30k speed limits for all urban areas on the way

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120809901#Comment_120809901

...but again you are ignoring the reality that over the years people are not out walking, cycling or playing as much as they used to for fear of being knocked down by someone in a car.

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120809901#Comment_120809901

yes, the roads are so safe, this explains why in NL, approx two thirds of dutch secondary school students cycle to school, and in ireland (as of 2016) i think just under 4% did (might be up to ~7% by now, trying to find a source on that).

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810252#Comment_120810252

I've already explained what's wrong with Irish school "planning" in a specific thread. If you disagree with my view on that or think there are too many secondary students being driven to school, you need to explain how come even countries like the U.S. can have fewer students being driven to school than Ireland. Even if we assume that the supposed lack of students cycling to school is some sort of problem, how do 50kph limits directly cause it?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810091#Comment_120810091

Unfounded fears? If someone has a road with the footpath and they won't walk on it because they're too scared of all the "maniacs" driving at 49kph, the problem is with them, not everyone else. And when could you play on a main road? Either in an urban area or otherwise?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810070#Comment_120810070

It's more like you have 2.8 million drivers in this country who are almost all totally blameless for these things. They might wonder why they should be punished for things they by-and-large have nothing to do with, let alone be responsible for.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810444#Comment_120810444

Unfounded fears? If someone has a road with the footpath and they won't walk on it because they're too scared of all the "maniacs" driving at 49kph, the problem is with them, not everyone else. And when could you play on a main road? Either in an urban area or otherwise?

Firstly, it is common knowledge that the numbers of kids walking or cycling to school has plummeted in the last few decades. Most if tgisbis blamed on the perceived risk from drivers. Do your kids walk to school? Your neighbours kids? If not, why?

Secondly, it was common when I grew up all over the country for kids to be out playing. Not it us not. Again the risk from drivers is a considerable factor.

You make light of it (as you usually do to defend your staunch position) but ask anyone and they will confirm what I've said. I also believe that you also have or have been subscribed to this theory!

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810444#Comment_120810444

Speed limits aren't a punishment.

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810936#Comment_120810936

They most certainly are a punishment if they are absurd. Which is what is being sought.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810484#Comment_120810484

"Ask anyone?" I've never been put off from walking anywhere because of the speed of cars etc. And even when I'm walking on a footpath and KNOW that a driver on the road is speeding (because I see a car passing one of those "your speed is ..." sign) I think "hmm, that's interesting" and continue on. In fact if I have a footpath (e.g. urban area) I couldn't give a fig as long as the drivers observe controls like zebra crossings, etc which they generally do. I've never had any serious issues except at specific places and times. And cyclist have de-facto free reign to cycle on footpaths so they shouldn't be overly concerned with drivers' speed either.

And the data back this up. I don't know when you grew up, but I'm assuming before 1995. The risk back then was actually insane - we lost at least 400 people every year on the roads "back in the day" in some years IIRC over 600 and that's with most people being too broke and poor to have cars or having anywhere to go except the boat dock to England or the American embassy. Oh and speed limits were higher back then, all roads outside urban areas were 60MPH (70 on motorways) and all roads and streets in urban areas were 30MPH, there were no lower limits for residential side streets etc.

magicbastarder

in some years IIRC over 600 ... Oh and speed limits were higher back then, all roads outside urban areas were 60MPH (70 on motorways) and all roads and streets in urban areas were 30MPH, there were no lower limits for residential side streets etc.

seriously? when speed limits were higher, road casualties were far greater? what is the speed limit on the road to damascus?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120811121#Comment_120811121

They most certainly are a punishment if they are absurd. Which is what is being sought.

While you are certainly entitled to your opinion, having one doesn't make it correct

"Ask anyone?" I've never been put off from walking anywhere because of the speed of cars etc. And even when I'm walking on a footpath and KNOW that a driver on the road is speeding (because I see a car passing one of those "your speed is ..." sign) I think "hmm, that's interesting" and continue on. In fact if I have a footpath (e.g. urban area) I couldn't give a fig as long as the drivers observe controls like zebra crossings, etc which they generally do. I've never had any serious issues except at specific places and times. And cyclist have de-facto free reign to cycle on footpaths so they shouldn't be overly concerned with drivers' speed either.

Your answer to illegal driving is.....illegal cycling?

