I wouldn’t be the best man to answer really…

It is putting them into stronger grass - the idea is they eat a third, trample a third, leave a third. Move every 24 hours is the best. Leave the field rest then for as long as you can, 30-40 days during the summer if possible…

Danzy

The paddocks I put in to mob grazing, known as the course meadow here, which says it all.

I found it grew a lot more grass, lot less poaching, an addition grazing, was handy to have a bank of grass. I could even let them back in now for a few days with a bale, definitely helps ground that is soft last longer, the year was a big help there as well.

Cattle seemed content and after it went in to good grass.

Tried it after giving a bag and a half to the acre of 18 6 12 to a 2 acre paddock, thinking that's 50 quid shook out.

Will add in another bit of mob grazing next year,

It needs to be movement every day or it doesn't work.

Too soon to say how it turns out but the costs of farming are out of tune with the reality of prices.

Who2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087012#Comment_118087012

Is this not going against everything we’ve been taught the last few years. Harvest 2020 was one direction and now we are pushed the opposite. I wonder if Teagasc were closed down completely would it leave everything and everyone to find their own balance. It’s a hard situation for anyone who has pushed hard and try to better the place to just sit back now and go back to where it probably was years ago.

this isn’t a rant at you dinzee just more of a general observation.

wrangler

Once a person is farming a few years they get to figure out what suits their own farm best. I doubt if farmers are that easily led by the nose by teagasc.

You apply what research suits you to your own farm. No one that liked to farm progressively is going to let their farm go back

Dinzee Conlee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087237#Comment_118087237

Yeah, I’d agree with you to an extent Who…

I only started farming a while back, and when I started it was divide into paddocks, 3 days grazing, 3 weeks rest and in you go again…

I don’t know, I just want to avoid fertiliser. But I don’t think you can expect the ground to grow grass and not feed it anything and something not to give…

So, giving the regenerative a half a go. I say half, as it’s maybe not 100% right what I am doing. But I am hoping I am improving the ground some bit in what I am doing…

wrangler

In an average stocking rate, a bag of 0 10 20/acre every year maintains fertility

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087237#Comment_118087237

Stuff like Harvest 2020 is politics, in one ear and out the other is what should be done with it. The architects of such things don't give a fig about people on the ground once the raw materials flow into agribusiness.

Dinzee Conlee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087382#Comment_118087382

Yeah, maybe…

But I don’t think you truly replace what animals take out by shaking a bag of 0-10-20, or any fertiliser…

I could be wrong, I don’t have anything to base that statement in, just the way I think I suppose…

Am not organic, still dose, and use the odd bit of spray. But just my way of thinking of fertiliser…

farawaygrass

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087187#Comment_118087187

I was planning in the future to be moving stock every day. I was at a farm walk though a while back, and there was a dairy guy talking about grass. He said he aims for 36hr breaks, as he thinks if moving every 24 hours that maybe the cows could be running a bit tight, whereas with 36 hours they’d have a bit more in front of them and if we’re running tight you could move them on at 24 hours. But If aiming for 24 hours you’d have to go in again the same day to move them, if you wanted to move them. I’m Explaining that bad 😂

Danzy

I've always moved my bans of Cattle every day, to maximize natural grass growth but I set the place up to make sure it was an easy task, part of the checking.

Nothing wrong with his thinking. Makes sense.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087460#Comment_118087460

Their dung returns most of what is taken out, your grass is going to deteriorate rapidly if you keep walking it into the ground.

We're trying to strip graze a paddock at the moment that's five or six weeks growing and the grass is lodged and rotting rapidly.

I know fromexperience t won't be great next spring and wouldn't like to subject it to the same again for a while.

Dinzee Conlee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087658#Comment_118087658

Maybe…

We’ll give it a whirl for a while and see how we get on.

Ah, my farming is only a hobby of sorts Wrangler as you know, so I can kinda afford to say or do things like this…

If I had to put food on the table from farming, could be a different story… 😉

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087727#Comment_118087727

Every one gets a system that suits their farm after a couple years

Birdnuts

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118086529#Comment_118086529

Have you done the sums on that in terms of spend versus future income from planned use?? The reason I ask is that the future direction of CAP,Carbon tax spend,Agri schemes etc, is likely to see higher income for "nature/public services" etc. from such land than anything conventional farming is likely to offer.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088262#Comment_118088262

That's just conjecture at the moment, it'll probably meet the same fate as taking the sheep off the hills ..... more harm than good

n1st

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085925#Comment_118085925

Yes, that's not a bad idea.