Sacked doctor sues former employer for refusing to call trans-woman "she"

Quantum Erasure

Police Scotland to review policy that allows male rapists to self-identify as women

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/02/21/police-scotland-review-policy-allows-rapists-self-identify-women/

...The controversy comes as the Scottish Government faces growing scrutiny over its plans for a legal shake-up which would allow Scots to legally change their own gender by self-declaration.

Currently, approval from a panel of experts and a medical diagnosis of gender dysphoria is needed to obtain a gender recognition certificate.

The SNP legislation would remove those requirements and lower the time in which someone has to live in their “acquired gender” from two years to three months.

Opponents to the plan claim it poses a threat to women’s rights and would create a system open to abuse from male sexual predators, who could exploit it in an attempt to gain access to women-only spaces.

LLMMLL

https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/government-no-interest-banning-trans-people-single-sex-toilets-liz-truss-tells-equalities-tsar-1474413

While we're putting random news from other countries...

Quantum Erasure

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674262#Comment_118674262

it was in response to this post, to back up the point, but by the time i'd posted it there was a few more posts in he thread

You are completely right.

One person cares about the definition of women because of the ramifications that come with the definition (access to women only spaces/sports etc) and the other doesn't "give a flying f".

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674186#Comment_118674186

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674224#Comment_118674224

I never said it was rare. Or even hint at it.

You did allude that bubbly's opinion was worth more though. Ironically by virtue of her sex and her ability to enter women only spaces.

LLMMLL

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674307#Comment_118674307

I never said bubbly's opinion was worth more than greebos. I didn't make any reference to greebos point of view so not sure how I hinted at it either.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118673382#Comment_118673382

To be fair stereotyping all trans people as unstable is anti trans. And thats just 1 example.

Gentlemanne

I don't think its belittling and demeaning to call someone anti-trans when they absolutely are. You can see a pattern of certain posters across multiple threads and it's always they not only don't want trans people to have the same rights as everyone, they constantly misgender and make qualifying statements about their (usually low) understanding of sex v. gender.

How is that not anti-trans? If someone was in a gay rights thread saying there is no gay people - men are attracted to women and vice-versea, they'd be rightfully called homophobic.

Look I'm sorry it feels bad to be called a bigot, have you considered not being bigoted?

LLMMLL

I mean he did say trans people were unstable due to their hormones.

But I can't see where I called him anti trans....even though he is.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674507#Comment_118674507

I don't think its belittling and demeaning to call someone anti-trans when they absolutely are

Except that very few posters have suggested that Trans Adults shouldn't be allowed to be Trans, or implement any restrictions on them choosing to live in that manner. That would be anti-trans.

Being critical of demands from Trans advocates or Trans people themselves for aspects that extend beyond them, and affect others directly is not anti-Trans. Showing the male characteristics that remain present in Transwomen, when seeking to participate in female sports, is not anti-Trans. After all, I doubt anyone would have any issue with there being a category in sports just for Transwomen to compete against each other..

Calling someone anti-Trans usually comes from posters who refuse to deal what the other poster has submitted, preferring to deflect, or seek some kind of emotional judgment rather than argue the facts of the matter.

How is that not anti-trans? If someone was in a gay rights thread saying there is no gay people - men are attracted to women and vice-verse, they'd be rightfulyl valled homophobic.

No, they'd be considered ignorant or foolish, not homophobic. Now, if they came into such a thread, and said that gay people shouldn't be allowed to be gay, then, yes, that would be homophobic.

Oh, I'm sure there would be advocates for gay rights, such as those on here, who would call such a person homophobic, but that doesn't make them right. It just means they're intolerant of others opinions, failing to argue directly with the statements involved, and little interest in convincing others. The brute force approach is more appealing, and so, they insult others by casting judgment, assuming some self-appointed high moral position.

Look I'm sorry it feels bad to be called a bigot, have you considered not being bigoted?

You do realise that goes both ways? The people who cry bigot could easily be described as bigoted themselves. Just because they've chosen to champion a particular cause, doesn't make them immune from being judged by the same standards that they extend to others. They're simply being bigoted towards the majority, rather than the minority in question.

