Amnesty scheme for undocumented migrants in Ireland

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586282#Comment_118586282

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586282#Comment_118586282

Don't make conclusions based on the poor attempt of Renua

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586282#Comment_118586282

Creighton was too associated with a catholic right wing ethos with their anti abortion stance.

Renua by extension then is linked.

People are hugely disillusioned with the old mainstream political parties and a lot of people have latched onto sinn fein.

The thing a lot of the sinn fein voters need to cop on is they don't represent them as workers especially if they are low paid, they actually represent non workers more so.

And the biggest chunk of non workers that sinn fein represent or want to represent are the freeloading immigrants they want to bring to this country.

When people find how just exactly what sinn fein represent and what they can actually do they will look for an another alternative.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586848#Comment_118586848

I've always found that Sinn Féin only represent themselves and their RA buddies

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586282#Comment_118586282

As you well know, yet you're pretending not to, it's very hard for any sort of new party to rise no matter how high the demand for a new party is, nearly every nation in the world is proof of that. In the UK, there's a great desire for an alternative to Labour or the Cons, but it hasn't happened. In America there's a big demand for alternatives to Reps or Dems, but it hasn't happened. Being the established parties is somewhat like having a market monopoly, and monopolies are hard to break no matter how much demand there is.

TomTomTim

Just seen this

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/four-out-of-five-applications-by-adults-for-a-first-irish-passport-are-being-made-from-outside-the-state-41315171.html

It's truly mad what's happening to "our" country. We're nothing more than a globalist experiment, that's heading nowhere good.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586965#Comment_118586965

How? Irish citizens are applying for Irish passports

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586887#Comment_118586887

There was no demand for them, that's why it was a spectacular failure. It's very basic maths.

If you have tangible evidence to the contrary by all means fire it up and I'll gladly take a look.

As for the UK and an alternative to Labour or the Conservatives, that's exactly what the SNP did.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586463#Comment_118586463

What are you basing your "conclusions" on?

I just gave you a recent example. What have you for me?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586887#Comment_118586887

As you rightly pointed out, in instances where first-past-the-post voting is used, the system invariably becomes dominated by 2 parties.

The opposite is the case where there is proportional representation which by its design, encourages voting across a spread of candidates and parties

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586848#Comment_118586848

All par for the course, I don't know any party, budding or otherwise that mimics your fictional wish-list.

Personally I don't think an Anti Immigration, Anti Trans party would be taken seriously here.

The reality is the vast majority of people don't give a flying fúck about either issue.

titan18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587117#Comment_118587117

I mean we've got a housing crisis. It won't take much extra for a party to spin that and anti immigration together and run on an Irish First policy.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586965#Comment_118586965

You do know that Irish citizens can be born outside of Ireland and are therefore quite entitled to apply for Irish passports?

Shao Kahn

This country is going to be royally screwed a few decades from now! It's gonna be ugly.

Self inflicted too, we're just shooting ourselves in the foot as a nation with brain dead decision making. That's the saddest part about it. :(

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587154#Comment_118587154

We have had some sort of housing crisis continually for 3 decades and beyond.

Would have happened by now.

But in reality if some absolute lunatic came out and said he could cure the housing crisis by implementing X immigration policy, he would be roundly ignored.

titan18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587355#Comment_118587355

Way I'd see is much like an individual or family has to live within their means, so does a country, and we're not doing that.

Creaking health service, delays in most aspects of the public sector, not enough guards to keep the peace, housing crisis etc so adding more people on to that seems stupid.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587154#Comment_118587154

Yeah but realistically we already have that with the National Party and they are going nowhere.

