Ashling Murphy RIP - a discussion *please read the OP before posting*

jackboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480621#Comment_118480621

That is a bit naive. You have no idea what any of those men would be like when not around you and other females that you know. So many men have completely different personalities when they are away from the women that know them.

Barrita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480622#Comment_118480622

Fair point Walshb. Youre dead right.

titan18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480659#Comment_118480659

Tbf that's not just a male thing. I know plenty of women who have similar groups and similar talk happens in them. I've a work colleague who regularly says lots of filthy things to us and had even bought a pair of extra small underwear as a secret santa present for one guy in the team. I'm sure any male bar staff can give stories of harassment by drunk women much like any female bar staff can. Anyone who thinks only men have these "banter" groups to or talk like that is really mistaken.

I do think it's beside the point anyway, this is about one tragedy and one psychopath who will hopefully be caught. It shouldn't be a gender thing.

sonic85

We need to build a new prison and start putting violent offenders away for very long stretches. Change the definition of a life sentence to actual life and throw away the key for perpetrators of offences like this. All the rubbish surrounding Ashlings death is all distraction from the biggest issues at hand which are - the amount of offenders walking the streets with multiple convictions, prison places or the lack of them and the soft touch judiciary who repeatedly hand out joke sentences to people who should not be allowed to walk among ordinary decent citizens.

We're currently building a children's hospital that is costing obscene money that if it was built to cost would free up over a billion euro. That would go a long way towards building a prison.

Ashlings death is not a watershed moment - there were people getting violently murdered before this and there will be people violently murdered after this. There is no magic solution to stamp out traits that have existed for as long as humans have roamed this earth - the only thing we can do is catch these scum and make sure they never hurt another person.

R.I.P to Ashling.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480674#Comment_118480674

Who said women should feel grateful for it? Which thread?

iamwhoiam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480621#Comment_118480621

Same here . I am married to a man who wouldn’t dream of being ok with it . Nor would my son or brother or men in my family . Some men would yes by no means all men .

anewme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480543#Comment_118480543

There's nothing harmless or innocent about whistling or shouting comments at a woman when she is going about her business.

On a thread where women are discussing why they dont feel safe or comfortable, and street harassment being part of that, there is a man telling us he'd be fooking chuffed.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480729#Comment_118480729

It’s a wolf whistle for chrissake..

you do realize that vast majority men who have wolf whistled aren’t in any way trying to scare or intimidate. And women know this too…

you come across as someone who wants to outlaw everything that happens between men and women..

iamwhoiam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480740#Comment_118480740

Have some respect . If a woman tells you she doesn’t like it then respect that

Barrita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480729#Comment_118480729

I had group of Sheilas grab my flute in bad bobs in temple bar one evening.

Should have been straight down to store street Garda Station by your reckoning.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480475#Comment_118480475

So you want world peace?

It’s never gonna happen.

thefallingman

The people committing these crimes are absolute scumbags, the lowest of the low, the worst of society,Can we ever change their behaviour, I wish we could and hope we can but I’m not confident

NewbridgeIR

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480570#Comment_118480570

I agree with that. Changing the crappy *banter* culture is important and may go some way into making women feel safer.

It's always been different for women. When I was younger, my parents were never concerned about me walking home alone after a night out. But they'd never want my younger sister to come home on her own and would always ensure that she was collected / had money for taxi etc.

There have been a lot of articles in recent days about the need for men to step up. I can understand that. But fixing the judicial process and having proper & consistent sentencing for violent crime is also important. But I don't see any of those articles focusing on this point - is it because the people writing them traditionally have more left wing views and don't want to be seen to being tough on certain types of crime?

Beasty

I'm a male in my 60s. There have been times in my life when I have taken care in certain areas, particularly late at night. However I have never felt scared that someone might mug me or worse.

I have a petite 18yo daughter. I have another aged 21 and one aged 23. The older two are a little more wiser to the world than the younger one. However I am concerned for them all, moreso the youngest one. I'm also a mathematician. I understand the stats and the likelihood that any of my daughters get caught up in any violent incident is low. However when we hear stories like what happened to Ashling I wonder how my daughters must feel. Women are at a natural disadvantage to men given typical average size and strength. Women should be able to walk along streets at any time of day or night without fear. The vast, vast majority of men, I am sure, think in a similar fashion. Maybe it is up to us to be more proactive in calling out unacceptable behaviour towards women. Making the streets feel safer.

How do we do that without ourselves fearing someone might misinterpret our intent? I'm not sure, but I think that as a society we should be on more of a lookout to help when we can. I would massively appreciate any man stepping in if any of my daughters, or indeed my wife, needed someone to stand by their side if someone is being aggressive or intimidating towards them

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480756#Comment_118480756

What?

I disagreed with her view. And now you’re accusing me of disrespect?

Am I not allowed to disagree?

if she finds it unacceptable, that’s fine….

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480674#Comment_118480674

Yes it is some men. Some men disrespect women and abuse and harass and rape and murder.

It happened before Ashling's life was taken from her and it will continue to happen. I have no solutions for the dark side of humanity. Talking about it is helpful for our understanding but as long as there are humans there will be awful crimes.

