What's really going on with the recent Joe Rogan controversy?

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118614912#Comment_118614912

Research papers are subject to rigour. Rogan and his guests spread disinformation at will unchecked. There's a world of difference.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118614912#Comment_118614912

Why doesn't he get an actual immunologist on to explain it to him?

Like this guy.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1489564850917453826

Penn

I said similar on the podcast forum, but Joe's issue with balance is that if 99% of scientists believe something and he has 5 guests from the 1% and 5 guests from the 99%, that's not balance. And even then he seems more likely to have more from the 1% on specifically because they go against the mainstream view.

But the danger also isn't that people listen to Joe Rogan's advice on vaccines, it's that they take Joe Rogan's guest's advice on vaccines, where those guests are being promoted by Joe as being experts.

@tommybrees

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118615026#Comment_118615026

Yep, if Malone feels like there's flaws in existing research, he's free to use the review process to challenge it. Meanwhile him going on a podcast to make claims indicates he isn't remotely confident he can prove any of them cause if he was, he'd use the process. @tommybrees

donaghs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118614856#Comment_118614856

You might have a blind spot yourself! 😀 "Admit he was wrong and move on" ?

I clearly stated in my post that Joe Rogan was wrong on the point of myocarditis and vaccines in young males.

So, ???

Listening back, it does seem like Joe was struggling to accept it initially, asking about the sources etc. Sure. But my view on it would still be that he was realizing in real-time that he was wrong. In his statements after he admitted he was wrong also. Better that he accepted he was wrong?

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118615160#Comment_118615160

Rogan ought to have a panel of related experts on if doing anything overly controversial that can pipe up if necessary and correct in real time. A non expert interviewing an expert has its flaws

zerone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118615438#Comment_118615438

He was wrong about something so he should be silenced and nobody should ever listen to anything he ever has to say again, apology or not. Different rule for CNN and their 'horse dewormer' lie.

Effects

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118610627#Comment_118610627

I think I'll actually listen to that one. Rhonda Patrick knows her stuff, but can be hard to keep up with!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118615026#Comment_118615026

RTE or other media outlets don't do the same?? It's upto the person to decide for themselves What to believe.

What disinformation was spread?

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118614995#Comment_118614995

was Peterson in trouble with his head, was unaware of that, been meaning to check him out, but the more i hear about him, the less interested i am in him?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118615786#Comment_118615786

Ivermectin as a treatment for covid. Was debunked ages ago but he continued to plug it. Having Malone on and basically giving him an unchallenged interview to make unfounded claims.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118616315#Comment_118616315

Can you point out where it has been debunked? I was under the impression it hasn’t been proved as an effective treatment for COVID. Aren’t Oxford still doing studies into it? Someone should tell them they’re wasting their time!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118616560#Comment_118616560

I'm happy to correct myself. The odds of ivermectin being an effective treatment with humans are incredibly low. The one study at a large scale that claimed it was, has been retracted. The conspiracy theory would be the claim that it's secretly effective with humans while in reality there's no credible evidence that it is.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118615801#Comment_118615801

From what I remember, he'd been taking an anti-anxiety medication for a few years, but his wife was diagnosed with cancer and he ended up becoming addicted to the pills he was on. Ended up having to go to Russia to a treatment facility, was in intensive care for a few weeks, and in recovery for several months. He was also following and promoting his daughter's "meat and salt" diet. A diet Joe Rogan later did for a few weeks, which gave him explosive diarrhea.

Easy to see why the mainstream media fears these titans of the Intellectual Dark Web.

donaghs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118616631#Comment_118616631

As far as I understand this, there is no evidence it works for COVID , so therefore people shouldn't take it. I've read that was it ineffective in smaller clinical trials. But I don't think that completely rules it out.

Humans do take it though. To suggest otherwise is falling for media spin ,and taking sides on a politicised debate. .i.e. Either its a wonder-drug COVID panacea, or else its "horse dewormer" which only ignorant redneck anti-vaxxers would take (i.e. Joe Rogan).

In humans, it has been used to treat headlice, scabies, whipworm, for starters.

It has been hugely effective at treating river blindness in Latin America and Africa.

