Why is Dublin such a shιtty city?

kravmaga

I think RTE Primetime investigates recent report on Dublin's O'Connell Street is no shock to those of us from Dublin and working in the city.

There are social issues, DCC failure to manage O Connell Street, boarded up and derelict premises, tacky fast food joints with plastic signage, lack of our Dept of Justice to over see the proper Policing of the street by our Gardai.

There are many stakeholders who need to come together , Chamber of commerce, HSA to assist the drug addicts.

There is a massive increase in roma gypsies congregating/ loitering on the street and North Earl street, saw a recent video on social media of roma attacking staff at a casino on O'Connell Street at the junction with Henry Street, not a Garda in sight.

The reason why the Bord Failte tourist office was moved from O' Connell Street to the Southside was the high crime being targetted towards tourists many years back. New tourist office is on Dame Street beside Dublin castle.

The Government have to sort out the mess that is the main thoroughfare of our nations capital city for once and for all.

Lets take back control of our city for once and for all to use without fear of being mugged or attacked.

https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2022/1022/1330784-oconnell-street-dublin-history-problems-challenges/

https://www.theburkean.ie/articles/2021/10/10/how-have-roma-gypsies-colonised-north-inner-city-dublin

https://dublinpeople.com/news/northsideeast/articles/2022/10/27/57443-2/

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119799657#Comment_119799657

Brilliant!

a fine mix of casual bigotry with some teary eyed sentimentality thrown in. A classic combination

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119800449#Comment_119800449

Very few of the foreigners in my neighborhood are making more money than me. Actually they might be, given the generosity of our welfare state. 😂

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119800449#Comment_119800449

Really? I Don't think Jemser would have been too impressed by his self professed descendants cheerleading the importation of foreign labour to enrich landlords and employers at the expense of the natives:

"'The socialists will never understand why I am here; they will all forget that I am an Irishman.'

He was quite problematic.

riclad

I cant tell the junkies from the homeless people ,they dress the same, it seems most shops and cafes supermarkets, are staffed by non nationals, i think our economy depends on non nationals to function. we should remember junkies make up a tiny per percentage of our population , just google los angeles or sanfran homeless crisis ,theres places with a hundred tents in one place.i think there,s a problem in that we have a tiny amount of gardai the no of gardai in the city has not increased to match the increase in population.Since the pandemic theres been lots of shops closed that are now empty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119799511#Comment_119799511

Agree wholeheartedly. Sydney is missing soul, it's quite a cold city in terms of vibrancy. Melbournians on the other hand would be more similar to Dubliners.

I think Dublin is at a crossroads. The anti-social issues and various fueds around the city need to be tackled quickly. The City Council under the leadership of Owen Keegan is having a detrimental effect on the city as they are holding it back in a huge way. There is huge dereliction.

Additionally, In my opinion, the quality of people in the national Government is the poorest it's ever been. It's full to the brim with people who are in it for self interest and who will only consider themselves when proposing or voting on legislation (e.g Robert Troy, there are plenty more of him in there).

Thank God we are successful as we are which is largely down to talented people in the IDA and tax incentives by previous Governments but I feel the tide is turning a bit even for the MNCs/tech companies who are beginning to question the attractiveness of Dublin. If that carpet is pulled it will be a sorry sight.

Us Dubliners need to start getting involved locally and pushing to get the city to where it should be. It's not lost yet but anyone can see it's on the way there.

riclad

What could the council do to make it better ,the government has more power in that it pass,s legislation and decides what money is spent eg what is the priority. Right now there's 100s of empty councils flats maybe they should renovate them make them available to people on the housing list

rather than build 20 new houses at a cost of 300k each

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119805382#Comment_119805382

Around about 500 in DCC alone are empty out of a stock of about 25000.

Allocation of housing is based on your numbers in your areas of of choice governed by your need .Factor in estate management checks , your situation I.e. are you senior citizens, disabled , medical priority etc.

