Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538100#Comment_119538100

You are quite right timmy.. you cannot compare the Russian and US interventions....when the Russians left, they left behind a bombed out and destroyed Afghanistan. And they were big celebrations Country wide by the Afghans to celebrate the Russian withdrawal. When the US left , it was a completely different story. They left behind a functioning Country, that they has spent literally trillions of dollars on. Would they be welcome back... You can bet your bottom dollar on it that they would !!!

Brief_Lives

https://twitter.com/jayinkyiv/status/1564264919125696514?s=21&t=llGc1Dhkykvn6JCrKbFE9g

NSFW

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119537016#Comment_119537016

So all the destruction of cities, infrastructure, Hospitals, civilian population center's is being accomplished without the use of missiles, rockets, bombs etc? Are we supposed to ignore all of that destruction?

paul71

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538352#Comment_119538352

Before moving on to another lie please respond to the previous fictional claim you made.

You stated NGOs found no evidence of rape by the Russian army. So which NGO and which report?

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538352#Comment_119538352

The did not "Steal " it, They are holding it for the Afghan People, to whom it right fully belongs. What would happen to it if the Taleban got their hands on it? You think that the ordinary Afghan would ever benefit from it? Under the previous Afghan government, that money was feely available to them, to use as they saw fit, as it should be.

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119537251#Comment_119537251

For the benefit of others......

Here is second 28 of the video. There is no visual of the grilled fins.

Here is the rear of a loaded Tochka U Transporter with a visual of the grilled fins of the Tochka U Missile.

That grainy footage proves nothing.

bobowen

And in case theres any doubt that these transporters can't be used for anything but Tochka U Missiles here they are loading other military objects.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538665#Comment_119538665

Please stop lying - it makes you look foolish. Here is a screen grab at 28 seconds.

Try to find another Russian vehicle with those precise 2 indentations over the road side front wheel followed by the large grille.

I note none of the vehicles you pictured do.

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538722#Comment_119538722

I really can't see what your trying to do here. You mean this grill and these 2 indentations being used to transport a crate?

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538539#Comment_119538539

They absolutely are planning on "stealing" it. They want to pay it out to American families. They should be holding it in escrow until such time as the Taliban are out of power of course, and indeed not a soul in Afghanistan in need would ever benefit from it.

The US is not a perfect, or even particularly good player on the international scene. But so what? Again, it is utterly irrelevant.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538754#Comment_119538754

Correct: find another vehicle besides the 9P129 with those 2 indentations in that pattern followed by the large grille on the driver's side/road side (& of course, unlike the vehicles you've referenced, it obviously needs to match the bulk of the 9P129).

I'll be waiting for your response.

Edit: and for bonus points, the vehicle needs to have the same rear end too - as seen here at 27 seconds

bobowen

I think you are not understanding what I'm trying to say to you.

I've showed you a picture of the transporter that is SOMETIMES used to transport and launch Tochka U missiles. Its called a 9T218 tactical transloader.

My point is that your video at second 28 shows no Tochka U missile on the transporter. All you have is a video of a 9T218 driving along a highway.

I then posted photo's of the 9T218 transporting other military equipment like radars and crates. Proving that they are not only used for launching the Tochka U. Therefore your video is not proof of Russians transporting Tochka U missiles but merely a video of a 9T218 driving down a highway.

Do you understand?

I'll be waiting for your response.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538876#Comment_119538876

But you haven't proved there was no tochkas on the launcher .

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538886#Comment_119538886

And you haven't proved that there was. If you claim that something is true you must prove it.

Its like asking me to prove that God doesn't exist.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538916#Comment_119538916

You made the claim,

But yet haven't provided any evidence to prove your claims.

Can you prove there was no tochkas on the launchers .

No .

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538922#Comment_119538922

You seem to be trying to cause a distraction here from our main argument.

I didn't make the claim. Someone posted a video on Twitter CLAIMING that Russians are transporting Tochka U missiles. That CLAIM was used by Fash to prove that the Russians were using Tochka U's around the time of the Kramatorsk bombing.

