Switching electric/gas providers (see first post for links)

raclle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204090#Comment_120204090

I presume you're been sarcastic here?

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228060#Comment_120228060

Not in the slightest but i don't think this is the thread for it. It's bargain alerts not an energy forum. I've no interest in derailing the thread any further.

cena

My contract is up in march. These whole smart quotes I am getting online I do not understand them. I just want the cheapest electric price I can get No pre pay

lpool2k05

If these companies buy gas up to 18 months in advance why do prices go up immediately when current price of gas goes up! Surely they wouldnt be paying that price for months so why should we

raclle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228156#Comment_120228156

Fair enough but your point is presumptuous at best. Would it not be better to talk about it here where smart plans are being discussed?

Dodge

Not for most people in fairness. People want the cheapest rate for them and their family. How that rate comes about is immaterial

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229501#Comment_120229501

Smart meter plans are not the best plans for most people. A 24hr rate or Day/Night rate is.

Time of Use plans I believe are the right policy moving forward. They will effectively become mandatory at some point. I'll avoid them for the foreseeable future as they're not good for my pocket. I don't think this thread is the best place to talk about policy.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228010#Comment_120228010

It is related to a lack of capacity. At any point the grid is going to use the cheapest source of power, when demand increases at peak they have to use more expensive sources of power as well.

As the previous poster says, variable pricing will become the norm, if people want to use power at peak periods then let them pay for it. However, the only thing relevant to this thread is that smart tariffs at present are actually not very competitive for users.

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229637#Comment_120229637

This is the bit I don't get about the smart plans. Take Electric Ireland for reference. 47.46c between 5pm and 7pm while it is more expensive to produce electricty and 44.51c outside of peak times whilst the grid uses the cheapest source of power.

I can't help but think there should be a bigger difference. And I think there will be over time but not in a way that favours consumers. The off peak rate will likely stay high but the peak rate will increase further to make it look like the consumer is getting value from avoiding peak usage.

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120230718#Comment_120230718

At the moment the majority of customers are on standard plans. Hence, there is an element of subsidizing going on. It will take time (several years) for the differential to translate into the unit prices for residential customers.

The move to smart meters (in the long run) should benefit consumers who ultimately change their energy habits. If you don't, it will hurt your pocket. The richer you are, the easier it will be to modify your electricity profile. Hence, considerable grants etc. need to be made available. The goal is carbon neutral not cheaper electricity.

Suppliers will, of course, try and maximise profits. There will certainly be an element of what you're suggesting happening. The hope would be competition stops it. Its something that needs to be figured out, i do agree.

Padraig Mor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229637#Comment_120229637

Again, more of the Kool Aid. Working families don't "want" to use power at peak hours, they have no choice but to do so; peak pricing is simply gouging from a captive market while implying workers and their families use power irresponsibly.

mp3ireland2

Is anybody on pinergy? The EV Rate seems good but heard you have to pay high prices first few months based on their estimated usage, it'll end up as credit but seems a bit odd. Also heard they are slow to issue bills and payments come out before you see a bill.

THey have reasonable standing charge, a cheap EV rate and good Feed in Tarrif of 25 cents, paid monthly.

theintern

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120196631#Comment_120196631

I just called them and told them that I wanted to cancel my switch to EI, as I was going to stay with Energia. Then she offered it to me straight away to keep going with the switch. Normal phone number, no special retention line etc. I guess I was lucky.

bailey99

In contract for another four weeks with Energia with 41% discount so 26.22 cents excl vat. Very significant price jump after that tho. Looking at a 50% increase pre vat.

What provider gives you one free day a week?

pm.

I think 24 hour meter is the best rate with EI at 41 cent Inc vat

walterking

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120226284#Comment_120226284

Hedging is what you are talking about. Most large companies do it. Ryanair are specialists at it on oil.

Large business accounts can lock in gas & electricity rates for up to 3 years. Small business can lock in for 2 years. Residential customer can do the same for 12 months and sometimes 24months. But fixed rates are normally a little higher than variable, so residential and small businesses tend to look at the short-term price and stay with variable.

In March 2021 the 2 year fixed rate from energia for small business was 16.8c, the variable rate was 14.6c. I was told I should stay on variable by my accountant, but I went with fixed and I've paid 16.8c since (changes in 4 weeks).

I know a family owned group of 3 pubs that fixed around the same time and also a local retailer that is also on fixed at a similar rate.

So the media who are trying to stir things up to say residential are subsidising big business don't have a clue. Fixing was and is open to everyone and I assure you I'm a small business as are the other businesses I know.

But residential prices will start falling soon as the gas used for generation will be averaged out and with prices €50-€60 per mwh since mid Dec, the average price paid is falling rapidly and that will lead to price drops from April/May.