A new powerful drug to combat river blindness - The Lancet

The Raging Bile Duct

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118614662#Comment_118614662

Bill Burr used to call Steve Jobs Nerd Jesus. I think Rogan is Bro Jesus. To a certain group of people he's more infallible than the pope.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118616560#Comment_118616560

Ivermectin Arm of PRINCIPLE Trial Put on Hold

— Trial website cites supply issues

Link

That aside, do you think scientists only research things that they know will produce a positive result?

kowloon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118614995#Comment_118614995

I think when you've invested so much into the message that people should get their house in order before they criticise others, you can't really make a living criticising others when it turns out you're addicted to benzos. Jordan Peterson undermined his own message.

arthursway

It is not just ivermectin Joe Rogan promoted for treatment of COVID but a cocktail of the following:

Monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin, Z-Pak, prednisone,.

Monoclonal antibodies were authorised for use by in the USA as a treatment fur COVID and have saved countless lives.

But of course CNN concentrated on just the ivermectin in that cocktail that can be used in animals but also has been so effective in humans as a treatment for parasites that it helped scientists win Nobel peace prize in 2015.

It's a clear smear campaign against Joe Rogan as he is branded "right wing" and it's no surprise that the same left wing posters on boards are out to get him here. If they ever watched him they would realise he's not even right wing but that wouldn't fit the narrative voiced by their daily echo chamber Twitter feeds telling them the right are anti democratic and the left must save democracy while at the same time being against Voter ID.

Hypocrisy:

the practice of claiming to have higher standards or more noble beliefs than is the case

Brucie Bonus

Whats the underlying theory, there was, is a good treatment for covid but 'the man' doesn't want us to have it?

You would think they'd want us all back working 100% making them their millions.

It makes more sense to me that certain right wing elements want to disrupt the political climate and will use any old toffee to do it. Everybody loves being told they are right.

Rogan, Fox, Trump etc. etc. play to their audience.

Rogan feeds the right. He might not be himself. He's apologised for being too one sided on Covid and using the N word. These are the things people don't like about him. He did them.

zerone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617489#Comment_118617489

Which 'right' would that be? The one on the left?

https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1491841629665525766?cxt=HHwWjIDU1duDi7QpAAAA

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617350#Comment_118617350

That's a strawman to suggest Rogan is branded as right wing. I'm not suggesting that there aren't some who see him as such but it is no way a significant number of people.

I don't see him as such, I see him as someone who likes to talk with authority about topics irrespective of whether is an authority on that topic or not. I think he likes the sound of his own voice and how his fans revere him, but so what, he's not the only person who is guilty of that. I didn't get too concerned about him over the last few years, as I amn't really now because I just avoided him.

But I did see a number of discussions he held on the topic of Covid because I am interested in how that conversation is happening at a societal level and felt it was not ideal to have someone with the audience he has to speak as he was doing. I don't care if you list 100 things that he said he was on any more that I care about what Trump said his process was to recover from Covid, we aren't ever going to really know and I don't put it past either of them to claim what their treatment process was so it backs a position that had/have rather than whatever the reality was. They both have no problem accessing the top levels of care, we know that for sure.

There is no smear campaign against him, his own words are being analysed and people are drawing conclusions from those. He, or you, can't argue about that when he specifically sought out a career where people listen to what he has to say.

zerone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617677#Comment_118617677

To be fair does this not seem like a smear campaign to any right minded person?

https://youtu.be/22LwCRXk1ac

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118616315#Comment_118616315

My memory is a bit hazzy but if I remember rightly ivermectin wasn't even giving a chance. Why?

You'll never agree with 100% of anything that's ever said with talking to somebody or listening to what they are saying but, my opinion is that they asked some very valid questions.

Why aren't people up in arms as to the completely one sided fear mongering view of our mainstream media the past 2 years that's getting plenty of taxpayer money.

Rogan also had Peter mc cullaugh on a podcast and was fantastic to listen to and opened my mind up to some very valid points.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617733#Comment_118617733

That isn't a smear campaign, that's literally just saying what he said, and pointing out that it hadn't been approved as a treatment for Covid.

zerone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617820#Comment_118617820

But they repeatedly called it 'horse dewormer'. You don't see the problem with that? You honestly don't see that as an attempt to smear him?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617789#Comment_118617789

Your memory is definitely pretty hazy. It was very much so given a chance and plenty of research was done into using it. In the same way as the arthritis med that trump pushed was researched, Including human trials.... So yep definitely given a chance.