And the data back this up. I don't know when you grew up, but I'm assuming before 1995. The risk back then was actually insane - we lost at least 400 people every year on the roads "back in the day" in some years IIRC over 600 and that's with most people being too broke and poor to have cars or having anywhere to go except the boat dock to England or the American embassy. Oh and speed limits were higher back then, all roads outside urban areas were 60MPH (70 on motorways) and all roads and streets in urban areas were 30MPH, there were no lower limits for residential side streets etc.

If I understand you right, you are against further reductions in speed in built up areas because the current level of deaths and serious injuries is good enough and we should just leave it at that. Did I get that right?

magicbastarder

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41169541.html

worth noting in the context of the 'our roads are safe' argument.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120811121#Comment_120811121

"Ask anyone?" I've never been put off from walking anywhere because of the speed of cars etc. And even when I'm walking on a footpath and KNOW that a driver on the road is speeding (because I see a car passing one of those "your speed is ..." sign) I think "hmm, that's interesting" and continue on.

Do you or your neighbours let your kids walk to school and if not why not? Your anecdote about you not being afraid to walk somewhere does not represent society. Our pavements have generally been designed to suit drivers. Pedestrians must give way to drivers whenever they wish to pass a junction (even including private entrances). Our junctions in many cases are designed to allow cars to travel quickly increasing risks for those whiching to cross them.

In fact if I have a footpath (e.g. urban area) I couldn't give a fig as long as the drivers observe controls like zebra crossings, etc which they generally do. I've never had any serious issues except at specific places and times. And cyclist have de-facto free reign to cycle on footpaths so they shouldn't be overly concerned with drivers' speed either.

Actually, one thing I take from your waffle is that you simply think "hmm, that's interesting" and continue on when you witness a driver clearly speeding. You admit that drivers generally observe controls like zebra crossings meaning that a large percentage do not (which we all know is the case!). However, you never lose the opportunity to peddle your shite about cyclists on the footpaths! You're being somewhat hypocritical there Seanie but I guess it suits your agenda! 

And the data back this up. I don't know when you grew up, but I'm assuming before 1995. The risk back then was actually insane - we lost at least 400 people every year on the roads "back in the day" in some years IIRC over 600 and that's with most people being too broke and poor to have cars or having anywhere to go except the boat dock to England or the American embassy. Oh and speed limits were higher back then, all roads outside urban areas were 60MPH (70 on motorways) and all roads and streets in urban areas were 30MPH, there were no lower limits for residential side streets etc.

Our road network has improved significantly and the risk that caused many of the head on collisions has been removed (thankfully). Vehicle safety has improved for those inside the vehicle which has contributed towards saving lives and reducing injuries. However, the road improvements have not been made for anyone not inside a car. However, "back in the day" kids were able to cycle to school, play on the streets, and not require their parents to chauffeur them around like you see nowadays.

Incidentally, to correct your point that "speed limits were higher back then", they weren't really and the "Go Metric" project allowed them to increase in most cases:

• 30km/h = 18.6mph (but we didn't have 20mph limits IIRC)
• 50km/h = 31mph
• 80 km/h = 49.7mph
• 100km/h = 62mph
• 120km/h = 74.6mph

That many of our roads have had their speed limit changed is a different point!

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812005#Comment_120812005

In 2021, the EU averaged 45 road traffic fatalities per million people, while in Ireland, the rate was far lower at 27.

If we didn't have so much one-off housing, no footpaths etc. you can bet our pedestrian fatality rate would be lower.

In urban areas it's not motorists putting people off walking it's cyclists on the footpath and SDCC for one encourages this!

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810252#Comment_120810252

Yet when parents take issue with the local schools all being single-sex, strict Catholic, run by religious orders with a strong record of child abuse, etc. etc. they are told they can just drive their kids to an inclusive school miles away... as we have to do despite living in the middle of a very large Dublin suburb.

There's a bus lane on the main road to the school but no bus routes have ever used it. There is a cycle path but it's much too far for a junior cycle student at least to be expected to cycle.

I expect they have a far better planned and more inclusive education system in NL than we do.