Fred Cryton

My concern is we have prominent figures pitting half the population against the other on the back of a woman's death, trying to shoehorn a woke political agenda into a family's tragedy. This is a crime problem, full stop. It should not be used as an excuse to go off on 50% of the population and use it to drive your political agenda (think gender quotas etc, a complete non sequitur to this tragedy).

There is also a patronising "we need to educate men" coming from certain prominent female columnists. I don't think education is going to stop a man mentally disturbed enough to kill a random stranger for no reason. They also conveniently ignore the cases where men kill other men, which is most murder cases.

Here's the bottom line. Want to reduce the chance of this happening in the future? Then vote for law and order political parties who are tough on crime and who want mandatory minimum sentences. Problem we have is many of those mourning this woman are voting for the opposite.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480770#Comment_118480770

No.

what they’re saying is, if women say they don’t like it, then don’t do it.

it doesn’t matter if you think whistling at a woman is okay. It doesn’t matter what you think about it at all, not being a woman, when women, largely, do not like it.

do you understand now?

Barrita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480769#Comment_118480769

All valid points Beasty. I just don't think they have anything to do with how this poor girl met her untimely demise.

People are using this event as a horse to hitch their wagon full of anti men gripes to.

thefallingman

Well said beasty that sums up my opinion as a father to two girls

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480795#Comment_118480795

She lost her life because someone took it.

The reasons why will eventually be uncovered, perhaps there’s no reason, perhaps this was someone who knew her and had a problem, the fact is we just don’t know yet.

What you can be almost sure of is this isn’t down to men v women, this is a sick, twisted individual who took the life of a young woman for whatever reason.

A discussion regarding men vs women is not necessary because it’s not about that.

I was walking down the street a few weeks ago in Dublin city centre. The path was quiet but plenty of traffic. I was in a world of my own so gave a little jump when I realised a person was walking right behind me. It was a man and God's love him but he was so apologetic and rushed on ahead of me.

I wondered after if it was a woman would she be apologetic? I doubt it. Because there was no need. It's ok to walk behind me. You have a right to the path the same as I do. I don't expect you to cross the street or give me a wide berth. I don't fear you because you are a man.

Brussels Sprout

There was a vigil/protest held today for Ashling Murphy in Limerick which was held on Bedford row.

In response, a group held a "men's rosary" on the very same street. Apparently they usually hold these on Thomas street but today they decided to also hold it on Bedford row at the same time as the vigil for Ashling Murphy.

https://twitter.com/ConorSheehan93/status/1482414083756462085

https://twitter.com/ConorSheehan93/status/1482414422840979456

https://twitter.com/ConorSheehan93/status/1482414774776385545

https://twitter.com/BocktheRobber/status/1482401591873478661

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480794#Comment_118480794

Hold on..

If a woman doesn’t like it or accept it or thinks it needs criminalising, fine..that is her right.

I am saying not all women consider it to be that big a deal. And pretty much all women I bet would think that the men that do it are not try get to hurt them, scare them or intimidate them..

was the poster speaking for all women?

Barrita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480767#Comment_118480767

We could eradicate all that poor male behaviour. Ultimately this poor would still have been murdered.

This is about a murderous psychopath, not some dunderhead commenting on "Sarah from accounts" chest at the water cooler.

billyhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480570#Comment_118480570

I think the wide and free availability of pornography is a problem. Women are treated as objects in porn and it's bound to have an effect on some people where they look down and degenerate women.

Gusser09

Wolf whistling, degrading comments, staring at a woman lads locker room banter etc whilst wrong and crass are not the same as murder or rape and there is no relationship between them.

Rape and murder are committed by vile scum.

We seriously need to seperate mysoginistic behaviour from murder and rape. Its a dangerous path we will end up going down otherwise.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480831#Comment_118480831

It doesn’t matter what the intentions are or are perceived to be. it’s childish, weird and creepy to whistle at women or pass comments on them.

why would anyone think that a good way to communicate with a woman is whistle at them as if we haven’t spend centuries creating far superior methods of communication..

such as words?

I keep reading "If you've never..." then you're a man. Yet every guy I know will say they all apply to him. Cross the road to avoid someone? Yep. Keys between fingers? Absolutely. Changed route? Absolutely.

I've been lucky, I've been jumped half a dozen times off the top of my head, luckily without serious injury. I've had mates with teeth knocked out and a couple who woke up in hospital. I'm not sure what it is that I'm meant to do or any of my mates are meant to do about scumbags being scum.

There's no punishment for violence in this country until the outcome goes the wrong way. I've seen someone walk free from court after stamping on someone's head. Hell, I went up to some Gardai to say "There's a big fight down the street there" (within view) and they shrugged, never got on the radio and instead followed me for 10 minutes.

We need proper punishment for violence, proper facilities to house and imprison dangerous people and some kind of enforcement. But it'll never happen, agreeing with people lighting candles and riding that wave is the easy political move.

This is an absolute tragedy and my thoughts are with Ashling's family, I can't begin to imagine or pretend to understand what they're going through. RIP.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480835#Comment_118480835

Yes. But surely this is a woman’s issue? Men hardly force them into porn

this issue is a human issue that men and women are responsible for..