People are getting housed in DCC , properties are being refurbished along with grants being issued.

riclad

At 7 pm every day theres soup kitchens outside the gpo, where the homeless go to get food.My experience junkies hang around certain area,s ,lanes ,back streets , , yes theres sometimes homeless people or beggars on o,connell street , o,connell street is not taken over by junkies .the main problem is dublin needs at least 100 more gardai ,and more in the city centre where tourists tend to go.

unless you see someone spaced out with drugs in their hands how can you tell them from a beggar or a homeless person ?

riclad

There's an article about san Fran today in the daily mail.co.uk/us/

It says the city is being destroyed by homeless people open drug dealing on the streets it sounds alot worse than Dublin

Yurt2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119806556#Comment_119806556

The US has several concurrent drug epidemics, compounded that into practically zero mental health interventions led by the state and a housing affordability crisis in major coastal cities and you get the sh*tshow like you have in San Francisco.

I was stunned when I when I was in Seattle. Home of major global corporations like Amazon, Starbucks, Boeing, Microsoft and abject destitution and human misery alongside it - in one of the wealthiest corners of the globe. Completely f*cked and whatever we can do avoid that in Dublin, we need to do it.

buzzerxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119796638#Comment_119796638

Watch out junkies and beggars of dublin, we have a new Charles Bronson here with a death wish.

dublinman1990

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119806603#Comment_119806603

The good thing about Corporations based here like Amazon & Microsoft is that they are mostly located in the suburbs like Ballycoolin & Leopardstown.

They are in areas that are largely spared from the scenes of frequent drug use that takes place in Dublin City Centre right throughout the year.

Although the halting site near the Clayton Hotel in Leopardstown is an issue that is known to cause trouble in the area.

maninasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119800449#Comment_119800449

Dublin for the Dubliners.

Bit late for that now though.

maninasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119798903#Comment_119798903

When there are hundreds of those addicts and they hassle you everytime you go to work or walk around your neighbourhood you would change your tune. breaking into things, stealing stuff from shops and threatening staff.

Besides the problems are bigger than addicts, theres a lot of youth gangs that roam around fairly randomly and also a risk of violence especially at night in DCC.

GSBellew

It's simple, there is an inane insistence in demanding that people be housed in the area they grew up regardless of their means or ambitions, however this only seems to apply in Dublin.

In the rest of the country (& real world) you live where you can afford to, yes there are downsides like slums or people who can not remain living where they grew up, you move to where you need to.

Is there social housing in central manhattan, because they grew up there? or anywhere else?

maninasia

There is a lot of social housing in Manhattan actually and the island isnt that big. Some of those areas are really rough .

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119807033#Comment_119807033

I worked in Dublin City centre for years, no one ever bothered me.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119807060#Comment_119807060

It's all over central parts of London and Paris anyway. As I was saying in an earlier post it's even in places like Soho and around London Bridge and the quite posh areas.

RickBlaine

Yesterday at 10:30pm, I had to change from the red line LUAS to a bus on O'Connell St. The walk just takes a few minutes. I had a pass a group junkies and one of them followed me, grabbed my shoulder and asked for money. I correctly said I didn't have any and then he threatened to punch me in the face unless I gave him money. I told him to f*ck off which he did. Not pleasant and I wouldn't consider 10:30pm on a Friday evening particularly late either. I know this can happen in any big city but groups of scumbags should not be allowed to loiter / gather / drug deal in main city streets because it just increases the chances that they'll harass random members of the public.

Man Vs ManUre

Because no matter where u are in Dublin, there is guaranteed to be a rat within a 1 meter radius. Fact.

GSBellew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119807062#Comment_119807062

Perhaps they control them better so, because I've pretty similar levels of experiences in both & I'd rather be out for a few drinks in NYC than Dublin.

Do you have the percentage breakdown of social to private in NYC to compare to Dublin out of curiosity ?

maninasia

I don't , but back in the day I was escorted out of projects by the boys in blue, Harlem is in Manhattan.

That reminds me how bad NYC was up to the 90s. Times Square was horribly seedy. Homeless beggars in every station and at every exit. Was very lively and exciting though.

Anyway if NYC can clean itself up Dublin can too!

ALB2022

Two things keep coming up in this thread (Before I go on I grew up in Clontarf which is about 20 mins from O'Connell St and spent much of my 40 odd years going into Dublin City Centre (which in my mind is the area inside the Point, Christ Church, Smithfield and the Garden of Rememberance), primarily for work).

1. The area being referred to as **** in Dublin City Centre (primarily around O'Connell, Parnell to Talbot St), which is commonly referred to as 'Dublin' and 2. The perception as much as the reality of that area.