The video shows no such thing. Therefore the twitter video and Fash's claims are unproven. The onus of proof is on the person making the claim.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538963#Comment_119538963

But you cannot prove otherwise ,

Googling Russian military transporters anyone can do that ,

,it doesn't mean you actually have any real knowledge on the subject.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538876#Comment_119538876

1. The vehicle pictured in the video clip is not a 9T218 transportation loader - which, amongst other differing features, doesn't have the 2 indents over the drive side front wheel, has different windows to the side by the driver, has an entirely different rear end and is a lower vehicle.

Here is the 9T218:

http://www.rwd-mb3.de/pages/9t218.htm

The vehicle in the clip at 28 seconds is the 9P129 launcher unit.

2. Both the 9P129 and the 9T218 transporter loader are for carrying and launching Tochka-U rockets (the rockets one can see in the trucks in the video clip). They aren't used for joy-riding, going for trips to the super market or other purposes.

Edit: here is a picture of the 9T218 in front of a 9P129. Spot the differences on the rear of the vehicles. Also have a guess at what these, the Tochka-U transport loader and Tochka-U launch vehicle, are carrying (hint, it's the big thing that looks like a rocket):

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538886#Comment_119538886

His argument is that "who knows what could be inside the convoy of 8 Russian V-marked 9P129 Tochka-U launch vehicles together with multiple KamAZ trucks carrying rocket pods in the rear traveling back from the Kyivan front through Belarus in March 2022: it might be Tochka-U rockets, it might be Christmas presents from Santa".

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119539069#Comment_119539069

I had a feeling ,

Another but ,but ,but type poster

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119539069#Comment_119539069

They were carrying 'Christmas presents from Santa' that they stole from Ukrainian homes, including cutlery, washing machines, TVs, computers, etc. Or at least some of the burnt out Russian vehicles were found to contain such loot.

Strazdas

Apparently Ukraine are asking journalists and people on social media not to post any information about the (presumed) counter attack - no details or place names or anything that might help the Russians. This media blackout probably explains why we have heard very little about what is going on or what progress has or hasn't been made today.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538352#Comment_119538352

When the Taliban controlled Afghanistan before sept 11, why did they not use the billions they were making from drugs and diamond sales to improve the lot if Afghans? And yes they were making millions. I remember when Mullah Omar forbade the sale of opium from the poppy fields for awhile, until the scarcity drove prices sky high, then he allowed it to be harvested and sold again at the higher prices. Do you think that the ordinary Afghans benefitted from this "Business Enterprise"? And what makes you think that now it will be different? The Taliban have an army to support as well, and that will be their priority, otherwise they will lose their support.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538087#Comment_119538087

They also claim that there were no drone strikes in afghanistan because trump was president. So its a case of schrodinger's drone strikes

ilkhanid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119536844#Comment_119536844

I've learned to close down any page where that invidious prattle about ''false flags'' rears its head. Whether Moscow, Moscow apologists or Alex Jones its a particularly pathetic and desperate kind of trick used when defending the indefensible runs out of steam.

Gatling

Looks like Zelensky doesn't agree with the above statement about his country being a rump state ......

There's been a suggestion of a possibility of Ukraine taking 20,000 russian POWs in the next few weeks

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1564360633742725120?s=20&t=B-eikLmiOvadLaZlH_WZ9Q

ilkhanid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538326#Comment_119538326

There are those who would claim that at least the Taliban brought order to Afghanistan (even it can't bring law, administration, education and a functioning economy). It seems that they can't even bring that , considering the bombings and the unceasing struggle against IS.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119539855#Comment_119539855

Something big is definitely going down around Kherson. We haven't seen a Ukrainian media blackout to this degree for months, perhaps at all during this entire war.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119539916#Comment_119539916

