You've been looking in the wrong direction, the dangers are coming from the right.

Tell me how

The veil has been well and truly lifted on the motivation of Republicans in the US on their supposed Christian ideals. I've already pointed out their recent actions in targeting women and attempting to prevent them controlling their own bodies. They had no problem defending those actions in claiming they were doing so to protect the right to life of the unborn. That never held much water given how little support they are in favour of for helping with childcare or education costs amongst other things.

But the way they have reacted to the news of a Senate Candidate from Georgia is irrefutable evidence of how they really feel. There are 2 elements in particular about the Herschel Walker story that are concerning. 1, not the fact that he paid for an abortion (despite their attempts to claim that that is why Democrats are annoyed about the story), but that he is running partly on a pro-life platform and has suggested he has zero acceptance for someone justifying having an abortion while simultaneously hiding the fact that he paid for one for his mistress.

The wider Conservative position on this (as evidenced most notably by right wing darling Dana Loesch this week) is that they don't care what he has done or how that conflicts with his supposed high moral position. They just want control of the Senate and don't care how twofaced they appear if they end up achieving it.

Other elements of this story that should be a concern to the supposed Christian base of the Republican party, but isn't, is that they are painting him has a devout Christian who will use his faith as guidance in the senate despite his opponent being a qualified and serving Christian minister. But then, they were willing to pretend that no one respected women like Trump does despite him saying he could sexually assault them because of who he was.

The final head-shaking incident to do with Walker this week is Newt Gingrich saying 'He has been through a lot, he's had a lot of concussions' like that in itself shouldn't be enough to immediately be enough to exclude him from consideration of being 1 of only 100 senators in the country.

I'll repeat here once again for those who will try to claim I'm pretending all Liberals are holier than thou, or perfect. I'm not saying that. At all. I'm saying that the dangers to society are mostly being driven by right wing strategists (the few) and apologists (the many). Despite the attempts of plenty on here, including the last poster I responded to, expecting us to ignore what is happening in plain sight.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709262#Comment_119709262

You're suggesting that boards is a hotbed of right wing sentiment?

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119670324#Comment_119670324

I've given countless examples supporting the argument I am making in this thread. Feel free to argue against those points rather than just claiming without evidence that I am wrong.

Throughout the world right now, we see people decrying Liberal ideals, or the Loony Left, or the Radical Socialist agendas or what have you. Mostly by Conservatives who are actually in power or recently were or could well be again very soon. As I pointed out on here, there's no shortage of threads, bashing liberal ideals. Way more in fact than there are bashing right wing ideals.

What is simplistic is denouncing my position without evidence but purely because you claim that you are right.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709338#Comment_119709338

I'm suggesting that is closer to right wing that it is Left wing. At least over the period from say 2019 to early 2022. I would point out that evidence of this is mostly taken from watching and taking part in discussions on the After Hours and CA forums.

The political forums where more sensible debate doesn't have anything like the same level of rhetoric as those two places.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709340#Comment_119709340

What you were saying is based in personal bias.

Providing evidence to somebody who can only see things through the lens of their own personal bias is an exercise in futility.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709355#Comment_119709355

I would suggest the opposite is true.

If you take discussions of the type you're describing posters who support a more centerist view or more rarely, a right wing perspective are more likely to be subject to action by moderation on this site.

Unless of course you can provide evidence of this supposed support of right wing rhetoric on boards I'm going to say your hypothesis on this topic is debunked.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709313#Comment_119709313

Republicans are saying him paying for an abortion is a “personal issue” and that he “doesn’t support abortion” even though he paid for one, and if he’s a senator something something he will have vowed to protect life or some bullshit.

https://www.mediaite.com/news/i-dont-want-to-seem-like-im-attacking-you-but-don-lemon-goes-hard-at-gop-guests-shock-defense-of-walker-abortion-snafu/

The cognitive dissonance on display was insanity. Personal issue for me but not thee.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709399#Comment_119709399

Look at the threads that are started that can be identified to be in support of either left wing or right wing ideals. This was easier to see and to find before the whole site tidy up last summer but my recollection is that right wing threads, such as those I mentioned significantly outnumbered Left wing ones.

I'm lolling at the belief something can be debunked just by you claiming that to be the case.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709462#Comment_119709462

From the ideas of "open borders", denationalisation, globalisation, through to an utter rejection of reality with the likes of biological males in women's sports, being able to change genders at will on a given day, witch hunts on social media that sometimes have very real consequences for going against a rigid doctrine of what can and can't be said (ranging from the semi reasonable to utter farce), obsession on race to the nth degree. A lot more besides.

