Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

cute geoge

I see the Ukraine army have picked off another Russian general today bringing the total to 12 is it.

Is n't strange they are able to pick off these generals so easy ,are they getting some insider information on their targets

liamtech

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784380#Comment_118784380

Its a very sound military tactic, i must say. Taking out Commanding Officers (COs), its as old as war itself. An analogy a group of fighters headed by CO - fighting in formation in support of a central goal. Remove the CO. You now have a group of individual soldiers, with no clear commands, potentially out of formation.

And in the case of this conflict. A group of Russians, wondering aloud to one another, as to why they are in the Ukraine, where are all the 'NAZIs', and whether or not to disperse in all directions before a replacement CO arrives and gets them killed

seamus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784380#Comment_118784380

Sending higher ranking officers into the field is often what occurs when a campaign is going poorly. You send people you believe are better qualified to take the reins and direct operations. You would expect these are highly experienced and shrewd operators who know how to not get killed.

It's hard to know what's going on though. There's every chance that being sent into the field is a punishment from Russia for poor performance. Or the deaths could even be a form of purge being done from above on high-ranking officers who are suspected of not being fully onboard with Putin as a dictator. Send them in with poor protection, or even feeding the intel to Ukraine who then pick them off.

Anything is possible at this stage with nutjob in charge.

Brussels Sprout

In the first few weeks the % of the invasion force that had entered the fray ticked upwards from 30% to 70% to 95% and eventually 100%.

Now it's ticking down:

https://twitter.com/DanLamothe/status/1503417237184593920

If the initial number was 200,000 troops that would imply that 20,000 are now out of action through death, injury or capture.

goldenmick

@Brussels Sprout - If the initial number was 200,000 troops that would imply that 20,000 are now out of action through death, injury or capture, or desertion.

Fixed that for ye.

liamtech

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2_EFJLWA6o

Historian and YT Blogger, Mark Felton has a new piece on Putins career in the KGB - its well sourced (as is all Feltons stuff)

Definitely worth a look at this - the interesting connections in his past

BailMeOut

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784380#Comment_118784380

I have no doubt that Ukraine is getting really good intelligence from other nations and especially satellite and drone surveillance from foreign nations.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784576#Comment_118784576

I would speculate espionage back channels haven't been this active since the Cold War. As you say, it's very possible every scrap of intelligence friendly nations have, or are currently acquiring, is being funneled to Kyiv and beyond. If the US can't send troops they sure as hell can pass on drone and satellite footage

briany

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784449#Comment_118784449

I heard that it was either the first or second general killed who attracted a sniper's attention because he was flapping his arms around and gesticulating wildly. If true, the general was presumably doing that in the course of giving some subordinates a sound telling-off. If true, then at least one general is not so savvy.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784647#Comment_118784647

They have Globalhawk drones and various intelligence aircraft flying over or close to ukraine most nights ,you can track some on the flight radar app ,and they publicly said they were passing real time intelligence to the Ukrainians

Brussels Sprout

There appears to be conflicting reports about China's willingness to assist the Russians.

The Financial Times (who I believe are using American intelligence as their source) are stating that the Chinese have indicated that they will help.

The Chinese themselves seems to be stating that they will not.

I presume when it comes to equipment it should be pretty easy to spot any that came from the Chinese should it arrive into Ukraine.

Let's see how it pans out.

Manic Moran

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784554#Comment_118784554

Felton is getting less and less respect for his videos from other online historians. He got a shotgun blast from the Deutsches Panzermuseum for spreading incorrect information last month. It’s to the point that you have to remind yourself that he is a qualified historian and his books are well received.

SafeSurfer

Surprised to see footage attributed to the Neo Nazi Azov Regiment used on RTE Six One this evening.

liamtech

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784852#Comment_118784852

Very interesting, just read their statement on this. I do still respect Felton, but perhaps he will clarify the position in a future video. Iv watched his YT channels for years and i always love them. i think it a stretch to say he is losing much credibility, ALTHOUGH certainly that situation will have raised a few eyebrows

That said his Putin video has its sources in the description. id still value it imho

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784964#Comment_118784964

In what context?

As you have repeatedly said , context is very important.

mikewest

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784964#Comment_118784964

Why? They are a full blown part of the Ukrainian army and are saving tens of thousands of Ukrainians from being butchered by the army of the scumbag who started this war. They didn't invade any country last month, did they? They are defending their homes. RTE has every right to use footage supplied by a regiment of the Ukrainian army defending their homes from a scumbags invading army.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785026#Comment_118785026

In the context of I thought it surprising to see “footage from the Azov Regiment” appear on screen on RTE news as I would have been to see “footage courtesy of the Ku Klux Klan”.

mikewest

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785056#Comment_118785056

The Klu Klux Klan are not a regiment in anyone's army but the Azov regiment are, thanks to Putin.

And again sod off with your whataboutery.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785035#Comment_118785035

Absolutely RTE are entitled to use footage and you are entitled to defend the actions of the Azov battalion.

It could come across as a little insensitive RTE reporting on war crimes while using footage from an organisation itself accused of war crimes by the Office of the High Commissioners for human rights such as

”Another OHCHR report documented an instance of rape and torture, writing: "A man with a mental disability was subject to cruel treatment, rape and other forms of sexual violence by 8 to 10 members of the 'Azov' and 'Donbas'”

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785115#Comment_118785115

I’m sure as long as they were fighting for Ukraine you would be defending them. ISIS too probably.

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785056#Comment_118785056

A little bit of context on Azov. Politically, the far right in Ukraine have very little representation, less than most European countries. The two far-right candidates got less than 2% of the vote between them in 2014.

