Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

alchemist33

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436095#Comment_119436095

...from Russian rapists and murderers, you forgot to add.

johnnyskeleton

I've read the Amnesty International report very carefully to see what exactly they are saying.

“We have documented a pattern of Ukrainian forces putting civilians at risk and violating the laws of war when they operate in populated areas,” said Agnès Callamard, Amnesty International’s Secretary General. 

“Being in a defensive position does not exempt the Ukrainian military from respecting international humanitarian law.”

The most obvious observation is that while they say they have documented a pattern, they do not provide any examples to explain the specifics of situation. How close were they to the front lines? What was their military objective? Were they trying to defend the territory or were they counter attacking? In any event, anyone who has been paying even cursory attention to Ukraine will have noticed that the Ukrainian authorities try their best to evacuate civilians from any area that looks like it will become an active warzone:

https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20220706-live-ukrainian-officials-urge-mass-evacuation-as-russians-bombard-donetsk

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/7/30/ukraines-zelenskyy-announces-evacuation-of-donetsk-region

The requirement of the Fourth Geneva convention (which I think is what is being referred to as international law) is to essentially not target civilians and then to minimise, as much as possible, the risk to civilians. Evacuating civilians in advance of an attack is the most obvious and demonstrable effort to reduce civilian casualties.

The second point is that she claims that being in a defensive position does not exempt Ukraine from respecting international humanitarian law. Which is true. But it is a highly misleading statement. In the context of taking up positions in civilian areas i.e. cities and towns, being tasked with defending those cities and towns absolutely does permit the defending army to take up positions in and around those towns and cities. In fact, it would be much worse if they didn't try to defend those cities and towns.

Not every Russian attack documented by Amnesty International followed this pattern, however. In certain other locations in which Amnesty International concluded that Russia had committed war crimes, including in some areas of the city of Kharkiv, the organization did not find evidence of Ukrainian forces located in the civilian areas unlawfully targeted by the Russian military.

This, to be perfectly frank, fundamentally contradicts the headlines. It demonstrates that taking up positions in civilian areas is not in fact a pattern. It is, at best, occasional reports of such things. It is misleading to report on it being a pattern when it is clearly not, and again their own report demonstrates that Ukraine does try to avoid civilian casualties where possible.

Most residential areas where soldiers located themselves were kilometres away from front lines. Viable alternatives were available that would not endanger civilians – such as military bases or densely wooded areas nearby, or other structures further away from residential areas. In the cases it documented, Amnesty International is not aware that the Ukrainian military who located themselves in civilian structures in residential areas asked or assisted civilians to evacuate nearby buildings – a failure to take all feasible precautions to protect civilians.

It is, to put it mildly, a shirking of responsibility by Amnesty to say that they are "not aware" of this, when it is literally all over the news, as set out above. Again, no examples of same, no specifics, no request for comment from the Ukrainians as to why they did what they did, and most importantly no effort to investigate beyond the most superficial assertions. Asking military units who are kilometers away from the front lines to sleep in the woods rather than occupy an unoccupied building is madness. As for the nearby military bases, did they consider whether those bases were being used by other troops at the time i.e. they were full and so more room was needed? If Amnesty wished to prepare a fair and unbaised report, they would have considered these matters.

Survivors and witnesses of Russian strikes in the Donbas, Kharkiv and Mykolaiv regions told Amnesty International researchers that the Ukrainian military had been operating near their homes around the time of the strikes, exposing the areas to retaliatory fire from Russian forces. Amnesty International researchers witnessed such conduct in numerous locations.