Except these have been causes advocated by few if any people. They have been portrayed by the Tucker Carlsons, Dan Wootons, Piers Morgan of the world maybe as being common place except this couldn't be further from the truth. Aside from the fact that the biggest proponent of globalisation is the premise of capitalism whereby resources can be accessed from anywhere an the movement of goods and services around the planet should be in on way disturbed. The idea that there is significant bandwidth or conversation around topics like open borders or denationalization is laughable. Of course you'll find someone on a protest somewhere or in a speech who alludes to it but there has been zero movement by any significant political entity in this direction as a matter of policy. The whole gender conversation is the most incredible faux panic we have seen in my lifetime given how little what gender someone chooses to be impacts others around them. And that aside, I don't see anyone actually advocating for people being able to change their gender like they would their jacket. Where as, on the right wing side, Trump literally banned people from 'sh1thole countries' travelling to the US and the UK obviously made massive efforts to make it harder for people from outside to live and work in the country.

As you mentioned religion, it is the right again who are seeking to weaponize this as a form of either a sign of loyalty or as a mode of government. Lauren Boebert, MTG, and others in the US have recently advanced the argument that the best form of government for the US is one guided by Christian Nationalism.

It isn't "right versus left" that's manifesting itself like a steamroller, it is "left versus reality".

As I've pointed out, the reality is that right wing ideals are actively negatively impacting society in the countries in which they are being stringently adopted. Examples of removing a womans right to choose what to do with her body as in the US, cutting health and benefits services while removing caps on Bankers pay like in the UK, enforcing women to wear a cover on their hair like in Iran, massively destroying the planets biggest carbon sink like in Brazil, or the attempt to frack communities in to oblivion for a few barrels more of oil or all not just right wing ideals. They are right wing acts happening right now and millions of people worldwide are suffering from it.

Ignoring that but suggesting that left wing 'topics' are more detrimental and problematic is either a deliberate attempt such as the people I mentioned above do to influence the narrative, or is being stated from a place of ignorance.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709584#Comment_119709584

Debunked by any casual glance at the forums you mentioned.

You're seeing the far right everywhere, you're not exactly non partisan on these topics to begin with.

You're making claims about this site being full of right wing rhetoric which really isn't true at all. You laugh at my saying your hypothesis is debunked but you offer no evidence to support your own claims.

I can see one thread that started today about a situation in a work place which became a sounding board for the OP's opinions on foreigners, they were roundly ridiculed and their opinions on foreigners were completely taken apart by the majority of posters, myself included (and I'm a far right nutter according to some people around these parts).

Ultimately I feel what your putting forward has no basis in reality and is little more than a mud slinging exercise.

Goldengirl

The prevailing view on boards AH or CA from reading down through the list of trending chats and discussions, is not just 'right' or 'left' but ' extreme' as far as I can see.

Not much appetite for moderate views on anything it appears.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709747#Comment_119709747

Please point copy and paste a statement from my post which you believe is false. Nullzero was doing the same thing, just saying 'You're wrong' without actually challenging it.

I've listed real world policy positions that are either active, or were implemented very recently before being reversed. I started this thread as a response to the cries of panic about what the left was doing to the world. I standby that viewpoint that the real world negatively impactful policies that we, as a society, are dealing with today are largely as a consequence of right wing ideologues. Hence the title.

Also, I'm living in the US and contrary to popular belief, it is not a complete basketcase of a country but it is certainly heading closer to that as a consequence of a right wing mindset.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709854#Comment_119709854

What are the extreme left ideas that are often heard? Not that I'm taking a particular opinion, but I'd say that some would certainly be along the lines of "biological males in women's sport is perfectly acceptable", "mass migration is nothing to talk about and of no consequence", "gender swapping this and that", all manner of new ideas on "identity" just for a start, "race, race, race".

It's seems you're particularly focused on the gender conversation. There's a handful of noteworthy cases worldwide of biologically males participating in female categories. All after having spent a significant amount of time and proving their motivation before being allowed to do so. Do you really think it is a significant issue?

Where are extreme left ideas being implemented on a national political level that you feel we should be concerned about? Migration is way more controlled now than it was probably at any time in history. It's just the opportunity to travel exists now in a way that it didn't in the past.

Extreme right ideas? Are you genuinely asking? I've already listed several. The monopolisation of markets, the disregard for the environment, the controlling of peoples freedom to do what they want with their bodies, the idea that empathy is a weakness, overt nationalism, the monetisation of healthcare.

You seem to be equating a call for gender neutral bathrooms with permitting untreated sewage being pumped on to beaches. Do you really think the former is what society is most at risk of?

