RTE Investigates [RTE 1]

realdanbreen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664656#Comment_118664656

The white BMW has been swapped for a passat over a week now.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664656#Comment_118664656

I’d be surprised if she hasn’t already got rid of it considering how distinctive it is around the area she lives. You’d have to think that as a trained accountant she knows that having cash now is her only hope of having money to live on. I can’t imagine banks will be giving her any credit.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664832#Comment_118664832

I’m not taking about a white BMW

RabbleRouser2k

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664202#Comment_118664202

Investing in her fiancee's dealings showed her business acumen was...lacking.

Tbf tho, many of the businesses they invested in went bell up (not just hers, but one or two that I knew of). There was cheese company that two of the dragon's invested in, saw the cheese in a few supermarkets, but I never purchased it. My brother did, and said it was far too salty.

That has seemingly disappeared. I don't see it in any supermarket since. Another product, Surf Seeds, was pretty tasty. But it was a tad too pricey, unfortunately. Did help me once with chatting up a cute girl, tho. So not all bad. ;)

Gusser09

Amazing what greed can do to people. Imagine coming into 30 million and pissing it away. Most people would just be happy to live off it.

Who knows. Maybe she is all the happier now.

enrique66_35

There's been some debate about whether Revenue would be interested due to the company being registered in the UK. The fact of the matter is the company's place of effective management was Ireland and its "trade" was conducted in Ireland so Revenue would be very much interested in it for Corporation Tax. The company has an income (albeit a fraudulent one) and no legitimate expenses to offset that income so would have a hefty CT liability plus interest and penalties (assuming that no or nil returns have been filed to date).

In addition, the amounts used for personal expenses are a deemed directors loan on which interest must be paid at 13.5% per annum or the it is a benefit in kind which attracts paye/prsi/usc. The company must also pay deemed income tax (at 20%) on the loan balance so if the figure of, say, 200K given was used then there is IT on directors loan due of 50K (200 x 20/80). It's fairly likely when Revenue examine this that a tax bill in the region of 50% of the amounts received will be owing. If the company can't pay it and Revenue gets a judgement then the next step is to remove the protection of limited liability and seek repayment from the directors. Carey will be looking at bankruptcy, at a minimum. Then there is the issue of carrying on a trade in a regulated industry without the required authorisation from Central Bank. There are numerous very serious charges here that should, if proven, carry significant sentences but the Irish courts history on punishing this kind of crime is, not particularly inspiring.

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118666565#Comment_118666565

If you stuck 30 million in the stock market, you'd have 600 thousand a year income from dividends plus with patience, guaranteed capital appreciation

Pussyhands

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118665990#Comment_118665990

Hard to know whether they actually invested in those businesses or not. A lot of the time they do a deal and then it falls apart after the show.

I remember being on reddit a few years ago and one of the girls from Able Table, who got backing from Gavin Duffy, made a post saying that Duffy never gave them the money he said he would. There was a detailed post, I can't find it now, but I remember that she said her mother (the one who basically came up with the design and idea) was suffering from mental health issues as a result of the money troubles etc.

The Irish Dragons Den was more of a "advertisement for Irish businesses" than a platform for Irish businesses to get investment.

https://www.abletable.ie/

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667142#Comment_118667142

As I've said greed.

You could live of 30 million for 50 years comfortably. 600K a year.

Pussyhands

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667257#Comment_118667257

Meh. Greed is relative.

Are all CEOs of big companies greedy?

Muahahaha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667214#Comment_118667214

The Irish Dragons Den really was a farce while it lasted. People were going on it asking for 10k ro 20k, something they could have got in the credit union or bank. And then the Dragons would be asking for 25% of their company for it, I think a few of them were pretty broke while filming it. iirc Sarah Newman only made one small investment in the two years she was on the show. It was similar with Bill Cullen and the Apprentice on TV3 around the same time, Bill was making out like he was running a successful company but the reality was he was battling creditors and bankruptcy while it was being filmed.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118664656#Comment_118664656

Is this a 640d BMW, has a female driver and all. Nearly killed that motorbiker with some insane driving

https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/ssg4wq/if_anyone_knows_the_driver_of_the_bmw_tell_her_i/

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667539#Comment_118667539

BMW - 131 , i doubt she was driving a car that 'old' ??

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667257#Comment_118667257

Entrepreneurs aren’t driven by the desire to just live comfortably. If they were, there would be no incentive to expand their business/interests. That of course would have devastating affects on the work force. Just think how many would be unemployed in Ireland right now if entrepreneurs didn’t strive beyond comfort, no google, no intel, no Apple, Dunnes, Tescos, Ryanair, CRH etc.

And by the way, the same thing can be said of your €600k a year, investments can go down as well as up.

Cape Clear

There's a big chunk of details missing here in my view. CC needed circa €200k plus cash to fund her lycra clad lifestyle. That's a lot of €100K loans at 6.5 per cent to service the debt and clear that much of a salary unless she was awash with cash from elsewhere.

patsy_mccabe

I personally spoke to someone who was on Dragon's Den and was promised an investment from one of the panel. He told me after the show it never materialised. He laughed when I asked him about it. He dismissed it all as "just television". He struck a deal with another company in the meantime.

realdanbreen

I don't think too many adults believed that dragons den was a genuine investment vehicle. Half the dragons were deep in hock to the banks and one in particular would find it hard to lay his hands on €500 cash I would imagine.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118676078#Comment_118676078

Wasn’t there another one in the news last yr, over 10m in debt, some shinanagans with payments to directors, might need some medicine for that pain. 😉

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118676857#Comment_118676857

Yes indeed, seems the Irish Dragons Jinxed

Since the story attached , she and hubby got a €400k please F**K off payment , €29k each in redundancy payments included in that, even the learned Judge overseeing the examinership of Cara Pharmacy questioned why this Wongo wasn't going to creditors .

