Is it time to join Nato

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407213#Comment_120407213

Absolutely, but what does Ireland gain by joining NATO or spending money on a couple of inadequate second hand jets?

Other than make itself a target to get hit at the same time as any attack on the UK.

Thelonious Monk

it's great not having to spend any money on defense because UK/EU/USA are our allies, but why should we reap all the rewards of being western allies while not contributing to the security of it all whatsoever? if the rest of europe took our stance, vlad would be in paris by now and pensions would be the least of their worries

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407247#Comment_120407247

What level of force do you think would make any difference?

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407257#Comment_120407257

But joining NATO doesn't protect Ireland from being attacked when there is no reason to attack Ireland in the first place. If a member of NATO though Ireland becomes the soft target that makes it worth a test attack to see if NATO does actually respond.

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407322#Comment_120407322

What reason does anyone such a Russia have to invade Ireland?

Zico

No never, we're not joining NATO.

But we should not be militarily neutral and we should be arming up and sending weapons to Ukraine.

saabsaab

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407334#Comment_120407334

Treu we should be able to defend ourselves at least on a basic level. I don't think we need join NATO.

ittakestwo

No motive for Ireland to be invaded. The only country that ever did regrets the day they did.

Paronia and west brits wanting us to be a little Britain by getting involved in other nations disputes seem to be the rational put forward today for joining nato. We have saved a fortune by staying out. The world needs more neutral countries. The fact is russia sees nato as a threat. It was effectively set up to be an anti russia organisation. Why would Ireland get involved in that.

tinytobe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407132#Comment_120407132

I don't doubt it, if they want it badly enough for whatever strategic reason.

Zico

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407381#Comment_120407381

We're already involved in a supra-national defence accord in the Lisbon treaty as members of the EU.

We do very little to protect ourselves and our neighbours and it should be cause for great shame. It could cost is a lot more to be the easiest point of access to Europe's Western flank. Aggressors don't respect neutrality.

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407429#Comment_120407429

Which countries could attack that western flank of Europe without going past an NATO member who would be very interested in ensuring that the western flank of Europe isn't taken by a hostile force?

UK, France, Spain, Iceland. After that you have massive oceans to get across for any invading force and no way to secure those lines.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407381#Comment_120407381

LOL the British ruled here for 800 years, used our resources and people to help build their empire, completely changed our culture so that Ireland is now just an insecure version of England and still have control of the North East. I doubt the Brits have a single regret, I doubt they have a single regret

Its funny how Irish people like to give it socks like we were all a population of Dan Breens, when the reality is most of us were, and are, as complacent as ****, hence this "Sure, why would we join NATO?" nonsense.

With Finland and Sweden safely tucked away in NATO, Ireland will be the only non NATO European country that Russia can reach, They will **** with us.

ittakestwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407429#Comment_120407429

We do alot for our neighbours at war. Look at the amount of Ukrainians we have taken in. We have taken in far more per head than the UK. I rather Ireland help in this way than go out and supply bullets to kill Russian teenagers.

"Aggressors don't respect neutrality" can you give an example where a country invaded another neutral country it had no historical connection with.

maninasia

The point is they can just do what they want injtially at least. And Ireland is part of the EU and a soft target.

Serious countries dont let that happen.

They dont leave themselves open like that.

Zico

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407461#Comment_120407461

Mass murder of civilians, torture, rape of women and children doesn't deserve any defence unless it's at the Hague International Criminal Court.

robinph

Ireland will be the only non NATO European country that Russia can reach, They will **** with us.

How does Russia reach Ireland and hold it? They are unable to have decent supply lines over land to their next door neighbour. How do they do that over the top and around Europe?

yrreg0850

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118703673#Comment_118703673

Before we got our own coastguard choppers, The RAF in association with the RNLI also supplied our search and rescue service.

85603

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407251#Comment_120407251

We spent 77m (govt only) on supplies to Ukraine.

And took in 10's of thousands of refugees. Gave medical transfers and hospital spaces.

We're a net contributor to the EU, and therefore EU defense, which opposes Vlad.

We're signed up to csdp. And we take part in csdp missions.

So clearly we dont have to align with nato to be a force for good in Europe.

Zico

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407455#Comment_120407455

Russian media threatened an off shore nuclear strike off our coast.

It's state controlled so it's a threat direct from Putin.

ittakestwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407460#Comment_120407460

They have just had a border put through their own country and folded on every big decision with the EU because of the north. They have a sectarian basketcase region that costs them 14bn a year to keep and as a treat of civil war there should they rock the boat there. Of course today london regrets **** on their own door step regarding Ireland.

ittakestwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407444#Comment_120407444

You haven't woken up one day in your life to that and we are not in Nato. You obviously take substances because you're paranoid AF

ittakestwo

So russia hates nato which is understandable as it was effectively set up as an anti Russian organisation. So their logic will be because we hate nato we will attack a non Nato neutral country that we have no historical connection with..... Keep smoking what ever you are lads.

85603

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407381#Comment_120407381

I dont know about the west Brit angle, but I suspect a crossover between the local 'pro-nato' types and the gun nutter demographic.

Call of duty players. War nerds.

Zico

When Nord Stream 1 and 2 were taken out it was a crude warning of what Russia could do with transatlantic telecommunications cables.

Another direct threat to Ireland.

When the dust settled on this Russian disaster we need to properly defend our territory.

85603

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407493#Comment_120407493

Yeah but we helped uk alot during ww2.

Besides, if they hadnt robbed the place bare we might have been able to do it ourselves.

ittakestwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407562#Comment_120407562

Putin has been in for over 20 years. He annaxed part of Georgia in 2008 and Crimia in Ukraine in 2014. Both those places and the parts of ukraine annexed last year, the people are majority part of the Russian nation. There is no Russian nation of people living in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407444#Comment_120407444

Are you happy for your children to join the fight, or be conscripted to some other war in future?

Ireland is a militarily neutral country. Any attempts by politicians in this country to get us involved in NATO or wars that don't involve us = treason.

Anybody else who wants to go fight Russia in Ukraine is completely free to do so. They're actively recruiting. Leave our country and neutrality out of it, though.

ittakestwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407600#Comment_120407600

They have a big historical connection with the Ukraine. You do realise up untill 1991 Ukraine and Russia were part of the same country. You do realise about 30% of the Ukraine population are part of the Russian nation. We just dont have that connection. The only country we have any connection with like that is Britain.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407575#Comment_120407575

Ant-Russian lol, away with ye to clare dalys facebuke page.

Russia hates NATO because it prevents Russia from **** with NATO members. Now is not not the time to be the only European country that Russia can **** with without having to go through NATO territory first

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120407507#Comment_120407507

Of course Norway, UK, Iceland, Canada and the US would all fail to notice the mass of ships making their way out of Murmansk and wouldn't touch the lines of ships. This presumably only can happen during the summer as well.

Ireland pretty much is surrounded by NATO, and with the added benefits of big oceans. The only country which would be capable of launching an over sea invasion of anywhere is the US, and even then it would be very tricky to hold going past hostile other countries on the way. Russia didn't manage to take and hold that uninhabited island with a handful of Ukrainians positioned on it. And that is in Russias backyard with limited hostile navy's present.

There is no way Russia could supply an invading force. They can't fly in, they can't secure sea lanes, and there isn't anything worth trying to claim in Ireland anyway.

The risks to Ireland are cyber terrorism. Not invading Russians with guns.