Gentlemanne

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674583#Comment_118674583

extremely rich you of all people getting to decide what's anti-trans

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674194#Comment_118674194

I'm a female relative of men. They don't need to be worried about me sharing spaces with Trans women. I can decide for myself what I'm happy with.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674629#Comment_118674629

Why would that be? What makes you more qualified to decide what it refers to?

This is the irony of posters like yourself. You've appointed yourselves as the judge, jury, and executioner of the court, solely capable of deciding what is, and what isn't allowed.

"you of all people"... I really love the use of that phrase in situations such as this. It just screams bigot.

boardise

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118628158#Comment_118628158

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118628158#Comment_118628158

If only the Bible had a Book of Genitals we'd be sorted .

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674631#Comment_118674631

I absolutely agree with you. I only brought you up because the other poster was using you as an example.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118673801#Comment_118673801

Nah man, that’s a scuttery way of trying to say “they’re as bad as each other” when the impact of anti-trans nonsense is that it is ensured they stay in their box and don’t come out, we straight white sorts determine whether they get to live or not cos we’re the majority. I don’t want that responsibility, do you?

I certainly don’t want the responsibility where I limit women’s participation in society “for their own good”, and STILL can’t fulfil my claims of protecting women from abuse, because most women are being abused in their own homes, not in gyms or saunas or anywhere else where the temperature is more likely to have them faint than the sight of a mickey. Of course if women retaliate against their abuser, they’ll become one of the “but gender based violence is 50/50” BS that gets spouted by some posters around here.

They don’t do joined up thinking that examines why a woman might end up in a domestic violence shelter or prison or wherever else. The same posters don’t want to protect women, they wish they had the power to stop people who are transgender from having any legal recognition, and they’ll do the same to women when the conversation is about women, and they’ll do the same to men when it’s about men’s skin colour or immigration status or whatever else.

I’d ask you @matchbox2021 not to insult peoples intelligence defending posters who come out with that shyte. They are anti-trans, anti-plenty of things, anti-trans is just for starters. And no, the posters who point this out aren’t anti-women, and they aren’t anti-women because they want people who are transgender to be able to participate in sports. I don’t have to go to some schools championships in America to know I want children here to be able to participate and compete in swimming.

What sort of a bell-end argues that I would want adults competing with children, or that I would want women to be harmed? They can’t connect the dots in those circumstances because being transgender and being a sex pest have no association with one another, other than the one you create in your imagination. But if I argue that women in sports should receive extra funding to bring it up to par with men? “Ahh no that’s positive discrimination, it’s still discrimination, wah wah…” 🙄

Instead of trying to portray yourself as the voice of reason and all the rest of it, I know exactly already that you don’t want people who are transgender to be able to participate as equals in Irish society. You’re so concerned about accuracy well to say that’s anti-trans is absolutely spot-on.

Don’t like it? For people who decry the whole notion of feelings over facts, ye sure are a sensitive bunch, but it’s ok for ye to claim people who are transgender should be treated as nobodies while at the same time claiming they shouldn’t take it personally and you’re not transphobic. G’way up the fcuking yard, I’ve wasted enough time entertaining ye’re nonsense and having to remain civil about it.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674583#Comment_118674583

But you do want to place restrictions on trans people. You want them restricted so that they cant go into certain places and spaces.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674859#Comment_118674859

No. He wants restrictions on males being allowed into female spaces.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675001#Comment_118675001

Which is restrictions on trans people. Dress it up whatever way you want. Its still about restricting trans people. Klax claimed here that people shouldnt be called anti trans because they dont want to place restrictions on trans people. They do. A lot of the discussion is about restricting trans people; from sport, from toilets, from changing facilities.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675066#Comment_118675066

No. It's a restriction on males entering female only areas. It is a restriction on all male people. It's in no way a restriction on trans people. It is a restriction on males. Not trans. All males.

You can try and frame it as if trans people are being singled out. They aren't. People do not want BIOLOGICAL MALES or anyone who isn't a biological woman, in women's sport, toilets, changing facilities. Not just trans people.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675155#Comment_118675155

Of course it is about singling out trans people and placing restrictions on trans people. Deny it all you want but thats the entire point.