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/retail-and-services/cara-pharmacy-founders-claim-financial-difficulties-overstated-1.4356668

Kingkong

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118653156#Comment_118653156

Hi Dav;

Financial Regulator as it was relating to mortgages. I know a bit about this stuff professional. At the time when these poor people were swindled, the lack of help and treatment by the banks pushed people into trusting Carey. The situation caused the abuse by Carey.

The desperation was caused by the introduction of loan sales in an unregulated manner which the central bank in the background endorsed as it meant the European central bank was happy. Loans sales should be highly regulated and only allowed in limited circumstances. This is why KBC, Ulster Bank etc can get out the market so so easily nowadays.

Put simply if there was a quick realization by the Financial Regulator it had a conflict of interest and appointed CCPC to manage the changes required to resource MAABS to engage one to one with defaulters actively and enact the personal insolvency route. That would have stopped the banks from having a veto on personal insolvency stopping the bank's loan sales forcing banks into negotiations.

The quick fix of loans sales only pushed the problem down to the road leaving these poor people in a terrible situation allowing their ultimate exploitation.

If MAABS had written or called these distressed borrowers this would not have happened. This should be automatic.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118685993#Comment_118685993

It appears in CCs case, there was no actual relationship between CC and any of the lenders who held her clients mortgages, so I’m not what “self regulating” body you would think should have intervened if the companies who held the mortgages knew nothing about her.

Kingkong

I think your still missing the point. The situation of absolute desperation caused the problem. Lack of regulation allowed Carey and perhaps others to take advantage. Those is default should have had a independent agency interact with them. This problem was our own making. How many sucides are linked to the banks I’d live to know.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118686856#Comment_118686856

Just to be clear, what CC did was fraudulent and illegal, not a failure of regulation, perhaps you do not understand the less than subtle difference.

The relevant regulatory bodies here would be the Accountants and Financial regulator, I’m not sure how either failed as she was not a member of the Accountants and had no dealings with lenders. She is just a thief, the regulatory body in this case will be the criminal courts.

cap.in.hand.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118686905#Comment_118686905

It wouldn't be too many accountants or fraudulent persons that would have a asset management company already set up which would make them 'respectable'... you'd wonder why that company was started up and it's intentions back in 2017

Pentecost

If the customers opened any of the letters they were getting from their lender since 2013 onwards they'll have been informed about MABS on several occasions as the Code of Conduct on Mortgage Arrears requires mortgage lenders to include that information in arrears letters. That doesn't change if the loan is sold the new owner or their agent has to send those letters too.

It's too easy sometimes to put it all on the banks. They're far from perfect to say the least but if there's any kind of payment being made then there will be leeway as others have said on this thread in fairness.

Andrea B.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118667539#Comment_118667539

Heard that, after a show, Seanie gave a few days consultancy in lieu of investment to one lad.

Muahahaha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118687477#Comment_118687477

There was also the story that came out in the lead up to the Presidential election he ran in. Some 18 year old was setting up a business and his dad seeked out Gallagher to ask for consultancy. Sean agreed to meet them and they paid 500 euro upfront but he showed up to the meeting a couple of hours late, only met them for 20 minutes and then made his excuses and left. The father said he felt like he'd been had.

Fattybojangles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118687643#Comment_118687643

Gallagher was a total fraud like most "businessmen" anyone who describes themselves as such is a charlatan and potential fraudster. The only actual job Gallagher had was as bagman for Fianna Fáil hence why he couldn't remember whether he had received the infamous cheque for 5k from Morgan back in 2011.

Cape Clear

Agreed on Gallagher as many holes in his story about the donation as a golf course. He did settle a case with RTE on the issue afterwards.

Gallagher had his first marriage annulled not an issue for me but he spent a lot of the presidential campaign portraying himself as a newly wed. One wonder's what else could have been omitted....

for I always thought there was a lot more to the Morgan story.

Morgan supplied fuel and transport to the last two SF presidential candidates.

Dempo1

Article in the Indo this morning (Paywall) but an interesting header caught my eye, relates to that little Fraud matter.

Almost funny if it wasn't so serious.

I'd suggest Miss Carey is No master forger and you'd have to wonder how this cheque was even cashed 🙄

Quote from the Article....

"The cheque looked like the work of a five-year-old. The ‘C’ was untouched. The ‘o’ became an ‘a’. The space between the two ‘l’s had been shaded in to make a fat-stemmed T. And so on until the words “Collector General” became “Catriona Carey” — but only if you didn’t look too closely.

“Holy ****,” said Nigel Kenny, as he stood in his local AIB branch in Kilkenny, examining the crude work of forgery"

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/revealed-the-cheque-forgery-that-brought-down-catriona-carey-41389888.html

fryup

^^^^^^^^^^^^

work of a deluded individual