So now we do get some detail, but not particularly detailed, comment on where this was happening. In Donbas, Karkiv and Mykolaiv i.e. three front line, heavily contested areas. Here is an article that specifically refers to Kharkiv where it shows the efforts to evacuate civilians and the difficulty in same due to the Russian shelling:

https://reliefweb.int/report/ukraine/under-shelling-kharkiv

In summary, 1.3m of the 1.8m residents fled. The others could not or chose not to. There were severe difficulties evacuating those with disabilities or poor mobility. Russians shelled a school that was being used as a school, and not as a military base. Most importantly, this is from the early war and shows a clear pattern - Russia comes in and bombards a civilian area, Ukraine tries to evacuate civilians and moves in troops to defend the city. It is undeniable that Ukraine has acted to reduce civilian casualties and that Russia has caused them. For Amnesty to say otherwise is completely wrong.

The mother of a 50-year-old man killed in a rocket attack on 10 June in a village south of Mykolaiv told Amnesty International: “The military were staying in a house next to our home and my son often took food to the soldiers. I begged him several times to stay away from there because I was afraid for his safety. That afternoon, when the strike happened, my son was in the courtyard of our home and I was in the house. He was killed on the spot. His body was ripped to shreds. Our home was partially destroyed.” Amnesty International researchers found military equipment and uniforms at the house next door.

This is obviously a very sad story. But what is also clear is that the family in question were trying to assist the Ukrainian defenders in the defence of their town.

Mykola, who lives in a tower block in a neighbourhood of Lysychansk (Donbas) that was repeatedly struck by Russian attacks which killed at least one older man, told Amnesty International: “I don’t understand why our military is firing from the cities and not from the field.” Another resident, a 50-year-old man, said: “There is definitely military activity in the neighbourhood. When there is outgoing fire, we hear incoming fire afterwards.” Amnesty International researchers witnessed soldiers using a residential building some 20 metres from the entrance of the underground shelter used by the residents where the older man was killed.

Again, there is no request for commentary from the Ukrainian authorities. If he wanted to know why they were firing from the cities and not from the field, there is an obvious answer - they were trying to protect Lysychansk from falling to the invading Russians, which it ultimately did. If we were to criticise Ukraine for this, as another poster said above, we may as well criticise Ukraine for not just giving up and letting the Russians take over their country. Just for balance, here is the report where it shows that the Ukranian authorities called for civilians to evacuate:

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/regional-governor-urges-civilians-evacuate-ukrainian-city-lysychansk-2022-06-27/

Obviously those people aren't to be blamed either, but the Ukranian authorities did their best to try to protect them, by advising them to evacuate.

In one town in Donbas on 6 May, Russian forces used widely banned and inherently indiscriminate cluster munitions over a neighbourhood of mostly single or two-storey homes where Ukrainian forces were operating artillery. Shrapnel damaged the walls of the house where Anna, 70, lives with her son and 95-year-old mother. 

I mean, holy Jesus, are Amnesty seriously blaming Ukraine for this?

“We have no say in what the military does, but we pay the price,” a resident whose home was also damaged in the strike told Amnesty International.

Did Amnesty follow up with this resident? Maybe ask why they didn't evacuate when told to do so? Maybe ask them on their views of the invading Russian army? No?

Amnesty International researchers witnessed Ukrainian forces using hospitals as de facto military bases in five locations. In two towns, dozens of soldiers were resting, milling about, and eating meals in hospitals. In another town, soldiers were firing from near the hospital.

A Russian air strike on 28 April injured two employees at a medical laboratory in a suburb of Kharkiv after Ukrainian forces had set up a base in the compound.

Using hospitals for military purposes is a clear violation of international humanitarian law.

If the Ukranian army was using an active hospital for military purposes, then it is a clear violation of humanitarian law. But if you read carefully what Amnesty report on, they were not doing so. They were resting, milling about and eating meals. Are Ukrainians not entitled to rest and recouperate when theyve been at the front lines? It says soldiers were firing from "near" the hospital. The report is clearly trying to imply that they were firing from the hospital, but that is just not factually true if they were "near" the hospital.

The Ukrainian military has routinely set up bases in schools in towns and villages in Donbas and in the Mykolaiv area. Schools have been temporarily closed to students since the conflict began, but in most cases the buildings were located close to populated civilian neighbourhoods 

Using schools with no pupils in them is fine.