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587355#Comment_118587355

If the birth rate is on par with replacement where is all the extra people coming from. And 3 decades your talking out through your arse now. There was an abundant of houses after the boom.. couldn't even sell them. Even in dublin. Even apartments in the city centre ya couldn't shift

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587454#Comment_118587454

Creaking health service - Its been "creaking" since the foundation of the state and always be. Its why the position of Minister for Health is a poisoned chalice. Regardless of how much money you pour into health it will never be good enough, such is the nature of the beast

delays in most aspects of the public sector - Same here again. If you want to pay 80% tax rates to get a public service that sorts everything out within a 24-48 hr period you can, but nobody will pay that so we get what we pay for

not enough guards to keep the peace - I always find this one amusing. Ireland is, by a long way, one of the safest countries in the world. Its not perfect, no country is, but again, if you want 5,000 Garda station, patrols on every street, etc etc, you'll have to pay more for it

Housing crisis - When has there not been a housing crisis? Either too many, not enough, too expensive, negative equity, crap builds, ghost estates and so on. There's always been some issue with housing in Ireland for as long as I've been alive. I don't see that changing regardless of this scheme

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587485#Comment_118587485

Sure yeah, bulldozing ghost estates and 50% negative equity is exactly how functioning housing markets operate.

Arsé you say. Indeed. 🙄

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587454#Comment_118587454

Indeed, but some nutter blaming all ills on immigrants isn't going to fix any of that, is he?

titan18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587703#Comment_118587703

No, but it'd be handy to not keep on bringing more people in when we don't have the resources for the existing people in the country.

Its like having thousands of credit card debt and still thinking you should buy stuff.

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587117#Comment_118587117

My mention of the trans rights is the reference to modern absolute lunacy we have now reached where kids in school can decide what bloody gender they are by the day and teachers can be sanctioned if they don't play along with the farce.

And no only an idiot would base a party on those two things.

There is a lot more like our modern welfare careerist state where some demand forever homes where they desire whilst ordinary workers can fook off to where they might be able to afford a home with a lifelong mortgage.

But more and more people throughout the Western world are getting sick and tired of the shyte being pushed by most politicians, the mainstream media, NGOs sponging off taxpayers, celebrities.

But there is without doubt a major recession on the way.

The good old quantitative easing splurg over the last decade or more to prevent a depression post the financial crash has only created an even wider gap between the ones at the top and the rest of the people.

Yeah it prevented meltdown, gave some growth, but a lot of it has been to create shyte jobs like zero hour contract jobs for a lot of people at the bottom.

Wait until the real effects of the great automation dreams of the likes of the multinationals and silicon valley which will be nightmares for people at the bottom.

And when people get pi**ed all bets are off.

Occupy Wall St, Trump, Brexit, Yellow Vests, the rise of right wing parties in almost every single European country, bar of course our own, have been warnings.

But yet the idiots continue to ignore them, lambast the people as idiots, arrogantly dismissing them as fools.

30 years back how many right wing politicians were being elected in European countries ?

People like Jean Maria Le Pen were being laughed at, now his daughter is scaring the baysus out of the President that he is talking tough on immigration.

Ah but sure we can't ever go right wing or ever have a jihadist attack.

I seem to remember some saying we could never have a property crash either.

jmayo

The biggest thing I am noticing from the proponents of the increased immigration particularly the economic migrants/refugees/asylumm seeker kind is that they continously dismiss things like effects on services, affects on housing, effects on healthcare/education, etc.

They counter that our health service was always a mess, that there were always housing issues without any increase in population due to immigrants, that low skilled non skilled immigrants/asylum seekers have no effects on housing lists, etc.

It makes one think the proponents of low skilled/non skilled immigration don't live in the Ireland where you have to live at home with your parents because you can't afford anywhere, where you can't afford to get proper healthcare because you are not on a medical card and can't afford private health insurance, where you are on a medical card but have faced years on waiting lists, where owning a home is a pipe dream and when you do get one it is nowhere near where you grew up.

It is almost like the proponents never will face the side effects of all these immigrants they want.

Ah but they will get some nice new food and maybe some cheap labour 🙄

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588978#Comment_118588978

Good post raising some very valid issues.