And nobody here is questioning the fact that just because somebody is a doctor or 'scientist' means that there never ever wrong?

People here questioning Malone fair enough, only an dope doesn't ask questions. But at least start questioning the mainstream media approach of covid over the past 2 years in the same way.

Because I would love to ask nephet members some questions about there decisions and the models they based restricting peoples lives on.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617933#Comment_118617933

He can't produce an ounce of research to backup his view and hasn't conducted any peer reviewed research on the vaccine.... So it's a jackass shouting unsubstantiated opinions in a field that operates on proof.

Doesn't take a genius or peer reviewed papers to ask some basic questions about what's after going on the past 2 years.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617956#Comment_118617956

You sound like a person that hasn't even listened to the podcasts or only has them as background noise.

Joe's had people from both sides of the debate on his show the past 2 years.

Same can't be said for our media.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618003#Comment_118618003

You didn't address a single thing I said about Malone... What makes him credible? He has no research around the efficacy of the vaccine etc. He can't point to research that supports his view. Ever hear of arguing from authority? Instead of facts, you're choosing his background rather than arguments etc.

I dunno man I never heard of him until he went on the podcast. But doubt he was picked up off the street. He has a masters degree doesn't he. Must no something about what he's talking about.

What usefull research can anybody have on the vaccines it's only a couple months old. Before covid I thought it took years to get a vaccine out.

And you haven't addressed a thing I have said about people using the same thought process question Malone, but not others that have been on our TV screens and radio for the past 2 years

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618098#Comment_118618098

There's tonnes of useful research on the vaccines. Trials began in 2020... And you're continuing to argue from authority. Plenty of people have masters, myself included but unless we can support our arguments... So you're trusting in his opinion rather than him having research to backup his views. You are sort of showing how little you know about the scientific process in general. Ivermectin wasn't given a chance, what research can you do on vaccines that have been administered to most of the globe...

People do get challenged on radio etc btw. If the research backs them up though, they find it pretty easy to backup their arguments.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618179#Comment_118618179

I'm referring to Malone..

O'Neill

Speaking of Jimmy Dore, what is going on with him? Used to follow him but he's really lost it. He's clearly found a market in making false videos about Covid. He's like an American George Galloway. Funny that he interviewed him on his radio show.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618098#Comment_118618098

What usefull research can anybody have on the vaccines it's only a couple months old. Before covid I thought it took years to get a vaccine out.

Can you see any difference between normal vaccine development and the environment which Covid developed which could lead to a difference in time scale for development.

I can give you 4 straight off the bat, but before I do that, why don't you have a think about it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618161#Comment_118618161

I no absolutely nothing about scientific processes like 99% of the population I happily admit. And im referring to research like Long term side effects of these vaccines?? Like what might happen 5 years down the line. Nobody knows that.

I don't have a masters but fair play, but I think I could poke holes into most decisions made be the 'experts' over the past 2 years.

I like to hear all sides of the story. Make up my own opinion then. Like most things some are right on certain things and wrong on others. Nobody is bulletproof.

And we must be listening and watching completely different media platforms if you think they have challenged the narrative.

Real Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618206#Comment_118618206

If he was putting out false info about Covid his channel would not be up, Jimmy is just calling out all the BS which seems to upset some people.

Brucie Bonus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617535#Comment_118617535

The often conservative privileged types fearful of change who ironically might call others 'snowflakes'. That 'right'.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618217#Comment_118618217

I haven't a clue what you are talking about to be honest.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618415#Comment_118618415

Not being smart, but that's kind of the answer I expected.

I'll explain a little and you might understand more why the Covid vaccine was developed so quickly. And I am not going to mention anything about the technological advances which allowed it to be done quickly versus vaccines in the past but considering it purely from an operational perspective.