Many of the Russian strikes that Amnesty International documented in recent months were carried out with inherently indiscriminate weapons, including internationally banned cluster munitions, or with other explosive weapons with wide area effects. Others used guided weapons with varying levels of accuracy; in some cases, the weapons were precise enough to target specific objects.

The Ukrainian military’s practice of locating military objectives within populated areas does not in any way justify indiscriminate Russian attacks. All parties to a conflict must at all times distinguish between military objectives and civilian objects and take all feasible precautions, including in choice of weapons, to minimize civilian harm. Indiscriminate attacks which kill or injure civilians or damage civilian objects are war crimes.

“The Ukrainian government should immediately ensure that it locates its forces away from populated areas, or should evacuate civilians from areas where the military is operating. Militaries should never use hospitals to engage in warfare, and should only use schools or civilian homes as a last resort when there are no viable alternatives,” said Agnès Callamard. 

How mealy mouthed of Amnesty to acknowledge at the very end the indiscriminate attacks by the Russians! As if it is a mere footnote and not the actual cause of the civilian casualties. She says that the Ukrainian authorities should evacuate civilians from areas where the military is operating. But they already do that, and it is widely reported by all non biased media. The fact that Amnesty were not aware of this is appallingly negligent, to say the least. Miilitaries shouldn't use hospitals to engage in warfare, but there is nothing in the report to say that they did. They should only use schools or civilian homes as a last resort - yeah, like they've been doing!

So in conclusion, the Amnesty International report is deeply flawed for several reasons:

1. It lacks specifics
2. There is no investigation into the reasons for certain actions or a request for comment from Ukraine
3. Amnesty's local branch were bipassed in preparing the report
4. They have ignored really important evidence such as the well documented evacuations
5. They have minimised the impact of Russian indiscriminate bombing
6. They have not said whether Russia is likewise setting up positions in urban areas (hint - they are)

I will not comment on the potential motives of Amnesty International or Agnes Callamard. I do not know enough about them. It is sufficient for me to say that the report is demonstrably wrong. But of course, there is a strong temptation to speculate as to their true motives in preparing this report. I don't think I will be donating to them any time soon however!

johnnyskeleton

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436113#Comment_119436113

Any evidence of this? Actual reports with specifics of what is alleged, and not just assertions of same by the Russian government?

pixelburp

On a related note, the head of Amnesty International in Ukraine has resigned, angered by what they saw as a problem of objectivity in the report. Props to @johnnyskeleton to take the time and deep dive into what is showing to be a potentially deeply flawed report. And as we're already seeing, is now to be used as a bludgeon to prove immorality in the heart of Ukrainians (while sidestepping the whole context for their actions of course).

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436095#Comment_119436095

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436175#Comment_119436175

Revolution 1917: your name says it all. Nostalgia for Lenin and Stalin? Your arguments are so pathetic they are hardly worth arguing against. Like your English writing skills, your posts are revealing. Maybe Russian trolling skills are on a par with their military skills.

Sorry to get personal, but there comes a point where rational, evidence-based argument is impossible.

rgossip30

https://www.reuters.com/world/head-ukraines-amnesty-office-leaves-after-group-accuses-kyiv-2022-08-06/

Something that has been covered up perhaps one should look at Ukraine for war crimes . What is not reported is that many Ukrainians have fled to Russia for safety .

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436312#Comment_119436312

https://tass.com/politics/1417543

Here is the some.

https://tass.com/politics/1490303

Kyiv shelling to Zaporozhye Nuclear Power Plant trying create nuclear disaster worst than Chernobyl in Europe.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436306#Comment_119436306

Well,again, you are mixing Amnesty International report with Western propaganda which cannot be called independent truth and I think is not correct.

Personally I trust Amnesty International more than Reuters or BBCs because I think from this Amnesty Report they are more independent than any pro governments media which already created mess and stayed quiet when events on Ukraine started in 2014.