DoraDelite

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812794#Comment_120812794

You must have missed all the cars on footpaths around Dublin, can't walk 50 metres without encountering one. Also having a "footpath" and having a footpath that is designed for the comfort of those on foot are two different things. Loads of examples in urban areas where there's a "footpath" i.e. https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3672474,-6.250216,3a,75y,320.93h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sa75xM5YQWzXN6hhNd6RxmQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812794#Comment_120812794

In urban areas it's not motorists putting people off walking it's cyclists on the footpath and SDCC for one encourages this!

Oh Christ, another one!

SeanW

A lot to unpack here. First I can't comment on the speed limits on the road(s) to Damascus, but I was responding @Seth Brundles bizarre idea that Ireland in decades past was some kind of lost Garden of Eden. But the main reasons there were so many fatalities back in the day was because everyone drove home from the pub after 10 pints and thought nothing of it and because all the main roads for long distance travel were glorified 16 century goat tracks.

Also this idea from @[Deleted User] that I'm "promoting illegal cycling" ... no. Footpaths are de-facto cycle lanes. That's just reality. I'm not promoting anything.

As to this nonsense "If I understand you right, you are against further reductions in speed in built up areas because the current level of deaths and serious injuries is good enough and we should just leave it at that. Did I get that right?" That is false. My argument is that regulations should be balanced and proportionate - and given that 99+% of Ireland's 2.8 million drivers are not even involved in, let alone the cause of these incidents, your measures are not proportionate.

@magicbastarder interesting how you try to equate Ireland with Latvia and Romania. Let's see how those numbers stack up shall we?

Ireland, 3.3 fatalities per billion vehicle kilometres, Latvia 9.7, Romania, no data on vehicle distance. (source)

As for deaths per 100,000 population and per 100,000 motor vehicles: Ireland, 2.9 and 7.5 respectively. Latvia 6.9 and 24.8 respectively. Romania, 9.6 and 31.4 respectively (source). Any claim on inference that Ireland is in any way comparable to either of these countries is disingenuous in the extreme.

As to the last post from @Seth Brundle I don't know where to start. Firstly, it's a fact that large scale speed limit reductions were part of the Go Metric program: all R and L roads outside of urban areas went from 60MPH (96kph) to 80kph with the metric change. Secondly, I am a routine pedestrian on all types of roads and streets in Ireland (urban and rural) and from my practical experience as well as the data, I have no idea WTF you're talking about. As a pedestrian I've had way more problems with lawbreaking cyclists than with drivers. Dramatically so. I created a specific thread about school transport issues and if I had kids, I would want them to be guaranteed a place in a designated universal local school and be assured they could use the school bus if they could not walk. Finally, this bizarre idea that "However, the road improvements have not been made for anyone not inside a car" really? Do you even live in this country?

@[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120813213#Comment_120813213

Also this idea from @[Deleted User] that I'm "promoting illegal cycling" ... no. Footpaths are de-facto cycle lanes. That's just reality. I'm not promoting anything.

Just to clarify, cycling on footpaths is illegal. The only exception is if you are entering or exiting a property. They are not de-facto cycle lanes so give that a rest.

https://rothar.ie/blogs/stories/cycling-in-ireland-what-the-law-says

As to this nonsense "If I understand you right, you are against further reductions in speed in built up areas because the current level of deaths and serious injuries is good enough and we should just leave it at that. Did I get that right?" That is false. My argument is that regulations should be balanced and proportionate - and given that 99+% of Ireland's 2.8 million drivers are not even involved in, let alone the cause of these incidents, your measures are not proportionate.

You seemed to think of this as an unfair inconvenience i.e. I haven't killed or maimed anyone so why should I have to slow down. Thats not the way the world works. If it did, we would accept drink driving

magicbastarder

@magicbastarder interesting how you try to equate Ireland with Latvia and Romania. Let's see how those numbers stack up shall we?

um, no. i quoted an article; i did not try to 'equate' us with them. the article is about ireland having an unusually high proportion of pedstrians in our fatality figures, and those two countries were simply cited as the two countries in europe where the proportion of pedestrian deaths were higher.

there is a not very subtle difference between the concepts of 'comparing' and 'equating'.