Yes they did, They managed to stop the warlords fighting, which was destroying what was left of the Country after the Russians had finished with it. And indeed, in the beginning they were welcomed. But then that quickly changed when their brutal version of Islam took over. As one Afghan said to me " Why are they claiming they are bringing the real Islam to Afghanistan? We Afghans have always been for Allah?" And that was the sentiment, and when the Taliban was forced out after Sept11, many were killed in revenge for what they had done while in power. They did nothing good for the people, and neither will they now. As for isis, and their tactics, these self same tactics were used by the Taliban to prevent the US from helping Afghanistan become a successful independent Country. Now they are a thorn in the Taliban side, who even armed to the teeth with the best US weaponry are unable to eradicate them. Meanwhile, poor Afghanistan suffers all over again.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119538758#Comment_119538758

Yes, from the 7 billion the US are holding belonging to Afghanistan, Biden has said that 50% has been freed up for humanitarian aid to Afghanistan, and the balance is being held pending legal action by families due to Sept 11. If the Taliban had control over this money, where would it be by now?? And it is being handed over ($204 million in march) but not to the Taliban, but to reputable organizations who over see its expenditure.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119540310#Comment_119540310

So they're only stealing half so its ok?

I think its pretty despicable behaviour but nonetheless, its irrelevant to the topic at hand and trying to handwave away Russian atrocities by saying "America did XYZ" is transparent whataboutery.

fash

https://twitter.com/GlasnostGone/status/1564511096236539909?s=20&t=kEH-yb0GBIor0i7FGsw-XQ

According to morgue data alone 87k of 450k civilians in Mariupol exterminated by the Russians - excludes those not yet found/buried under rubble/cremated by the Russians/taken away by the Russians and executed elsewhere etc etc.

Brief_Lives

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1564435855900655618

Some Kherson news..

johnnyskeleton

Mod note:

Sorry I wasnt around yesterday:

1. Afghanistan is not on topic;

2. If you assert something, you should provide evidence for it and engage meaningfully. Dont assert something, then demand others to disprove it, then change the goalposts of what you are looking for.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119540716#Comment_119540716

Yes, I agree that its just another example of "Whataboutery". but as for they are only stealing half of the 7 billion, I'd imagine that that 7 billion came originally from the trillions the US spent in Afghanistan, but that's beside the point, it was earned income, regardless of the source, and I agree that it should be handed back to Afghanistan but under absolutely no circumstances back to the Taleban..No way !!

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119540882#Comment_119540882

They have also started to demolish buildings that contain bodies from missles strikes and other weapons to cover up any evidence against themselves

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119539052#Comment_119539052

"They aren't used for joy-riding, going for trips to the super market or other purposes."

Here you go Princess. A photo with your exact specifications including your beloved indents and even one with a driver side angle being used for a trip to the supermarket or maybe other purposes. The one below is also a BAZ-5921 fitted out with something other than a Tochka U.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119541886#Comment_119541886

Wrong on both:

The first doesn't have 2 over driver/road side wheel indents; nor does it have correct 9P129 rear end - as seen in the video clip (look at the sections at the wheel wells).

The second one doesn't show either of these details, but doesn't look like a 9P129 as e.g. the non-road/driver side on the 9P129 would only have 1 indent (plus 4 protruding circles).

This is getting kinda pathetic at this point- I was expecting at least some effort after you took so much time to respond - and you haven't even started on the list of confirmations from DPR / Strelkov /various Russians on their use of Tochka-U rockets yet.

Brief_Lives

an interesting tweet... how much of it can you trust?

https://twitter.com/LlopisMarta95/status/1564504582742491137?t=RIxODGoclvoGPIhP6gFqdg&s=19

Brief_Lives

some technical info on weaponry being used.

https://twitter.com/Osinttechnical/status/1564542744156147712?s=20&t=XlJhWIaY4cRwhUY4-LGy7A

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119542055#Comment_119542055

You know what it is pathetic. You've been shown the exact vehicle that was on the highway and you still stubbornly maintain that its not the same vehicle. You have no evidence of Russians with a Tochka U in transit or preparing for launch. I humoured you and went down a pointless rabbit hole of proving to you that those particular BAZ vehicle models are used for a multitude of uses. Everyone can see that you keep moving the goalposts in a desperate attempt to avoid being proven wrong.