We have understand the Russia logic . Putin not interested destroy schools, hospitals, infrastructure or killing local people on area which he want have for years.Because Russia will have spend plenty money to rebuild it and killing civilians he will only create Resistance or gorrila war.

Fighting Tao

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436421#Comment_119436421

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436444#Comment_119436444

It’s not even lunchtime on Saturday and I’ve had the greatest laugh I’ll probably have all weekend. Tass is not a news source. It is a mouthpiece for the Putin regime. It’s only believed by the brainwashed and useful idiots.

johnnyskeleton

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436421#Comment_119436421

That is not evidence that Ukraine was killing civilians. That is the estimate of the total deaths in the war in Donbas pre 2022. It is mostly military deaths with the civilian deaths at c. 3414. Most civilians died at the start of the war i.e. in 2014. There is no evidence of Ukraine targeting civilians. So even leaving aside the fact that I asked for specifics and you are just relying on Russian government assertions, it still doesn't support your stated position.

johnnyskeleton

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436465#Comment_119436465

No specific replies to the specific criticisms I made of the report, no?

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436510#Comment_119436510

Amnesty made it up .😏

comerla

These Russian trolls are pathetic - you can spot them a mile off. Any way we can get them barred from Boards? The stuff they are coming out with is offensive.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/pro-putin-trolls-supporting-the-ukraine-invasion-cant-stop-screwing-up-1392075/

ilkhanid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436036#Comment_119436036

By that standard the defence of Stalingrad in 1942 was a war crime.

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436135#Comment_119436135

"Evidence of ukraine keeping people hostages in schools? The schools were shut"

Yes but when they are attacked by the Russians as legitimate military targets and bodies are pulled out the Ukrainian PR machine sell the loss of their men to the western media as Russians deliberately attacking schools and hospitals with only civilians in them. They lie basically and its lapped up as truth in the west.

"Evidence of of Ukraine refusing to allow people leave?"

You are not told about it Odyssey. Its censored. There are hundreds of genuine testimonies of this on Telegram but below is one that is still up on youtube. It probably slipped through the algorithm because the lady, Natalia Usmanova, appeared in the guardian on the same day. The Guardian version cut out the bits in the video and in the article where she stated they were held as human shields against their will by the Ukrainian military. Those cuddly sweet Asov Battalion members in fact. This example is just one that got through. Pure narrative shaping lies.

The truth.

https://youtu.be/hYZPAfK7KO8

The lie.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/02/mariupol-evacuee-recounts-terror-in-bunkers-below-azovstal-steelworks

ilkhanid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436113#Comment_119436113

Funny. The Ukrainian refugees in the rest of Europe aren't telling people that they feel ''protected'' by the Russians.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436504#Comment_119436504

Same as you using Western media as evidence,same I using Eastern media as evidence.

ilkhanid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436071#Comment_119436071

To repeat my point: should the Red Army have left Stalingrad (and Kharkiv and Brest and Sebastopol and the other cities) and fought the Wehrmacht in the open steppe outside it? Why didn't the Red Army ''go to the fields and fight like warriors and not like terrorists hiding behind woman and children backs 'putting them lives at risk''.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436578#Comment_119436578

Wehrmacht was destroying cities to the ground before leaving.

Russian army was fighting with Wehrmacht on open fields also.

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436178#Comment_119436178

Its a war crime to use civilian areas and infrastructure as military bases. Not just old fashioned warfare.

Notmything

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119435963#Comment_119435963

Quess what, fighting in an urban area means there will be civilian/non military infrastructure all around you, it's a simple reality.

Ukraine has a choice either withdraw and don't fight, or stay and fight.

The former gives up any advantage and plays into Russian hands, the later means that inevitably some buildings will be hit/civilian casualties. But it appears that the Ukrainian army tries to evacuate the civilian population before any fighting. That's key difference.

OTOH Russia targets at random and doesn't appear to be taking any interest in reducing the risk of civilians becoming casualties.