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812996#Comment_120812996

A lot of pedestrians notice all the cyclists on the footpath, they are hard to miss. You should not be surprised by that. On this forum though, they usually get shouted down with "BUT BUT WHATABOUT WHATABOUT ... CARS" from likely the same people that are doing the cycling on the footpath.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120813513#Comment_120813513

Well there's no comparison. The data on that are clear.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120813448#Comment_120813448

As to cycling on the footpaths being theoretically illegal, nobody seems to have told the cyclists. And are you seriously comparing driving drunk with driving on a main road at 50kph?

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120813213#Comment_120813213

A lot to unpack here. First I can't comment on the speed limits on the road(s) to Damascus, but I was responding @Seth Brundles bizarre idea that Ireland in decades past was some kind of lost Garden of Eden. But the main reasons there were so many fatalities back in the day was because everyone drove home from the pub after 10 pints and thought nothing of it and because all the main roads for long distance travel were glorified 16 century goat tracks.

Nothing bizarre about it. The reality was that in the past kids played on the streets and were allowed to walk or cycle to school (despite the high fatality rate nationally). You keep deflecting from this presumably because it is an iuncomfortable truth.

As to the last post from @Seth Brundle I don't know where to start. Firstly, it's a fact that large scale speed limit reductions were part of the Go Metric program: all R and L roads outside of urban areas went from 60MPH (96kph) to 80kph with the metric change.

I stand corrected - i had forgotten about the limit on non-national roads. Now, as you have previously described speed limit reductions as a punishmnt, do you believe that reducing the limit on non-national roads to 80km/h was an act of punishment?

Secondly, I am a routine pedestrian on all types of roads and streets in Ireland (urban and rural) and from my practical experience as well as the data, I have no idea WTF you're talking about. As a pedestrian I've had way more problems with lawbreaking cyclists than with drivers. Dramatically so.

I would make the claim that this is complete and utter toss! You will have passed cars parked illegally no matter where you walk. You will see drivers breaking red lights all over the place. You will see drivers on their phones or other devices. To make the claim that people on bikes pose more of a danger to you is nonsense. However, you also point out that there is data on this (I've made it bold in your quote), can you show us this data please?

Finally, this bizarre idea that "However, the road improvements have not been made for anyone not inside a car" really? Do you even live in this country?

ok - what has been done on our roads up until recently to improve safety for pedestrians or cyclists? A few examples would be good. (Oh and before you say painted cycle tracks - they don't add any improvements (paint is not a form of protection)!)

Uncle Pierre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812005#Comment_120812005

That's an odd conclusion for The Examiner to draw from what the figures actually state. The Examiner claims that Ireland is third worst in Europe for pedestrian deaths because the proportion of pedestrian deaths in all road deaths is higher than all bar two other countries. But consider the following (figures are somewhat extreme in order to make a point, but the principle still stands):

• Country A has six pedestrian deaths, but only 10 road deaths overall. That means 60% of all road deaths are pedestrians.
• Country B has 50 pedestrian deaths, and 250 road deaths overall. That means 20% of all road deaths are pedestrians.

Does it follow that Country A is three times more dangerous for pedestrians than Country B? Would others not infer that Country B is actually the far more dangerous one?

It would be like arguing that far from looking towards The Netherlands as an example of what to do with regard to cycling, we should be looking the other way, because more cyclists are killed there than any other type of road user.

Source: https://www.statista.com/statistics/523252/netherlands-number-of-road-fatalities-by-mode-of-transportation/

So, by using The Examiner's logic:

• In the Netherlands last year, 291 of 737 road deaths were cyclists. That's just under 40%.
• In Ireland last year, seven out of 155 road deaths were cyclists. That's 4.5%.
• Therefore, The Netherlands is almost nine times more dangerous for cyclists than Ireland is.

See how absolutely illogical and twisted things get when statistics aren't read and interpreted properly?

magicbastarder

oh, i'd agree that more detailed examination is necessary - that was really just a quick comment in reaction to blanket statements like 'ireland's road's are extremely safe' can hide more interesting data. the examiner article is quite short on detail too.

magicbastarder

case in point - running with the figures from NL - if we want to compare with ireland, let's remove the cyclists from the figures, because that's going to create a massive and debatably unfair difference obviously.

446 non-cyclist deaths last year is 0.00255% of the population in NL. in ireland, there were 148 non-cyclist deaths - or 0.00296% - roughly 15% higher than NL.

but if you compare the 'raw' figures, it's 0.0042% in NL, and 0.0031% in ireland. that's a difference of approx 25% with ireland now being higher.

the fatality figure goes from being measurably higher in NL for all road deaths to being measurably lower, after you take the cyclist fatalities out.