Remember, prices only rose about 3 months after gas jumped dramatically and gas is STILL 3 times the 5 year average price - so the days of 12c-15c electricity are not coming back anytime soon, but 25c a unit (ex vat) should be attainable

raclle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120242858#Comment_120242858

You reckon it'll be that quick before they drop and those unit rates back to what they were previously? I've a feeling they'll try keep them as high as possible until the government puts pressure on them.

Villa05

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120242858#Comment_120242858

Would you fix for 2/3 years if the rate comes down to 0.25c. I would assume last years process of increased rates going into winter will repeat itself as countries scramble to replenish supplies

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120242858#Comment_120242858

Fixing is not open to everyone. Or at least it wasn't till very recently. There haven't been any fixed rate options for domestic customers in the last few years. Flogas recently announced the first fixed rate plan of 2023 and the media reported that it was the first fixed rate plan in three years.

"It is the company's first fixed rate in several years and the first in the marketplace for three years".

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0110/1345863-flogas-rates/

I’m not sure fixing your prices makes much sense with the wholesale prices dropping fairly rapidly at the moment. There’ll be a lag before those are passed on but the prices should begin to drop.

crisco10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120243260#Comment_120243260

That plan wasn't the first in three years though. That was an incorrect soundbite that got reproduced elsewhere, Energia offered an "EV" fixed price offering since at least this time last year. I say "EV" because you didn't need an EV to get it.

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120243324#Comment_120243324

You didn't need an EV, just the charger

From their website

Do I need to have an electric car charger installed to avail of this electric car charging tariff?

Yes you will need to have an Electric Car Charger installed to avail of this offer.

loyatemu

re: companies hedging their wholesale prices as gas prices fall, it's only €50 to break out of a contract, which is a pittance in the context of current prices. Once one company start to reduce their rates anyone with any sense will break their contract and switch which should encourage a general reduction.

I certainly would sit around paying out-of-contract full unit rates in the hope that a better deal might be available in a few months.

I had a Bord Gais guy call to the door last week who insisted Energia (who I'm in contract with for another few weeks) were about to leave the market. No idea if that's true.

crisco10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120243780#Comment_120243780

In practice you didn't need anything was my point. But yeah we're in broad agreement.

I signed up online and never was challenged.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120243844#Comment_120243844

That’s not true!

seanin4711

one big swindle by the looks of it.

Moved from EI to BG and normal bill up to last bill which had a 100% increase in unit rate and total bill.

EI closing account 19 days OCt 20233

8026 75403 e 75123 units 280 units 0.3970c unit price €111.16 total

BG 09 Dec 2022 to 13 Feb 2023 

24 hour Units 1,101 kWh 44.21 c/kWh €486.75 total

WTF???

got a smart meter in yesterday hopefully that helps!

Jesus wept!

Villa05

From Bloomberg

European natural gas futures slumped below €50 for the first time in 17 months as the region’s worst energy crisis in decades recedes, but with signs that further price declines are unlikely. 

Dr_Colossus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120249252#Comment_120249252

Smart meter won't make any different to above but will stop the estimated meter reads at least. Presume the meter reading of 75403 when leaving EI was the actual and prior reading of 75123 was the "e" or estimate reading.

Your unit rate has increased 11.3% from 0.397 to 0.4421 but consumption nearly 3 fold from 280 to 1,101 kWh. That's a massive increase but what kind of period did the 280 units with EI cover, was it a full 2 months like the BG period? If so then what's the cause of the increased consumption, electric heaters I guess but if using storage heaters then you should have a day/night meter with better night time rates.

I've heard of one individual who got an electric bill of over €1,200 while running a lot of plug in electric heaters over the last billing cycle.

To put things in perspective, I have a relative in Singapore and they're paying 0.3127 SGD or about 0.2198 EUR per kWh so our rates here are over double and we're supposed to have a high percentage of renewable energy from wind unlike Singapore which is all nearly natural gas. Natural gas rates then in Singapore are slightly more expensive at 0.2359 SGD or 0.1659 EUR per kWh while my gas rate prior to any discount is 0.1541 EUR. My gas rate is nett inclusive of carbon tax and VAT but prior to standard charges which are criminal here the way they've been increased 40+% in line with energy prices.

ongarite

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120252345#Comment_120252345

As had been said before we don’t buy gas from EU market. We are linked the UK market and their prices, which are 3X what they used to be. Look up UK gas futures to see…

Glenbhoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119943126#Comment_119943126

Just wanted to update ye following this earlier post

I've just resigned with bord Gais, they offered me 10% back in December, but I got 15% today on both gas and electric, also have the 5% for dd and paperless, so 20% all in. Seems as good as there is out there at present.

All in all, probably not worth holding out for as it was the most expensive 2 months of the year! I intended to investigate earlier, but life got in the way!

The biggest learning for me and one which a few on here alerted me to is that all contracts are breakable for a modest fee, 50 in many instances up to a 100 for some. With that knowledge it's probably worth always being in a contract with someone.

Btw, if anyone knows of a better (non smart) deal, I'm still inside my 14 day cooling off period when no break payment is required, so I'm all ears.