Me_Grapes

There was a chap I knew when I was younger - he was the cousin of one of my friends - who was around visiting him in the area I grew up in, and who we let play in our daily game of football.

So there we were all set. He was on the team against me. Game kicks off, and few seconds into it, their team kicks the ball out for a throw in. He grabs the ball and shouts "We Claim It" and throws the ball back into play. Our team are telling him 'Hang on, no - yous kicked the ball out, it's our throw'. His response: 'No, there's no ref here, so the first to say "We Claim It" gets the throw'. Anyway, balls back in play so we just play on, f**ck it just get on with the game sort of thing. Things get ridiculous and he becomes very annoying when he starts fouling our team, and "claiming" freekicks, and even when our team scored a goal he would shout "We Claim It". Eventually, everyone tells this chap to cop the f**k on, or f**k off home. He f**ked off home shortly into the game, and was not invited back to play ball again.

I was forever convinced that this chap was just a wind up merchant extrodinaire who was basically there to take the P!ss out of us because he thought it was a right laugh or whatever. However, listening to the current trend of trans right activists, I now realise that this fella was absolutely serious in his notions when he was playing football with us that day that every throw-in, free kick or goal we scored against him was in fact his because "He Claimed It".

Or maybe... Just maybe my initial suspicion is correct and it's the trans rights activists who are the wind up merchants extraordinaire and are basically taking the P!ss out of society because they think its a right laugh or whatever.

I just don't know what to think in this absolutely bananas world we live in now.

km991148

I mean, I really do need to laugh now, this is getting to ridiculous levels.

Lots of the usual people going to great lengths to explain why trans people don't really exist, why they shouldn't have rights, going on to throw lazy stereotypes and heresay around (instability, alluding to mental problems, posting the usual memes etc).. but merely suggest that this makes them anti trans and it's met with deflection and denial (while throwing out accusations of such 'tactics' to the people daring to call out the anti trans behaviour). Are you for real (the other classic, of course being how much they like to bleat on about objective reality etc!!)

Why is it even such a slur, surely that's exactly what you want to be labelled as?

Own your arguments for feck sake!

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675639#Comment_118675639

Exactly. And very much often denying reality too. Denying the reality they want to restrict trans peoples rights. Denying the reality of their own disrespect. Denying the reality that trans women have been using womens toilets for decades ffs.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675457#Comment_118675457

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675673#Comment_118675673

Denying reality?

You must be joking.

For clarity:

Trans people exist.

Trans people aren't the sex they believe they are.

Women only spaces and sports should be for females.

This excludes ALL biological males (including ones who want to be biologically female but are not)

What part of that is denying reality?

Do you think that transwomen deserve to be recognised as biological women despite that not being factually correct? Is that what you want?

If you believe I'm anti trans for recognising the fact that they aren't the sex they want to be, then **** it, call me anti trans.

I don't identify as anti-trans though so I don't know how you'll square that particular circle with your bizarre logic that everyone can identify as what they wish and it should be respected no matter what.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675639#Comment_118675639

Who has said that Trans people don't exist...? Or that they shouldn't have rights? You're throwing out exaggerations and making claims that weren't made, at least not in the last 10 odd pages of the thread.

I assume the instability comment was directed at me? I stated very specific circumstances. That of hormonal treatment, which does cause emotional instability through the area of mood swings. Which is natural enough, considering the changes in the body.

As for merely suggest that they are anti-trans... those weren't suggestions, and being anti-trans is the same as being a transphobe, which is linked to such terms as racist, bigot, etc. There is no merely involved. Those terms shouldn't be bandied around lightly, if they're supposed to have some real meaning in society. Although then again, considering how easily it's being thrown around these days, it won't stay a serious term that people will care to avoid.

I'm not going to chase up on all these anti-trans references because it doesn't matter. I sought to deal with it earlier in the thread, and the posts were dismissed/deflected out of hand, without any interest in discussing the points raised. Just merely calling me anti-trans instead.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674841#Comment_118674841

You’ve made many assumptions about me, all incorrect. The first is that I’m white. Why not just stick to what we’re talking about, it always has to be twisted back to who is making the argument.

Maybe your other assumptions about the motivations of people making these arguments could be wrong also.