Any neutral observer would agree that the vehicle above is the same vehicle as the one in your grainy twitter video. Its beyond parody that it is being insisted upon as proof that the Russians bombed a Train station of a territory populated with their own native speakers that they are trying to liberate. Almost as bad as trying to say the Russians would be stupid enough to write "for the Children" in Russian on one of their own rockets.

But such is the incredible amount of denial in this Ukrainian war of propaganda.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119542284#Comment_119542284

B****it. Again, please stop lying:

Here, again, are the 2 photos from 27 & 28 seconds- showing the twin indents on the driver side and the distinctive 9P129 "wheel well" at the rear.

Your first vehicle has neither.

Your second vehicle conveniently doesn't show either detail and the details it does show are different to the 9P129.

The 9P129 is used exclusively for launching Tochka-U rockets - and you can see the rockets in the KamAZ trucks in the convoy.

By definition this is evidence that Russia is using Tochka-U rockets.

Whether you think it sufficient is a separate story - although I would note that even with incredibly weak evidence, any reasonable person will believe Russia continues to use Tochka-Us rather than- as you would have everyone believe - Russia decided to retire their gigantic stockpile of Tochka-Us to a retirement home somewhere in Vladivostok (while they pull 50 year old T-62s out of storage and run out of rockets).

And again, this is only one of many, many clips of the 9P219 being used by the Russians and you haven't even addressed the various statements by Russians confirming usage of the Tochka-Us either.

EDIT to add: it was you who stated that there was no evidence the Russians were TRANSPORTING Tochka-Us - now you, again despite the Mod warning, shift goalposts to "this is supposed to prove bombing!?".

As regards the Russian "for the children", the Russian grammar is better translated as "on behalf of the children" - the Russian soldiers- initially at least- believing the rubbish fed to them by Putin.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119542071#Comment_119542071

I must say I'm not a fan of recording POWs regardless of their background. Recording them ringing their relatives especially.

bobowen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119542409#Comment_119542409

Now you're plumbing the depths. You know well the second indent in my photo is obscured by the ladder. Its the same vehicle. The wheel well with the fan indent on each side of the rear is there. Its the same vehicle adapted for a different use which you ridiculously keep on trying to say doesn't happen.

Brief_Lives

So the Ukrainians have got their HARM missile interfaced with their MIG 29's via a Garmin GPS...

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarplanePorn/comments/x1f5et/ukraine_mig29_firing_harm_missile_1080x596/

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119542657#Comment_119542657

Rubbish: the angle of the ladder is in front of the location where the more forward indent would be, plus the indent would be far larger than the ladder side rail. Furthermore, the overall disposition of indents all along the side are incorrect.

As regards the rear section, the 9P129 rear is distinctive (as shown in the video and just Google images and drawings of the vehicle) - you now admit yours is different but suggest your image shows something "adapted for a different use".

Considering that various vehicles are based on the BAZ-5921 (in the case of the 9P129) or other BAZ-59xx platforms , the differences that are important. Further as regards the (laughable) idea that they "adapt these for use" - that's what they do in the factory prior to making the relevant vehicle. Aside from "cope cages" Russians don't go around changing delivery trucks to look exactly like 9P129 Tochka-U launcher vehicles while at the same time claiming not to use them.

Edit: here also a video clip of 2 V marked 9P129s (despite the fact that some (but not all) in Russia suggest they were retired in 2019 - 3 years before "V" marking was developed: .

https://youtu.be/ajhkYui0kOI

Brief_Lives

Ukrainian weapons

https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1564616657753997329?s=19

Quin_Dub

##Mod Note##

bobowen & fash

Drop it and move on , both of you.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119542071#Comment_119542071

When they have the highest suicide and accident rate in the world during basic training and first year of service, why would their officers balk about killing them if they become incapacitated?? Google "Russian military Hazing deaths "

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119542759#Comment_119542759

Not so sure,I think the GPS is just that an off the shelf gps for finding locations ,it's been discussed for years on here how Russia was using handheld Garmin's when flying missions over Syria,

Harm missles find their target by locking on to electronic transmissions coming from surface to air defense radars