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709715#Comment_119709715

Turn on the news some day.

Abortion being removed in US, cost of living crisis in UK, war in Ukraine, protests in Iran. All the outcome of right wing ideals being enforced by those in a position to do so.

You can twist the debate to being one focused about this site if you wish, that was never the specific intent of the thread (and I stand by my view on that regardless), that you do so tells me all I need to know about the accuracy of my statement on a broader level.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709969#Comment_119709969

Greedy arseholes are not a political grouping.

What makes you think greedy arseholes don't have political viewpoints? Or that they wouldn't be more inclined towards a manifesto that would be more financially beneficial to them? Don't think I've ever heard such an argument before. The flow of money in to politics by very wealthy individuals and companies would suggest they have a strong political viewpoint.

Also, I completely disagree that the other items I mentioned aren't political. Whatever the motivation, I think the number of people who would say that positions on the climate, financial regulation, bodily autonomy and business practices aren't influenced by political viewpoints is very small.

I'm not sayin there aren't greedy people on the left, of course there are. What I am saying is that right now, in the early 21st century, most of the concerns societies face (in the western world where we all largely spend most of their time) are as a consequence of right wing mindsets excessively influencing governmental action.

There's varying degrees of right wing practices. From Putin invading Ukraine in the West and the right to an abortion being removed in US, and various degrees in between. Do you think the Irish government continued favourable behavior towards American investment funds is a right wing or left wing ideal, if it had to be put in to a category in the context of the Irish political system? Do you think Irish society is benefitting from, or being hurt by this type of strategy?

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709958#Comment_119709958

How am I twisting the debate when I'm replying directly to something you said about this site and the AH and CA Forums in particular?

Surely I don't have to quote your own posts here as proof, can you just accept you said these things?

WrenBoy

The fact is that these more "Right Wing Ideals" as you say, are more appealing to voters lately. It's would be too simplistic to just say that voters are too stupid and are being tricked. Unless you want to get rid of democracy the only other option is for the political forces on the "Left" to come more to the centre to try and recapture some of those voters.

(I'm speaking more about Europe in a broad sense by the way, I stopped following the political happenings in the US a while ago.)

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119709958#Comment_119709958

War in Ukraine is being promulgated by what calls itself a left-wing country in Russia.

The oppression of their own people by the left-wing governments of Cuba, North Korea and China is unparalleled. No freedom of any kind in those countries.

Yet, much of what you say is also true. That means your target is wrong. You shouldn't be targetting the right wing, you should be targetting extremists on both sides.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119710467#Comment_119710467

What I mean in saying that you are twisting the debate is you are trying to make it in to purely a Boards frame of reference.

Aside from that, I started the thread 6 months ago partly in response to the almost daily anti-liberal threads. As I said earlier today, I haven't been on the site much since then so cannot comment on what exactly what its been like but even now, looking at the front page of the CA forum, there's at least 3 threads which I feel were started with a specifically non-liberal agenda. I don't think you can say any stand out as being written specifically to advance Liberal ideals.

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119711301#Comment_119711301

Irony explosion Thread title ? 🤔

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119710714#Comment_119710714

It's would be too simplistic to just say that voters are too stupid and are being tricked.

I don't really dispute that there is evidence that right wing ideals is appealing to people but I do dispute as to how and why that is playing out. And I'm not calling people stupid but to say that the results of what we are seeing are entirely democratic isn't exactly true either.

First past the post in the UK means that for every seat in parliament Labour needed about 50K votes where as every seat the Conservatives won, they needed, on average just 35K votes. The Greens poll nationally in the UK at about 5-7% and yet have only ever had one person elected to the House of Commons.

In the US, the disparity in state populations versus allocation of Senate seats means individuals in Wyoming have 57 times greater voting power than individuals in California.

And counter to the suggestion that people on the Left need to come to the center to gain voters, I would argue that people in the center and to the right should realize what stands to truly benefit them. House prices in 2022 are 7 times the average wage, in the 80's they were 3-4 times the average wage. The minimum hourly wage in the US would be in the region of $24 if it had kept up with inflation since the 70's, instead its only $7.25 and hasn't changed in 13 years. Tuition fees were introduced in the UK at 1K per year in 1998 and are currently at 9K a year. And not to mention the impact privatization has had on UK utility companies and how these companies recently behaved with respect to energy prices. Again in the US, CEO pay compared to employees of that company was 21 to 1 in 1965, that was 350 to 1 in 2020. And it wasn't left wing ideals that brought about these scenarios.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119711318#Comment_119711318

Reality says no.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119711189#Comment_119711189

Calling yourself Left wing and actually being left wing are too very different things. I stated this earlier and suspect many will disagree with me but I don't think anyone would describe Russia, China, North Korea as Left Wing countries irrespective of what their leaders would do. In fact, I think its a long time since any of those leaders even claimed to be Left Wing themselves.