Firstly, I think people would agree that a similar size area about 500 metres away around Grafton, Dawson, Merrion & Stephens Green would be perceived completely differently.

Second. The reality is if you had to go through video of everybody's experience when going into DCC you'd give up after a short while because you'd get bored waiting for something to happen, especially if you're from Dublin.

Dublin, like most other cities, is like this.

Third. However, unlike most cities, a very small but hugely prominent area (relative to the whole country, not just Dublin) is not being managed effectively, either through lack of willingness, incompetence or something even worse.

So who is benefitting from the lack of management and negative media around the above area mentioned, an area about 1% the size of Phoenix Park or the same size as Trinity College campus?

I'd suggest to start with...a) Casinos, Betting shops, Off licence etc b) Religious orders, Charities, Solicitors etc c) Legal system, top to bottom etc. d) Other criminal enterprises not mentioned previously. That's just a few.

Next. Who is enabling this and do the people of Ireland actually want this area policed and managed effectively or are we content that this small area gives us something to make us feel better, despite the consequences?

That for me is the interesting one because in most normal cities, just to start with, there would be an appropriate number of police deployed on a permanent basis and strictly enforcing measures from begging to loitering to public order to shoplifting to theft of other property. Littering is a thing but that is not high up the list.

Is it worth trying...or are people just happy the way things are?

This is and will spread to other towns and cities as the population grows, probably at a more rapid pace given the drugs that are out there now.

Ireland, despite its many issues, is a reasonably decent place to live and travel around (personally i have never been the victim of crime, which to be fair is a low benchmark). But we're usually 20 years behind the more advanced countries, both the good and the bad that is exported to us.

Man Vs ManUre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119810930#Comment_119810930

Fantastic post.

Quitelife

All cities , towns and villages in Ireland have got rougher and crime ridden in the last 10/20 years it’s not just O Connell street in Dublin . Drugs and the closure of many garda stations has seen people afraid to walk the streets of many towns - travellers/ drug gangs control swathes of rural Ireland .the government don’t give a toss .

Cluedo Monopoly

How Ireland works.

Keegan gets €10,000 pay increase backdated for inflation | Business Post

Keegan gets €10,000 pay increase backdated for inflation

The increase in the chief executive of Dublin City Council’s salary comes as council faces funding shortfall of between €46 million and €50 million.

riclad

i know 2 people who moved out of council flats, it took the council 8 months just to clean the flats ,and make minor repairs, before they moved in a new tenant .at any time there must be 100s of flats empty.those 2 flats were both in very good condition when the tenant moved out

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119807060#Comment_119807060

Who told you that?? The cities don't have a "locals only" clause that other parts of the country have, it's what you can afford. If you're from Malahide and you can't afford to buy a house in Malahide you don't get to live in Malahide because someone from Headford has more money, and fair play to them. Don't forget, in the cities there's no such thing as "blow ins"... they're neighbours, be they from Mayo, Galway, India or China.

When it comes to social housing, there's no difference nationwide, people from Athlone want to live in Athlone - close to family as do people from Galway who want to live in Galway and people from Mayo want to live in Mayo, you don't have a problem with them, but you have a problem with Dublin people wanting to live in Dublin? Sure that's natural, they want family support and familiarity, they want to live in the neighbourhood they grew up in. A family from a small town in Mayo would feel a lot more comfortable living in the estate they grew up in than somewhere miles away.

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119813572#Comment_119813572

Do you know why it takes so long - because local authority housing isn’t funded properly. Successive FF/FG governments have pissed away billions on public/private partnerships instead.

CaptainTeebs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119807060#Comment_119807060

The cheapest former council houses in Dun Laoghaoire Rathdown start at 380k.

In most of North and West Dublin they average from 210 to 270K.

As for private builds, the types that go for 290 to 350 in North and West Dublin start at 500k in DLR. Exact same design, age, condition, only difference being the status of the address.

It's pretty much at a stage where a working class kid leaving school in DLR is best off not working if they want to live where they grew up- a job holding couple will not fall within the social housing threshold, and a couple wanting to buy would need about 120k per year to get a look in on even a basic ex council house.

Do you believe that working class people should entirely lose the right to live in the DLR council area?