One thing I’ve also noticed about proponents of mass immigration is that many of them have limited stake in the future. I have two young kids, with a third on the way. Frankly, I’m concerned that my children will come of age in a country that is virtually unrecognizable.

On a more practical level, I’m worried that the quality of their education will be impacted. We live in a highly diverse part of West Dublin. My eldest daughter is now in primary school. About one third of her class require additional English language support, which obviously impedes progress.

We’re tolerating this right now, because she is so young; we are reading to her and teaching her maths and Irish at home to ensure she stays ahead of the curve. We’re also actively looking for a new house in another area, closer to my wife’s family. There is simply no way I would countenance remaining in this situation in the long term.

On a human level, I often bring my daughter to school when working from home. Some of the immigrant mothers, who scarcely speak English, are lovely to my daughter and make a big fuss of her, mostly because she has bright blonde hair and they’re always saying how beautiful she is. It’s nice to hear as a parent, but unfortunately it doesn’t cut the mustard when considering the caliber of education on offer.

It’s very easy to be dismissive of changing demographics when you’re not impacted by it. Many parents are and I’m personally aware of families in my area who actively avoid a local primary school, instead choosing to send their kids to less ‘diverse’ schools in commuter towns. Not a particularly healthy development for society, no matter what way you look at it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588944#Comment_118588944

What an entertaining post.

Truly, I chuckled more than once

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588944#Comment_118588944

You are scaring yourself needlessly.

We'll be grand. 👍️

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589616#Comment_118589616

Will we? TBH even without the issue of immigration, I'm not so sure that Ireland, and perhaps more importantly, Irish people will be grand. This is becoming a damn expensive country to live in, and for what? Failing services, trouble for most young people in getting housing, even rental accommodation, the costs of just about everything are back to Celtic tiger times, and that's without the economy booming similar to those times. Even when you look at the rising costs, and find things like the cost of food which have decreased, on average, but when compared with ten years ago, the cost increase is impressive. [And before pointing to how successful the economy is, perhaps take a look at the debt built up by both companies and institutions over the years... in addition to the debt crunch in the US with relates to the multinationals here in Ireland... It was a serious problem before covid came along.. and it's worse now. We're on very thin ice]

People are concerned with immigration because it, generally, does add to the demands on the services, and it's questionable how much return comes from migrants, because many of them will be sending a fair chunk of the income abroad. Look at the reports from Western Union, and the concerns the Irish government had a few years back, about the amounts leaving Ireland.. It's a sizable amount. Then, there's the aspect that many migrants will have families which are larger than the Irish norm, and have greater demands on those services provided by the State to all people living here.

Oh, we'll muddle through, but how many Irish people will suffer as a result? That's the question.. and what are the long term consequences of what is done now? I've seen little to no interest in doing projections on the Irish economy, society, and how immigration factors in, especially with consideration of the patters of results that have occurred in other European nations. Will we have the violence that has manifested in Sweden? Will we have the social fraud that happened in Denmark? Will we have the disconnect from 2nd/3rd gen descendants of migrants, as has happened elsewhere which has contributed to social unrest and gang violence? There's no interest in planning for the future. These things have happened in other Western nations, with immigration playing a large part of it, but there's little to no interest here to prepare and avoid this from happening here.

Instead, it's we'll be grand. It won't ever happen here, because.. well, it just won't.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590102#Comment_118590102

Glass half empty guy, eh?

I don't share your doom laden prophecy, I have been hearing the same for decades.

You'll be grand. Plus it's Sunday.

👍️

McHardcore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118585701#Comment_118585701

Oh, do you? Humour us so and tell us what “asylum seeker” means.

(clue: it’s in the name).

Then, based off this definition, explain to us why it is illegal.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590377#Comment_118590377

More of a realist. Not terribly interested in promoting "la la" land, and ignoring all the people who never set inside those gates.