I was listening to a podcast on this, the person had just returned from the Ukraine and he made the point that yes he saw Ukrainian troops dug in near a hospital but the hospital had be emptied and was unoccupied. So it was a hospital in name only.

20silkcut

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436092#Comment_119436092

Any chance Russian soldiers be men and go home to their wives and families

johnnyskeleton

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436577#Comment_119436577

My links support my point. Yours dont. And just to be clear, it is entirely reasonable for people like us in Ireland to consider Al Jazeera and France 24 as independent sources, which they are. And their content is specific and detailed. Putins baseless assertions are not.

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436633#Comment_119436633

This hospital was occupied according to reports so it was not evacuated . I am reminded of the misinformation that was reported during the troubles .

odyssey06

How does Russian propaganda explain this away?

The president of the Ukrainian nuclear agency said on Friday that Russian forces are using the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant in southern Ukraine as a base for storing and launching weapons.

https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20220716-live-russia-accused-of-shelling-from-zaporizhzhia-nuclear-plant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436692#Comment_119436692

Europe getting tired of war on Ukraine and Zelenskij.Those reports doesn't come to sun light without permission and reason.Same as it was just a matter of time before this report came to public there is only matter of time when your named media will start writing about things you wouldn't like believe

rodge123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436071#Comment_119436071

How about the Russian orcs **** off out of Ukraine and back to their own backward mafia run country, that would also mean no children and women need to die eh?

Notmything

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436715#Comment_119436715

I'll have to listen back to the podcast but the hospital being discussed was already empty and had been shelled previously according to the speaker.

But fwiw, I mentioned "a hospital" yet you are able to state it "was occupied". So I would love to know why you believe your reports are accurate while others are "misinformation".

But since there are more than one hospital it's entirely possible this was different one, likewise the podcast was from June so a lot has passed since then.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436113#Comment_119436113

It's a pity nobody has ever been able to find these people that the Ukrainian army was allegedly killing for 8 years: an average of 30 civilians killed each year for the last 6 by all sides (incl the renowned for respecting human rights Russians & their competent, professional local proxies) & 50% of whom killed by landmines

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437063#Comment_119437063

The number of deaths and the destroyed buildings does suggest the building was not occupied . There were reports condemning Russia for this attack as it was claimed the hospital was occupied .

ilkhanid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436605#Comment_119436605

You evaded my question. Yes, they were fighting the Wehrmacht in the open fields, but they were also fighting them in the cities, as in the examples I gave. I repeat, why was the Red Army's fight against the Germans in the houses, streets and factories of Stalingrad a heroic act, while the Ukrainian army's fight against the Russians in Mariupol and other cities is a crime? ''Wehrmacht was destroying cities to the ground before leaving'' is not an answer. In fact, Stalin resisted evacuating Stalingrad. He said ''The soldiers will fight better for a living city than a dead one''.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437336#Comment_119437336

By last news Ukrainian army loose in Mariupol and left it .The Russian builders and volunteers rebuilding city from the ground.For unknown reason Reuters and BBC avoid showing it to Western public.

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436624#Comment_119436624

Well, the biggest war crime by far is using Europe's biggest nuclear power plant as a base.

ilkhanid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437575#Comment_119437575

What is this illiterate nonsense? Are you talking about the North Korean ''volunteers''? 😁😂 Also evading the question #2.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437594#Comment_119437594

Ukrainian army brought Western propaganda to the village for provocative materials.They been using artillery to NPP hoping that Russians will answer and will open fire to village were Western propaganda members been waiting for exceptional materials to make reports how Russian artillery destroying village with innocent people in it.But Russian knew about this trick and didn't opened fire .That is the reality happened there.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437575#Comment_119437575

Mariupol and Kherson are like two war zones at the moment. There is effectively martial law, Russian troops everywhere, military checkpoints all over the place, curfews and so on....people afraid to leave their homes. Soldiers not from Moscow or St Petersburg, but the third world parts of Russia that state TV never shows, the 19th century one with all the poverty and deprivation. If this is a "liberation", then heaven help us all.

kernkraft500

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436624#Comment_119436624

correct..

however moving equipment into a recently captured area is not setting up a military base...