In most cases they probably descend from a lineage that lived in the area long before the graduates from Cork and Mayo buying the fancy properties arrived. They laboured on the farms and fished on the trawlers. Why should economics dictate that these people should up sticks and head for Gorey and Arklow as so many have had to do?

riclad

This is happening in many countrys ordinary working class people cant afford to buy in the areas they grew up. The no of houses built is not keeping up with demand. The no of social houses being built is not line with the no of people on the housing list

We have a housing crisis. Our infrastructure is not designed to keep up with the rising population. I can see no solution. When it costs 300k to build one house for the council I cant see them going back to the days when they built large housing estates. I dont think many people have a plan ill do x and then Maybe ill get a house in 7 years time

Thats a very negative way to look at life

CaptainTeebs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815033#Comment_119815033

Circa 2017 it cost about 160k to use a non profit developer to build 3 bed terrace housing on council owned land in Ballymun.

Even with today's material cost rises you could probably do it for 210k.

Government simply doesn't want to which is why you see obscene price tags like 380k per home.

CaptainTeebs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815111#Comment_119815111

Again I reference Sydney, Australia.

Outside the main Central train station it's simply regarded as part of life that street people effectively live at the front doors. Addled from crystal meth, half dressed, throwing glass bottles at passers by and threatening them. Junkies passed out in fast food outlets. Police foot patrols on the street essentially don't exist, yet police routinely do walk throughs of pubs in the evening with sniffer dogs to try catch recreational drug users. They even sit in the bushes in parks and at beachsides trying to get a whiff of weed. Also regularly stand at train barriers on a Friday/ Saturday night trying to catch people hitting the town with recreational drugs on them, but leave the absolute nutters outside untouched. But the type of Garda walking or cycling about patrols you see 10 of every time you go into town here do not exist.

Funny thing is nobody really cares. The anti social state of Sydney isn't any sort of prominent political issue. Australian TV is too dumbed down to have any sort of version of Prime Time, their current affairs shows night after night after night focus on three issues- dodgy tradesmen, property scams and "hoons" (boy racers, basically)

I can't imagine anything remotely resembling it being tolerated here. I was in town yesterday and stopped counting once I'd spotted ten Gardai in two hours between Henry, OC Talbot and Parnell St. This idea that Dublin city centre is underpoliced is an absolute myth, blown to shreds by the 3000 plus arrests made in the last year.

gameoverdude

Want to chat about homeless. Go to San Francisco. They're probably the most unenlightened citizens I've ever met(not the homeless).

Preachy feckers.

ALB2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815323#Comment_119815323

Agree with most of what you're saying but can't agree that areas are sufficiently policed.

When you take the 450 people arrested in DCC around St Patricks day (and add the other days when the DCC population increases significantly) out of that figure, which isn't exactly mind blowing anyway, then 4 or 5 arrests per day suggests DCC has either a low crime rate (relatively speaking), which is completely at odds with the perception it's a 'no go' area, or its not being policed and managed appropriately.

Probably somewhere in between, leaning heavily towards a lack of management in areas, with the revolving door system enabling the rince and repeat approach.

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815501#Comment_119815501

Is there actually a perception that the city centre is a “no go area”? If there is that perception is completely at odds with reality. Dublin is packed with tourists, locals and people commuting for work everyday.

CaptainTeebs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815501#Comment_119815501

I ask again- where are the statistics that show Dublin city centre is a no go area?

The stats that show it has got worse than it was 10, 20, 30 years ago?

I remember my ma wouldn't leave her handbag on the front seat while driving in the 90s, as there was a concern (real or imagined, who knows now) that junkies were regularly smashing passenger windows with a hammer if they spotted a bag on the seat at red lights.

Remember every Burger King had blue lights in the jacks to deter junkies from shooting up in there? (the blue lights made it harder to see your veins for injecting).

There's no public toilets any more, they were all shut in the 80s and 90s because of the drug abuse and general anti social behavior emminating from them.

While what I'm about to say is city/ countrywide rather than the OCS area itself, our national/ city rates of car theft, gangland murder, murder in general, femicide in particular, teen heroin use, and probably a few other headline crimes, have all fallen off a cliff since the 90s into 2000s decades. Never mind per 100,000, the actual numerical number of offences has declined since then despite us having a 50% population rise since 1996. A significant cohort of the people causing trouble on OCS are well into their forties, as they are the people that became hooked on heroin as teenagers in the 90s. With few people born after say 1983 being added to their ranks, and many of the original addict generation from the early 80s having been wiped out by AIDS and other injecting related illnesses, logically there should today be less junkies wandering the streets of Dublin than there was in 2010, or 2000, or 1995.