Uncle Pierre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120814163#Comment_120814163

Yes, you need to examine stats properly and see what they actually say before throwing up headlines. Unfortunately, The Examiner didn't do so.

Would also agree that blanket statements like "Ireland's roads are extremely safe" are unhelpful and potentially misleading. With 155 road deaths last year and many more injuries, they obviously weren't extremely safe for the victims.

However, it's a statistical fact that Ireland has some of the safest roads in Europe, in terms of fatalities per head of population.

Source: https://transport.ec.europa.eu/background/2021-road-safety-statistics-what-behind-figures_en

But even still, that doesn't tell the full story. For example, drivers in larger (and ostensibly "more dangerous") countries like Italy or Poland may make longer journeys more frequently, leading to more cases of driver fatigue and associated collisions and fatalities.

Always dangerous to draw conclusions from any set of statistics without checking to see what exactly they measure, or considering whether or not they tell the full story!

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120813852#Comment_120813852

You are comparing Ireland of today with some rose tinted view of Ireland "back in the day" (a.k.a. when it was a third world country) which is patently absurd. Speed limits (the topic of this thread) were higher "back in the day" and dangerous driving was much more commonplace. Dramatically so in both cases. There have also been widespread changes to street layouts including pedestrianisation projects, "build outs" at junctions and general redesigns of streets (like this for example).

And a lot of people out walking and cycling back in the good old days weren't doing so by choice - they were broke and poor. Not having a car can seriously impair a person's quality of life, restrict where you can live, complicate any journey you intend to undertake etc. Plus, people didn't have anywhere to go anyway, as they were broke, poor and likely jobless. So while that might have led to less traffic, it's difficult to say that this was a good thing.

Tenzor07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815004#Comment_120815004

Christ! Wherever it was you grew up sounds pretty depressing!!

Back in the day I clearly remember being able to cycle through low car traffic Dublin city streets without high vis/helmet and daytime running lights...Now you need to dress like a builder going to a rave just in the hope that some idiot behind the wheel of the cars flooding the city's streets doesn't hit you and send you flying into the back of an ambulance!

When there was a bus strike we walked 5 miles without complaint, try that now to the cosseted kids used to being ferried around town in their parents SUV's..

All the jobs were local, housing was affordable in the city... Now people have to live outside the city and travel back in.. just a shame there's no cycle lane network and the city speed limits aren't 30kph around the small city streets to keep people safe..

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120809901#Comment_120809901

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120810444#Comment_120810444

Always fascinating to see how you absolutely refuse to apply any of the logic that you use to claim that motorists are safe when it comes to cyclists.

What's your deaths per billion km figures for cyclists, considering the 'one death per decade' experience here? Why should we 'punish blameless cyclists' for the unfeasible large number of dangerous cyclists that you see around you?

SeanW

I don't "claim" that Irish motorists are safe. The facts speak for themselves.

As to the rest of your post: In addition to being a motorist, I'm also a regular pedestrian. In that capacity, I get far more respect from drivers than I do from cyclists. Dramatically so - it isn't even close.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815441#Comment_120815441

Facts like: one pedestrian death per decade caused by a cyclist?

SeanW

All my near misses as a pedestrian have been caused by cyclists.

Weren't you the one accusing Irish motorists of "killing 2 or 3 people every week?" you never did clarify how many of Ireland's 2.8 million drivers you were falsely accusing.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815492#Comment_120815492

Right, so when it comes to cyclists, we rely on personal anecdotes, but when it comes to drivers, we look at the data points that suit us.

Got it.

SeanW

That and those of a lot of other pedestrians. I'm not the only one who has noticed cyclists propensity for aggressive lawbreaking.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815570#Comment_120815570

You do seem to be the only one that hasn't noticed the decades of factual evidence of aggressive lawbreaking drivers killing two or three people each week on Irish roads.

SeanW

Like I said, which drivers specifically? There are a lot of them in Ireland, and you could be accused of tarring with a very large brush ...

magicbastarder

All my near misses as a pedestrian have been caused by cyclists.

all?

you should play the lotto tonight.

i know the lotto doesn't have a draw tonight, but with the odds you clearly live with, you'll still win anyway.