1. One of the massive things that influences vaccine development is the access to test cases upon which to develop potential vaccines for efficacy and possible side effects. Given how prevalent covid was, this wasn't a stumbling block here. There were no shortage of patients for researchers to work with.
2. Given the impact of Covid, all eyes were turned to it within the Pharma world for 2019 in to 2020. It became front and centre for many of the massive pharma companies as they raced to develop vaccines. there was no issue with
3. Is associated with the above, funding, from within companies themselves and from governments pretty much presented an open cheque to assist with vaccine development.
4. Approval bodies were ready and waiting to review all necessary documentation in order to expedite the approval of vaccines ASAP.

And as I mentioned above, I'm not talking about the advances in technology and data analytics in recent years that continue to shorten the time frame to carry out research compared to in the past.

O'Neill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617307#Comment_118617307

I was a big fan of Peterson and what he had to say but you are right here. He may have ended up in that position due to the coordinated smear campaign against him, but it’s hard to take him seriously after hearing that story about Russia and his treatment. It sounded so made up and full of holes. He knew what was medically best for him when his doctors didn’t- very odd altogether.

zerone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118618349#Comment_118618349

I'll say it again (because you slyly avoided addressing the point) how is this feeding the right?

https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1491841629665525766?cxt=HHwWjIDU1duDi7QpAAAA

Brucie Bonus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619658#Comment_118619658

The right in the US pretend to be all about the little guy when they are all about big money. They call for smaller government, more personal freedom. In reality, less restrictions. Like the current call to stop politicians having stock in contractors etc. they are fighting.

So they tell the ignorant they are right. There is a leftist conspiracy out to control them. The media is in on it etc. even though the wealthy right own a good share of it.

Don't trust what you hear from the mainstream. In steps the likes of Rogan playing up to this audience. Telling the ignorant and conspiracy theorists they might have a point. Having heavily one sided guests and making a fortune doing it.

Its low hanging fruit.

He has admitted to being unbalanced. He has apologised sort of for using the N word a lot. These are the main reasons people don't like him. These are things he has done.

BruteStock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118617820#Comment_118617820

Of course its a smear campaign.

Accusing Rogan of taking animal medicine is literally what they said. . There's a big difference between accusing somebody of taking a substance not fit for human consumption and accusing them of taking a drug not approved for Covid treatment. BIG difference. They accused him of the former not the latter. Hence the smear campaign.. Even CNN employee Sanjay Gupta could not defend their rotten dishonesty.

Furthermore , this Nobel prize winning antiviral they dishonestly called horse paste , is on a top 10 list of essential medicines according to the world health organization. Ivermectin has been prescribed to Billions of people.

You wouldn't see CNN mock India for treating Covid with Ivermectin , so why smear Rogan for it? We all know why. Because they want him de-platformed.

https://www.thedesertreview.com/news/national/ivermectin-obliterates-97-percent-of-delhi-cases/article_6a3be6b2-c31f-11eb-836d-2722d2325a08.html

https://www.forbes.com/sites/siladityaray/2021/05/11/indian-state-will-offer-ivermectin-to-entire-adult-population---even-as-who-warns-against-its-use-as-covid-19-treatment/?sh=37ecae196d9f

"The state health minister of Goa, Vishwajit Rane, said Monday that people will be given 12 mg of Ivermectin for a period of five days as prophylaxis to protect against Covid-19.

Rane claimed that the state government’s decision was based on studies by expert panels from the UK, Italy, Spain and Japan which found a statistically significant reduction in mortality and recovery time in patients with Covid-19, without offering any specifics."

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118620740#Comment_118620740

They accused him of taking animal medicine because that is what it was and is widely used for.

Are they not allowed point that out?

If you think that is repulsive, how woukd you describe what Fox did/do to Fauci?

Here's what the WHO said about Ivermectin in Delhi/India.

Also warning against Ivermectin's general use, Dr Soumya Swanithanan, chief scientist, WHO, tweeted on Tuesday, “Safety and efficacy are important when using any drug for a new indication. WHO recommends against the use of Ivermectin for Covid-19 except within clinical trials.”

Posters coming out with the same nonsense about ivermectin that has been surfacing in conspiracy theories forum constantly....

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619658#Comment_118619658

Because they're using it to push a 'government censorship' narrative.

That aside, it's the same crew who are most often using the words 'far right' and 'Joe Rogan' as they try to push the strawman that the left all see him as such.