Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119747259#Comment_119747259

I am genuinely surprised and heartened by these particular numbers:

I would have thought that those numbers would have been far higher across the board and especially in India

amandstu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119747858#Comment_119747858

I would have supported the secession of some territory at the outset of this stage of the conflict but the Ukranians have earned **the right to make their own choice (as well as the support from their neighbours and allies).

Their fight but we need them to succeed.

** they already had that right but they have turned that right into a practical result .They are an example to the rest of the world and I hope the Putins of this world are sweating a little clammier as a result.

fly_agaric

(IMO) the public opinion figures from non-Western/non-European countries in that Guardian article are mostly indicative of lack of interest.

A "what's this got to do with me/us" attitude to a distant European war involving people they don't identify with at all or think much about day to day, rather than some kind of support for Russia's position and actions or wholesale swallowing of the Russian propaganda. I can't really blame them much for this, it's very human.

Another interesting one was I think:

Significantly, all 25 countries around the world showed strong, generally majority support for the view that it was Russian imperialism and status that lay behind the war.

Uboat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119481450#Comment_119481450

Of course Ukraine was founded by collapse of USSR.

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119742105#Comment_119742105

no link ??

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119750715#Comment_119750715

Lots of places: e.g. https://github.com/favstats/uaconflict_equipmentloss

https://github.com/leedrake5/Russia-Ukraine

Oryx also links through - will see if I can find. There was a recent "month by month" where the relative % broken down by equipment type (artillery, tank, IFV etc) was set out in a simple to read format.

https://twitter.com/alfabetaceta5/status/1581422412704649216?s=20&t=midjoeWSj6iFmoez9hISxA

From Lee Drake's analysis of Oryx dataset

pixelburp

28 drones struck Kyiv today; 'kamikaze' drones (whose origin is perhaps Iran?), all of whom targeted at civilian and civilian buildings. Bizarre photos & videos coming out of the city of police, militia and civvies all aiming weapons at the sky to try and shoot down the drones.

Maybe this is the new Russian commander using the experience gleaned from his Syrian campaign; either way, it's utterly unconscionable and naked attacks on non-combatant, civilian targets. It only continues the parallel with Hitler, having his "doodlebugs" launched at London in a petulant attempt at revenge.

One of the buildings attacked today by drones was the central control building for Ukraine's electricity network. Apparently it's the centre that coordinates and monitors the entire electricity grid.

Apparently the drones only cost $800 to produce their guidance system is basically a mobile phone and I'm pretty sure the engine is a Chinese clone of either a Honda or Suzuki motorcycle engine.

If the above cost is true, it means for the cost of just one HIMARS rocket ($150,000) you could buy 187 suicide drones. So expect to keep seeing plenty of footage of them in action.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119757495#Comment_119757495

Drones are certainly going to grow exponentially as a force from here on in. As well as their cost there is no pilot to worry about getting captured behind enemy lines which takes out a lot of political risks.

Even now the term drone seems a little broad. The Ukrainians had the Bayraktar, which was a great help to them earlier on but that's on an order of scale larger than the Iranian drones, which itself is on an order of magnitude larger than the off-the-shelf drones that have been used for surveillance, basic bombing and guiding artillery.

In the span of history this war will probably be looked back on as the first major conflict where drones really came into their own (They were used in the Armenia-Azerbaijan war 2 years ago too but that was a much shorter and smaller conflict than this). This war will be to drones as what World War 1 was to fighter aircraft.

bear1

Seems that senior politicians in Israel are calling on the country to provide arms to Ukraine. If that happens then that's two middle Eastern countries involved in the war.

Also, fighter jet crashed into an apartment block in Russia near Ukraine.

nigeldaniel

Ben Wallace seems to be worried about something possibly in relation to Ukraine, as he is making an unexpected and hastily arranged trip to Washington.

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119750825#Comment_119750825

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119750825#Comment_119750825

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119742105#Comment_119742105

When the US donating 56 billion + equipment gains are going to be high . Your chart does not show Ukraine losses on the battlefield unless you believe them to be an invincible army .

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778474#Comment_119778474

The US pumped 2 Trillion into Afghanistan and their army was overrun by men in with rocket launchers, pickup trucks and machine guns

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778499#Comment_119778499

The American Army is not fighting in Ukraine - the Ukrainians are.