Those countries may have been formed, or suggested at a particular phase, to be Left Wing but my view is, (and I understand people will disagree with me) that those countries have long been hijacked by leaders (singular or collective) who are nothing more than dictators and nothing about how the country is ran, is done along any sort of Left wing ideals. In fact, I'm not sure I would argue against someone saying that allowing a country to be formed as Left wing could make it more likely that a despot of some sort will manage to take control.

I'm fine with people disagreeing with my take on that, I think the evidence speaks for itself. The societies that I think are more reflective of the Left ideal are closer to being those in the Nordic Countries, Canada, New Zealand, (even Ireland for the most part).

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119711301#Comment_119711301

Saying I'm twisting the debate is a dishonest attempt to delegitimise what I'm saying by using loaded language.

This is the problem with what you're putting forward on this thread is that it's your own personal bias.

Whatever your opinion of thread titles, the content of the threads on this site are always consisting of multiple types of opinions, you know people disagreeing with each other (like we are now) it's what makes a platform such as this interesting.

What you want is a site where anything right of your opinion isn't tolerated and users who fit that profile would be site banned.

What you want is a left wing echo chamber, and anything that isn't that, you perceive to be evidence that the site is a hotbed of right wing sentiment. I'm sorry but that isn't a reasonable position and you haven't been able to provide any evidence to support your assertion.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119711359#Comment_119711359

By the same token, many of the politicians and political parties that call themselves right-wing or are called right-wing are not at all right-wing. Many of them agitate for state control over many issues - e.g. women's bodies, media etc. - that are anathema to true right-wing liberals.

What I am arguing is that the poison comes from the extremes, both right-wing and left-wing, not just from the right. The horseshoe theory applies with Trump being closer to Xi in politics than either of them are to the centre.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119711558#Comment_119711558

You couldn't be more wrong in claiming you know what I want, I'm pointing out a view, you can counter it or not, but you can't just say I'm wrong because you say so and simultaneously say that I am guided by bias.

From the first post, I've laid out several examples to support the claim I am making in the thread title. It's telling that these aren't being challenged but rather just being ignored while people try to claim they know what it is I want and to effectively target the messenger.

I have no desire for an echo chamber. Conflicting arguments/conversation is both necessary and enjoyable. But what we've seen on here with respect to threads started with a specific topic intent by the OP is a predominance of concerns raised about left wing ideals or scenarios when what is really impacting people in a much more relevant way are the actions of people or groups with right wing motivations.

I probably wouldn't have started this thread on here if there wasn't such a flood of Daily Mail By Lines being used to start threads on a regular basis. The fact that people, including me, contributed to those threads pushing back on whatever outrage was being expressed does not negate the bias evident in the focus of threads being started.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119711980#Comment_119711980

And Trumps BFF while he was in power was Kim further evidencing the horseshoe theory. But I still don't feel it is accurate to describe China or North Korea as Left wing societies (or leaders) in any way at this point in time.

And that is not to say, that evil hasn't been carried out by people claiming to be left wing. Or even thinking they were acting that way in some cases rather than just claiming it to appear on the side of the people until such time as they get control.

But right now, as we look around us, the dangerous policies and strategies are being driven by right wing identified individuals and groups.

As I said above, I live in the US and in a state with a Republican Governor and I thought the way they managed Covid was as good as it was managed anywhere. And I am good friends with some strongly Conservative people who I think are fundamentally decent. But I think it is wrong to 'both sides' this debate when we have seen quiet draconian slides to the right, particularly in the last 6-10 years or so.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119713292#Comment_119713292

If you are living in the US, then the dangerous policies and strategies are being driven by right-wing identified individuals and groups, but if you live in Russia, China or North Korea, that is not the case.

In Ireland, the dangerous policies and strategies are being driven by left-wing identified individuals and groups. The key that helps you identify the dangers is when they put forward policies that contradict their avowed stance. You have that in the US with people claiming to value freedom wanting to tell women what to do with their bodies, and we have it in Ireland with politicians claiming to be left-wing and opposing property taxes.

Dyr

Are there no blog platforms left for this sort of meandering collection of personal hobby horses?

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119713705#Comment_119713705

Are you seriously arguing that Putin is left wing? Seriously?