Is Ireland Racist?

The Quintessence Model

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118289922#Comment_118289922

I doubt the poster does, but culture is next to impossible to talk about without generalising, given culture itself refers to a number of people. As such, the posters points are not racist.

manonboard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118289799#Comment_118289799

Unless you actually think this person is a racist who believes ALL people of a culture are a problem.

Just do what the rest of us do.. assume he is talking in general terms about a group of people, and assume he is talking about the people from that group that cause the problems he is referring to.

We also assume that he is completely ok with the people of any group that are NOT causing issues and problems. He likely doesn't care if someone is a traveler who is nice to their neighbors, takes care of their kids, and gets along well with the local settled community they interact with.

This is true for nearly every person. Its pretty extreme to meet a person who has a problem with a person of any culture, creed or race that gets along well with others and doesn't cause grief through application of their culture.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291020#Comment_118291020

Talking about a group of people, be they the same race, culture, whatever, as if they are one huge blob, is talking about them like they all create the same problems.

We don't assume any of the things that you state, because there is no reason to assume them.

If someone states 'travellers are X,Y or Z' then that's what I take them to mean, because that is what they say.

completedit

The worst type of racism(and xenephobia) that I see is the type of racism which is subtle. I was watching a Liverpool game recently and my mate's dad commented 'he has no brain that fella' which not overtly racist definitely has racist undertones.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291147#Comment_118291147

Can you really not see how speaking about a 'culture' in a derogatory way, is projecting a negative stereotype on all people from that particular group without any evidence that it is reasonable to ascribe it to particular individuals?

Trying to pass this off as an acceptable cultural stereotype to apply to people is both ignorant and hurtful.

Do you think absolutely all travelers behave in a negative way? If not, do you think it is fair to infer that they do? How do you think this feels like to a young traveler who is decent and morally upstanding?

Your post actually supports the original point that was made.

WrenBoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291174#Comment_118291174

Please explain how this is even remotely within an asses roar of racism ?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291198#Comment_118291198

Can you really not see how speaking about a 'culture' in a derogatory way, is projecting a negative stereotype on all people from that particular group without any evidence that it is reasonable to ascribe it to particular individuals?

There is no shortage of evidence to show the negatives of the Traveller culture in terms of abuse applied to the members of that community. Have a look at research on prostitution, domestic abuse, drug abuse, etc within the traveller community, and then, tell me that it's not related to their culture. The interesting thing is that while I blame the culture for this, and you assume that I am wrong, then you must be blaming Travellers themselves for the amount of abuse that's going on... no?

As for projecting a negative stereotype, what stereotypes about travellers did I state in any of my posts here?

Do you think absolutely all travelers behave in a negative way? If not, do you think it is fair to infer that they do? How do you think this feels like to a young traveler who is decent and morally upstanding?

Um... please point out where I said anything about the behavior of travellers, or that I believe that all travellers are included in this?

Your post actually supports the original point that was made.

Only if someone accepts the changed narrative based on your interjections. You've assigned claims to me that weren't made.

The Quintessence Model

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291128#Comment_118291128

How can one talk about culture, without talking about those that live within that culture as 'one huge blob'? Unless you want every single post prefaced with 'I know it's not everyone but..' As the poster above explained, usually one assumes that the poster is not geealising about literally everyone down to the last individual.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291198#Comment_118291198

Can never quite tell if posters believe they are 'smart' giving this type of dog whistle or are genuinely deluded and think that by targeting their perspective of the 'culture' of a minority group with broad sweeping derogatory statements it somehow removes the inherent racism.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291345#Comment_118291345

Those posters believe their perspective is the correct one. No matter what. In their (presumably) white Irish middle class minds, everybody else is inferior.

Imagine certain cultures being happy with their life, and being told that they deserve to have their culture die out, because it doesn't conform with some middle aged man's idea of what society should be.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291369#Comment_118291369

Do you not think anything you said in your post there could be racist?