The Azov battalion was around 900 to 2,000 members last check, around 20% identify as far-right/Neo-Nazi. Total Ukrainian forces, including reservists is now around 1.2 million (around 1 million reservists, 125k army, 60k national guard). Which means the Azov battalion represents around 0.1% or 0.2% of the Ukrainian armed forces. I presume they would have been disbanded by Ukraine long ago, but Moscow has been waging at 8 year hybrid war on the country, so they've been sorely needed. Many are very experienced after fighting for years in S.E Ukraine.

Kremlin has zoned in on their existence to of course fabricate the lie that the Ukraine military and leadership are "Nazis"

Ironically, Russia has a larger group of nationalist paramilitaries, the Wagner group, estimated to be several thousand in total headed by a full-on Neo-Nazi (Wagner was Hitler's favorite composer). A bunch of mercenaries used by Putin to do all sorts of unpleasant things around the world, including very recently to assassinate the leader of a sovereign country.

liamtech

Has anyone seen anything concrete RE China supposedly on the verge of assisting Russia? Im baffled by this development, and the coverage seems to be jumping from denials, to speculation, more denials, and pseudo threatening noises

Is the assistance Military in nature?

Financial and economic?

Intelligence assets?

the most concrete thing iv found is that Russia has ASKED for assistance - and the US has WARNED against this?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-60732486

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/xi-jinping-faces-a-fateful-decision-on-ukraine-1.4826541

Detritus70

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785158#Comment_118785158

Well, I'm in no way defending violent scumbags, but right now Ukraine can't be picky who they chose when defending their country.

A short while ago it was announced that prisoners with combat experience would be released to help fight the Russians.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785056#Comment_118785056

They are UKRAINIANs defending Ukraine from a foreign invader.

The Ukrainian army are defending Mariupol

liamtech

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785195#Comment_118785195

Perfect. Its all summed up there. Coupled with the fact that Russia funded their opposite number, and encouraged the 'conflict' in East Ukraine since 2014. You covered it all. It is the equivalent of this analogy

• Thatcher arming Loyalist paramilitaries in 1980
• Encouraging them to 'fight to protect their britishness'
• Pointing at a surge in IRA violence that would erupt as a consequence
• Claiming that these new radical IRA 'run the government in Dublin'
• London declares that ROI represents a 'clear existential threat to the UK'
• UK launches 'Special military operation' to DE-IRA the government in Dublin - invades ROI

@Dohnjoe The above user you responded to is continuing to dance on the head of a pin with his 'thesis' - clearly aiming to avoid being banned, while simultaneously de-railing this thread completely. I have given up on said user, he is on my ignored list, and all i can do is encourage others to do likewise.

THAT SAID - an excellent well thought out post on the 'AZOV Menace' - thanks pal

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785195#Comment_118785195

Is this not exactly the type of whataboutery that others are condemned for on this thread?

I am not going to condemn the white supremacist neo Nazi Azov battalion because sure don’t Russia have the same.

That's exactly what you are saying.

I don’t see what relevance the voting performance or percentage of the Ukrainian military these neo Nazis represent. I am disappointed that RTE is giving them credibility by using their material in the same I would be disappointed if RTE credited the Wagner mercenaries for their material.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118785229#Comment_118785229

Well do you think it is difficult to credibly condemn war crimes by one side in a conflict while defending another group in the same conflict who the OHCHR have said have committed war crimes?

liamtech

https://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-war-has-russias-invasion-dented-the-friendship-that-knows-no-limits-12566174

Speculative story; China may be more than a little annoyed that Russia has called them. I think its not speculation to say their fence sitting may have been comfortable, but this story forces them to make a decision. Im following this story but to say we have only limited information, would be a MASSIVE understatement - Russia's requests reeks of desperation imho

Larbre34

Let nobody be naive about any of this.

When it comes to defending homeland territories and allies from aggressors, absolutely nobody in history has given up their right to employ bloodthirsty fanatics. The same goes as much for the Partisans of Yugoslavia, the Free French Resistance, the Milorg of Norway as well as British commandos and Japanese suicide pilots. That's just war.

If Russia is suffering losses at the hands of the nutters in the Azov Special Operations Detachment, well they've only themselves to blame. They could always **** off home.

The neo-nazi apologists always show up when Azov is mentioned, quick to point out "there's only a few of them, and anyway whatabout the Russian neo-nazis".

There is only one nation in the world with a neo-nazi formation in their armed forces. It is Ukraine.

Ukraine has the largest neo-nazi problem in Europe, this is a fact. Western journalists have been warning about it for years. Money has flooded into the region to fund these groups, foment anti-Russian sentiment, arm them. White-supremacists from all over the world have come to Ukraine to train with these groups and build relationships. These are not some cranks in their basement posting on forums, they are highly organized and now have millions of dollars of advanced weaponry.

The Guardian did a piece on the neo-nazi youth camps run by Azov - there was 60 camps in one city alone, hundreds all over the country and expanding all the time. Anyone who sais "it's only a few" has zero integrity. The people interviewed can barely keep a straight face when saying they are not neo-nazis. These youth camps cannot exist in a country without the knowledge and tacit approval of the government.

The war will end - hopefully soon - and when it does there will be right-wing groups with huge stocks of advanced weapons, manpads, javelins, god knows what else for sale to the highest bidder. Armed to the teeth by Americans to fight a proxy war against Russia, just like they armed the Mujahideen to fight the Soviets. We all remember how that turned out. This is going to be a security problem in Ukraine and Europe for decades.

We almost certainly have the wives and children of neo-nazis coming here presently. No security, no vetting, nothing.