McGrath5

The amount of people on the internet who’ve had dangerous encounters with cyclists is baffling.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120816172#Comment_120816172

Usually the same person has lots of them. coincidence?

What the latest status of these 30kph limits anyway.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120816351#Comment_120816351

Galway is introducing a city centre 30k zone shortly.

Athlone is proposing one too, but it's early days yet

DCC are pushing the govt to make 30k the default for built up areas with exceptions applied for rather than the other way around

Tenzor07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815570#Comment_120815570

Wow! Definetly one of Dublin's most unlucky persons to see all these marauding bicyclists being so aggressive with the law, are you walking in the Cycle lanes waving your hands about?

Do you go onto the Motorbike forum to complain about the gangs of feral youths speeding around housing estates across the country on untaxed stolen motorcycles with no driving licence or insurance..

Honestly it's tiring reading your posts over the last number of years, the same gripes and moans, if it was against a minority group you'd of been banned off Boards.ie long ago.

Flinty997

I think there's a case to be made to limiting certain topics to specific threads. Instead of obsessively posting on so many threads with the same thing.

If anyone driven in London lately you can see what's going to happen here in the future in terms of low speed zones and ulez.

Hoboo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118759465#Comment_118759465

Most toddlers don’t look left and right when they’ve escaped their harness or buggy.

magicbastarder

it's interesting to see so much variation in what is reported as the average reaction time in calculating braking distances. anything from half a second to two and a half seconds. though some seem to split it into two - the time taken to reach a decision to brake, and the time then to actually have applied your foot fully to the brake pedal.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812985#Comment_120812985

Parked cars shouldn't be there but they're not a threat to pedestrians when they're not moving...

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812996#Comment_120812996

So you're fine with pedestrians being put in fear. Oh Christ, another one.

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817205#Comment_120817205

random anecdote. i once flagged down a garda car after the garda had driven past a van completely blocking the footpath, forcing pedestrians out into the bus lane (on a busy road). his initial reaction was to look at me like i had two heads. it was only when i pointed out that this was approx 100m from a centre for kids with disabilities, some of whom are in wheelchairs, did he resign himself to heading back to get the driver to move.

in short, parked cars are very often 'a threat' to those most vulnerable. i used to live in phibsboro, which had/has a fairly high proportion of elderly residents and on several occasions saw a neighbour having to walk her zimmer frame out on the road because she couldn't get past parked cars on the path.

Hotblack Desiato

Just to clarify, cycling on footpaths is illegal. The only exception is if you are entering or exiting a property. They are not de-facto cycle lanes so give that a rest.

SDCC for one has signage which explicitly states that the full width of certain footpaths are "shared".

magicbastarder

then it's a shared use path, rather than a 'footpath'.

Hotblack Desiato

Yippee.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815583#Comment_120815583

Do you want their names or what?

Can you be specific about which cyclists are marauding you on the footpaths?

bazzerboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118759029#Comment_118759029

case by case...can't just blanket impose a limit.

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120819477#Comment_120819477

As to the cyclists that menace me on footpaths, I didn't get their names (though I think one of them is a regular poster here), but when the RSA last published statistics, there were 2.8 million people in Ireland with some kind of license/permit. Of that, 2.5 million were Full Category B license holders with the balance being other license types (A, A1, M, W) etc or learners permits. There are also some people driving in Ireland with licenses from other jurisdictions, e.g. the UK, the EU etc.

So how exactly do you define the "drivers" are you accusing of "killing 2 or 3 people every week?" All 2.8 million Irish license holders? Those plus the foreign license holders? Just the 2.5 million Irish Full Cat B license holders? How do all 2.5+ million of us decide who we are going to kill this week? Do we all meet in a giant meeting hall and vote on it every Sunday?

Perhaps you are blaming the infinitesimally small group of drivers that are actually culpable in fatal incidents (maybe 0.2-0.3% of the total). Or perhaps you are blaming all those who are involved in such incidents, regardless of cause. It's really unclear.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817002#Comment_120817002

Last I checked, the name of this forum was "Commuting and Transport" not cycling (Which is thataway BTW). On this board I see a lot of gaslighting of pedestrians and unfair accusations against motorists. People are going to disagree with that.