The Ukrainians are not fighting Afghan tribes men, they are fighting a Russian Army that is poorly equipped and poorly managed. Remember, the Afghans defeated the Russians as well, and they also defeated the British when they tried to take over - but quite a while ago.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778474#Comment_119778474

Actually, if you actually look at the links, yes it does consider Ukrainian losses (which are also tracked by Oryx)

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778534#Comment_119778534

Not really sure what point of mine you are disagreeing with here. I was countering the trope that Ukrainian successes are a given because they have received a lot of help from the USA - the Afghan army received a lot more military equipment and disintegrated as soon as they entered into battle with an opponent who was nowhere near as well equipped as the Russian army is. Pumping money into an army isn't going to lead to success if the troops aren't up for the fight.

pixelburp

Russia really ramping up attacks on Ukrainian energy structures, with 30% of the country struggling with power apparently. Including my sometimes mentioned colleague; they've been without power for about 4 to 6 hours a day.

With the arrival of a typically harsh, dangerously cold winter it's obvious what the intent of Putin's Syrian butcher is here. Freeze the civilians, let them die in the cold. Truly the actions of liberators.

Though I'm also seeing tacit threats by GOP Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy that if they win the midterms they'll scale back Ukrainian support. Quoting domestic priorities though if the Democrats gave a baby a kiss, the GOP would likely punch it in the face just to do something different.

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778610#Comment_119778610

They only publish military hardware losses .

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782279#Comment_119782279

Indeed - although those hardware losses contained Russian soldiers & Russian losses of personnel would be higher/significantly higher than Ukraine (and Ukraine has better training, leadership, morale, communications, intel, medical care and professionalism).

bear1

Russian defence minister made a few calls to the west yesterday stating that Ukraine is going to launch a dirty bomb and couldn't provide any evidence to back it up.

Ukraine believes this is the start of a false flag, this and the accusations that the dam just outside Kherson is mined is going to drastically change the direction of the war. If it comes to pass obviously.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119785755#Comment_119785755

I saw this: I've also seen mention (albeit from one source) that "officers" were being hurried out of Kherson as the Ukrainians make rapid advance, leaving only paltry forces. Civilians too are supposedly being removed from the city.

Kherson was the first, largest city to fall to Russia, right? It'd be some symbol of failure if that city returns to Ukrainian control. I'm not naturally conspiratorial but I'm looking at all those disparate elements and worried things are about to take a nasty turn, the Russians making an especially rash move they can't walk back.

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782960#Comment_119782960

Are you a UN or military observer or you just read AFU propaganda .

bear1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119785791#Comment_119785791

The first and only major city they've taken and estimates are that they may lose that city this week.

If that happens then the Ukrainians will have taken back control of the water supply to Crimea which I imagine if it isn't blown up, they'll switch off.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119786189#Comment_119786189

Even the Russians soldiers admit the above: no training, most know they've no reason to be there, multiple infighting "war lords" - Kadyrov, Russian military, Wagner, fully aware their leaders don't care about them & that they are fodder, standard Russian battle tactics, no equipment - etc. etc.

Pete_Cavan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119786560#Comment_119786560

Your last sentence is what makes the current situation so dangerous, losing water supply to Crimea is no a disincentive to blowing the dam as the Russians believe they will lose the water anyway.

Hungry Burger

At this stage I’d call this a proxy war between NATO and Russia, you don’t see Joe Biden calling for peace talks or the like because I think the Yanks think that this is an opportunity to end Russia, or at the very least end Putin. Worth the billions of dollars of aid I suppose…

Fighting Tao

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119786816#Comment_119786816

What purpose would Biden have for calling for peace? 1. It is not his war, and; 2. Russia have made it clear they don’t want to talk peace.

fash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119787216#Comment_119787216

Exactly: Russia wants genocide, the subjugation of Ukraine & re-establishment of the Russian empire, the overturning of the "rules based order" of international law, human rights etc.

They maintain those demands - what is there to discuss other than how best to bring about the capitulation of Russia?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119787246#Comment_119787246

What exactly is the rules based international order, and who exactly is in charge of setting those rules?

To me, it seems like an attempt by Western countries, especially America to impose their will on other nations. Primarily those on the eastern side of the globe and South America.

What is there to discuss? How about not starting a nuclear war that could potentially lead to the death of billions?

I thought here in Ireland we would be against such a war as we already know what it is like to have a large portion of our population starve to death, which is a likely outcome if there was an all-out nuclear war.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119787216#Comment_119787216

How do you know that Russia wouldn't be open to peace talks? And I strongly disagree it is possible for America and other NATO countries to call for peace in Ukraine because our nations are the ones that are supplying the Ukrainian military with the majority of their equipment and we are providing indirect support by training their military and direct support by providing their commanders with real time intelligence on Russian forces. I have no doubt that Ukraine would do whatever we asked them to do.