Also, as mentioned previously, the Ukranian's do their very best to evacuate civilians before they move in, and after they do...

It's a well know tactic of the Russian's to keep civilians in the area as a buffer to slow down any advance

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437934#Comment_119437934

Your post seems to me to be an unending stream of nonsense. Can anyone else here make any sense of what this guy says?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437934#Comment_119437934

Reality and you parted company a long time ago, comrade.

kernkraft500

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437575#Comment_119437575

any pics of this new metropolis being built? Last pics I saw (as of yesterday) they're still as flat as the Russian's left them

pixelburp

Honestly, I'd have more respect for the blatant Soviet apologists if they just admitted that yes, they want to control the grain and other natural resources. At least it's truthful, instead of this nonsense of liberation or humanitarian intervention from dastardly Nazis.

pixelburp

Has yet to be verified, and the Guardian says this, but the latest atrocity is literally out of the worst medieval savagery: a (Ukrainian?) corpse beheaded, the head placed on a spike. The geolocation coincides with a part of the country the Chechan forces had taken.

If it's true, this increasingly makes the Both Sides argument look flaccid and the nonsense it should be called out as. These are savages, apocalyptic deviants of the highest degree. Reading the troops are those from Chechnya certainly didn't surprise.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/06/footage-appears-show-head-ukrainian-pow-stuck-pole

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119438405#Comment_119438405

Dont hold your breath on the Amnesty report into this...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119438405#Comment_119438405

In 90s all Western world was calling Chechens Freedom fighters.Today Chechens fighting against Western world.Do you not afraid that Ukrainian which you calling Freedom fighters today will not start fight against Western world as Chechens together with them tomorrow ?

Because each single time those which been supported by USA, started war against USA after, making Europe pay price for it .

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439388#Comment_119439388

I'm not sure about the "freedom fighters" part. The Chechens were notorious for acts of terrorism and seizing large numbers of innocent hostages and killing them - the hospital siege in the mid 90s and then the Moscow theatre and the school in Beslan.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436545#Comment_119436545

Been saying it but got reprimanded instead. People simply do not understand that we are at war (when will it click?). And the adversary i.e. Russian mafia state is attacking us also here on boards.ie using trolls. Normal rules cannot apply for war. That's my opinion. No criticism of the volunteer mod(s).

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439610#Comment_119439610

Would you run to the front line if you had an option. Become a mercenary ?

I think we are at war is a loaded statement. If they come attacking us I'd take up arms no problem if I had to defend this beautiful island. But I don't think it's good to think the sky is falling down

McGiver

Russian state media advocated for the introduction of labor camps, repression, and the shooting of Ukrainian partisans and civilians who refuse to cooperate with Russian-appointed officials in occupied Ukrainian territories. Kremlin-affiliated outlet Komsomolskaya Pravda host Sergey Mardan encouraged an unnamed occupation authority that he interviewed on his show to recreate gulags (the notorious Soviet prison/labor camp system), confiscate private property, and shoot local teachers and partisans for refusing to cooperate with Russian-appointed authorities. The majority owner of Komsomolskaya Pravda, Sergey Rudnov, is the son of Oleg Rudnov, a childhood friend of Russian President Vladimir Putin.

https://focus.ua/voennye-novosti/524623-v-melitopole-okkupanty-hotyat-rasstrelivat-uchiteley-za-zarplaty-iz-ukrainy-video

And why? Because Ukrainians teachers refuse to submit to the occupation administration.

The Kremlin never changes its "policy" and "military strategy"...

20silkcut

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439615#Comment_119439615

Your right it’s not good to think the sky is falling down but it’s also not good to be detached from reality the way the likes of Sabina Higgins and many people in this country so obviously are. Yes the frontline is thousands of miles from us but Russia despises our way of life just as much as the Ukranian way of life.