It seems strange to me that as society has generally become safer the OCS area has become worse than it ever was.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815677#Comment_119815677

I'm getting "this used to be fields" feeling.

Dublin isn't the best city in the world, but people are concentrating on a small part.

I've rarely had hassle. People asking for change or a smoke doesn't register as hassle. 99.999% of the time if they keep annoying you a simple "feck off" does the trick.

Jaysus.

CaptainTeebs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815501#Comment_119815501

There are Gardai permanently outside GPO from early morning to dusk.

There are Gardai constantly on bike and foot throughout the rest of Temple Bar, Henry, Grafton.

Cars on constant patrol.

As said I spotted at least 10 yesterday in pairs, so five different patrols.

How much more do people think is feasible? Every third person being a guard?

CaptainTeebs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815728#Comment_119815728

This.

Look, they can and are absolute gobdaws to security and general shop staff, but the chances of a random member of the public having a violent or even particularly intimidating interaction with one of these people on the middle of OCS is staggeringly low. They really do tend to keep their screaming and physicality reserved to members of their own subculture over who owes who 1 euro (yes, a single euro) or who dipped whose hand in whose pocket when they were passed out with goodies on them.

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815728#Comment_119815728

Agree completely

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815759#Comment_119815759

I'd give you a million thanks solely for using the word "gobdaws".

Haven't heard it in ages!

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815784#Comment_119815784

An "incident" happened to me outside the lomard whilst having a smoke (having a real toastie) and the person threatened to get his mates after me because I wouldn't give him one.

Guess what, it was bollox. Surprise, surprise.

Tourists from NYC, Paris, Barcelona...are so not going to be used to this. Should be provided with plastic bubbles on entry. How will they ever survive dublin. Shocking!

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815323#Comment_119815323

The reality is, that without strong policing, any public transport area is flypaper for antisocial types, O'Connell street, Amiens Street, all the same. You have very little gardai presence in the north inner city given the state of it, other than the odd one standing at the GPO like a decorative gome and about as much use.

I bumped into a friend on the quays where there are queues for private buses, within 2 minutes of chatting some foreign johnny manifesting behaviour that was far from normative had shambled up looking for a light, a few minutes later he had made an inept attempt to lift a womans backpack before shambling off

What this goon was doing in Ireland in anyones guess, no doubt on the tax payers tit in some form, but there you are, all within a 10 minute window.

One is reminded of when our local shopping centre was blessed with a visit from Mary Robinson back in the 90s, before her eminence showed up, the gardai swept through the place and left the usual tide of junkies were left in no doubt that their presence was not wanted that day. When they tried to drift back, they were unceremoniously shifted on, lest Mary get the wrong impression

The next day it was business as usual, it would have taken two gardai about 10 minutes to do that sweep a few times every day, they just werent arsed.

ALB2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815726#Comment_119815726

Just to clarify I'm referring to the posts in this and many other threads that would have you believe DCC is some sort of no go area, which of course is laughable.

As I posted previously, watch a video of the hundreds of thousands of people going about their business in DCC and you'll get very bored very quickly.

The other point I was making is about one particularly promiment area that is managed poorly, and the lack of motivation, incomptence or something else to deal with that.

ALB2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815733#Comment_119815733

Let's agree to disagree. I think there is a lack of policing around the Parnell, O'Connell St and Talbot areas particularly, and you think there is not.

You have given one example of your walk around, which is fair enough, and I can give another example of a video on social media last week that showed police failing to attend a public order issue on O'Connell St. It was filmed for 2 minutes in full view of a crowd that had gathered. That's just one example of why I think the area needs to be policed and managed better. I'm just not confident there are ever Garda in the right place at the right time for some reason, that's just my experience

...actually the example i gave may be the reason for your example? It was the same for a few days after Prime Time did their thing.

YabaDabaDooley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119797610#Comment_119797610

A lot of the addicts are missing a limb so you could say living close to the city centre really has cost them an arm and a leg.

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815822#Comment_119815822

They probably won’t even order a toastie. Too busy looking for tapas

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815996#Comment_119815996

Reported.