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291295#Comment_118291295

There is no shortage of evidence to show the negatives of the Traveller culture in terms of abuse applied to the members of that community. Have a look at research on prostitution, domestic abuse, drug abuse, etc within the traveller community, and then, tell me that it's not related to their culture. The interesting thing is that while I blame the culture for this, and you assume that I am wrong, then you must be blaming Travellers themselves for the amount of abuse that's going on... no?

As for projecting a negative stereotype, what stereotypes about travellers did I state in any of my posts here?

Um... please point out where I said anything about the behavior of travellers, or that I believe that all travellers are included in this?

Literally within the same post ffs.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291393#Comment_118291393

No, unless your suggesting that all posters on boards are white middle aged, middle classed men and are all part of the same race.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291419#Comment_118291419

Fair enough. Just wondering why you presumed the posters were white, middle aged, middle class men? Seems an odd assumption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291398#Comment_118291398

Okay. I understand now. Culture and the people themselves, are one and the same to you.

So any criticism of that culture is criticism of the entire population within that culture.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291437#Comment_118291437

Oh not all posters! Not at all.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291295#Comment_118291295

'The racism directed towards Travellers exists because their behavior is offensive to many Irish people'

Here's where you said something about the behaviour of travellers. 'themselves'

Rothko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118289225#Comment_118289225

Don't take the bait

briany

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrYwCwtX0JM

The Quintessence Model

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291369#Comment_118291369

You are just engaging in your usual mis-characterisations and projections with this post.

tdf7187

Yes, Ireland is racist against the native white working and lower middle class.

completedit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291228#Comment_118291228

It was about Sadio Mane. And tbf you might be right but something in my mate's dad tone of voice just felt off to me, I don't think he'd have said the same thing about a white English player.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291439#Comment_118291439

So you'd have no issue with an English person blaming 'Irish culture' for the violence in the north during the Troubles or American's blaming 'Irish culture' for the high crime rates of Irish immigrants when they fled Ireland during the famine.

It is completely obvious what people who use 'culture' when attacking a minority group are getting at.

landofthetree

Up to around 2010 on Swedish television they would refer to black people using the N word. Also single mothers who are Muslim still have their kids taken into care in Nordic countries.

https://researchingreform.net/2021/01/27/european-court-of-human-rights-hears-forced-adoption-case/

Ireland is one of the least racist countries in Europe and the world.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291991#Comment_118291991

Harry Maguire

completedit

I have heard it said about James McClean and Aaron Connolly but there was just an undertone of racism to his comment. I might be wrong or right but just picked up on it.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118291991#Comment_118291991

Obviously I can't talk about this specific case but there is a lot of research done about this in the US regarding terms that are used to describe players depending on their race.

It flows through media and then to the public. In one study, even when participants were told that two players were intelligent, they rated the picture of the white player as being more intelligent.

thefallingman

Racism is endemic in Irish society, look at some posters trying to justify blatant racist comments, maybe they don’t realise I don’t know I didn’t see covert racism till it was pointed out to me by a friend in work who was treated just a bit different a bit like what completedit is saying

Fred Astaire

Racism is 'endemic' in Irish society because of a thread on boards.ie which may or may not have racist comments in it - but you would only know if you spoke to a certain person who would inform you about 'covert' racism. Got it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118292086#Comment_118292086

Honestly, no I wouldn't have any issue with those comparisons.... as they are negatives within the culture itself. Doesn't mean that all Irish people are that way. This is the problem with your (and others logic)... at no point did I attempt to describe all travellers a certain way. I spoke about the culture, linking it to the problems within their community. And yet, there have been three or four posters jumping at the chance to confuse the issue so that they can shout their outrage.

As for being obvious, I probably care more about helping that minority group than you do. I'd like to tackle the core problem as to the range of negatives within that community, whereas you would like to externalise the problems, enabling them to continue the negative practices of domestic violence, or youth prostitution. Yeah. It's more important that we protect the culture, and not discuss the negatives unless they're someone elses' fault. Anything else is obviously racism.