Instead of trying to portray yourself as the voice of reason and all the rest of it, I know exactly already that you don’t want people who are transgender to be able to participate as equals in Irish society. You’re so concerned about accuracy well to say that’s anti-trans is absolutely spot-on.

This is just toys out of pram.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674140#Comment_118674140

Sorry about that, perhaps it was another poster, I’m sure I saw the allegation. Sorry to accuse you.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118676191#Comment_118676191

Yeah way to miss the point horse. I couldn’t care less if you’re white, black, brown, blue or orange, the point is that white straight people are the majority in society so between you being not white, klaz being not straight and the dunne trying to wedge his daughter into the conversation by way of the usual tropes, you can then try and use that as your get out clause as if to say you don’t have anything against people who are transgender?

I don’t believe you. I’m not wrong because I’ve seen the way ye’ve all gone about previous discussions making men out to be the real victims who need support and how the media are portraying men and all the rest of it. Have any of ye looked in the mirror lately? Ye’re doing the very same thing ye’re accusing the media of doing, only ye’re doing it to other groups in society.

Nobody ever had to provide a DNA sample to use the bathroom, so what would be the punishment for anyone who didn’t provide a DNA sample? I’d be happy to tell you where you could shove your swab if you so much as came near me on my way to the bathroom to try and stop me 😒

That’s where this whole spaces nonsense falls down - you don’t want to get your own hands dirty, but you want to place impositions on people all the same, so you need to try and pit them against each other. You really think people are that stupid that they actually obsess about being attacked by bogeymen in public bathrooms?

Far more likely bigots will simply out themselves with their own stupid sense of righteousness and entitlement. Nothing to do with their ignorance of biology, sociology, law, logistics even, or anything else. Just plain old used to having everything their own way, like the doctor in the opening post. There’s your example of toys out of the pram. Fellas here claiming laws should be completely rewritten to suit them so that people can carry on discrimination against other groups in society and complaining that things have gone too far, and there needs to be a line? That’s throwing toys out of the pram.

Identifying anti-trans bullshìt for what it is, and THAT’s when you choose to say “now that’s not very respectful”… yeah, that’s called respectability politics. I don’t want your respect, I’m already your equal.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118676416#Comment_118676416

So you just keep making factual assumptions about people despite them telling you that you’re are wrong?

You continually make assumptions that no one cares about women’s safety and anyone making this argument is in effect a bigot. This line of argument is ridiculous and provably so.

Arguing with the fellas here that are spouting information that you believe to be untrue would be a much better use of mine and your time, rather than defending people’s right to insult others. What objective use is there to use anti-trans then to smear someone as an other and an enemy.

Focusing on me is just a deflection, despite all the incorrect assumptions you’ve made. I’m sure it won’t stop you just carrying on as usual, deflect, deflect, deflect.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118676467#Comment_118676467

Nobody’s focused on you specifically, or klaz, or the dunne or anyone else. What is being focused on, is that the same sentiments yiz come out with are the usual BS that often gets trotted out by the same sort of idiots that think things have gone too far and people need to be put back in their place, everything was better years ago. I know already you’ll pretend to miss the point again and say I’m still wrong about you, I’m not.

Of course it’s never specifically about any one group of people, but all different groups of people, and wanting to curtail their freedoms while you’re playing the victim, and pretending you care about other groups in society. Why don’t you ask yourself what is the objective of pretending anyone is a threat to anyone else on the basis of their characteristics alone? Whether they’re a man or a woman or transgender or religious or not or the colour of their skin, ethnicity, immigration status, whatever… why don’t you ask yourself what is the objective of doing that? You know well what the objective is. But ‘anti-trans’ is the one you think is terrible altogether? Yeah, that’s not disingenuous at all at all 🙄

They complain because they’re compelled to tell the truth, and they’re complaining about being compelled to lie, knowing full well what they’re at, so they should understand when they’re bullshìtting, that people are gonna point out that they’re bullshìtting. If there was actually a coherent political or social philosophy behind their mish-mash of cantankerous fcukery I might be more understanding, but there’s nothing. It’s like an audience with GB News or something it’s that ridiculous, just the usual silly rhetoric being posted about 30 years out of date by this stage.