You've been looking in the wrong direction, the dangers are coming from the right.

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942722#Comment_119942722

Voting patterns in the mid terms. All trumps guys lost pretty much.

Overheal

Can you give an example of the moderate right turning on the far right element please. Be specific please, if it has happened as you say, there should be no issue finding examples.

I'm a field this one to move this along: 7 GOP Senators registered votes to convict Trump of his impeachment. 10 GOP House members voted to impeach him. Others I don't care to tally resigned which is its own form of turning against, as well as right wing groups like the Lincoln Project.

I think this just shows us that even the right recognize that present dangers are coming from the right.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942733#Comment_119942733

So all Trumps guys were far right?

Because, that is what you said ;

The moderate Right has turned on it's far right element.

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942760#Comment_119942760

No one suggested some trump supporters were not far right ? Just you cannot label all of them.

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942739#Comment_119942739

I agree in this case yes. Great point made.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942766#Comment_119942766

So you agree.

That means that the former President, some sitting Senators, House Representatives, a Supreme Court Justices wife, the former presidents family and advisors of his (all Republicans) are all supporters of extremists?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942767#Comment_119942767

So now that you accept there's a far right element to Trump and his supporters, isn't it advisable to pay close attention to this and act to prevent them being successful?

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942770#Comment_119942770

Your preaching to the Quire here. There are some elements ofc there are. Just not a majority to make a difference now. I have no idea why some blokes wife is always brought up. My partners opinions have no reflection on me they are a separate person.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942776#Comment_119942776

Preaching to the choir he says. Nearly 1400 posts in. At least you finally acknowledge what Trump brought to the Republican party. Beyond far right you called them. No argument from me there.

I have no idea why some blokes wife is always brought up. My partners opinions have no reflection on me they are a separate person.

Weren't you talking before about Hunter Biden's laptop?

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942787#Comment_119942787

I don't think I did comment on the laptop. If I did it was in a political way on how he got access to things that would not reflect well on the POTUS Wife saying something is different to a political advantage.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942794#Comment_119942794

Not when her husband was adjudicating on the legitimacy of claims that the election was stole, that she vigorously insisted was the case.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119942776#Comment_119942776

You haven’t heard of Ginni Thomas and aren’t read up on her involvement in supporting the obstruction of the peaceful transfer of power?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119941453#Comment_119941453

Trump and his rhetoric was defeated at the midterms.

How does that evidence align with your radical claim that the threat comes from the right?

Bolsonaro was defeated at the election in Brazil.

How does that evidence align with your radical claim that the threat comes from the right?

The Conservatives are likely to be heavily defeated at the next election in the UK.

How does that evidence align with your radical claim that the threat comes from the right?

...

Meanwhile the Chinese Communist Party remain the greatest threat to the world due to their genocidal behaviour, their revanchist ambitions over Taiwan, and their increasingly autocratic function.

Yet you want us to focus on people who were defeated at the ballot-box, whilst ignoring the far-left Communist threat that actually does exist - that actually is committing a genocide against Muslims, and who pose the greatest risk to world security in the years to come.

We could also throw in North Korea which, according to Article 1 of its constitution, is an "independent socialist state". They are promiscuously throwing around nuclear threats against the South and remain a general menace on the world stage, as well as committing an effective genocide against its own people through their reckless behaviour. Yet again, an avowedly socialist state causing nothing but problems on the world stage.

But you want us to turn away from all of that, to focus on Trump having dinner in Mar-a-Lago with a nut-job? A former president with no power at all.

And that proves to the world that the real threat comes from the right!?

Give me a break...

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119943215#Comment_119943215

The usual rebuttal of the above is that China and North Korea aren't really communist or socialist, they're actually right wing because what they're doing is bad and only the right wing could possibly be responsible for such things.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119943215#Comment_119943215

Did Bolsanaro come from the left? Did MAGA?

Folks continue to make embarrassing arguments attempting to invalidate thread.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119943215#Comment_119943215

Well, isn't this curious. A new account, one post, and then account deleted.

Howsoever.

A - Trump most definitely was defeated at the mid-terms, let there be no mistake about that but the Republican party still refuses to condemn him by name and he is still some bookies favorite for their nomination in 2024.

B - If Trump does leave the scene, the replacement is a Trump mini-me who uses the same decorated racism, the same techniques of attacking the press and the same style of trying first to secure the votes of the outer reaches of the party.

C - All House representatives who wanted to hold Trump accountable for inciting an insurrection have been removed from office. Same for Liz Cheney. And all of these were either directly removed, or motivated to by regional party operatives who acted against them. The problem with Trump hasn't yet disappeared. Not by any stretch. MTG is apparently some sort of King Maker within the party now which is evidence of just how infected it has become because of Trump.

D - Yes. Bolsanaro was defeated, you do realize that this Thread was started nearly 8 months ago? Anyway, that aside. Bolsanaro's treatment of the environment, his pushback on medical science and his use of the judiciary to target his opponent were massively impactful things. And politics being politics, in just a few years, there will be another election and no doubt there will be things that people aren't happy about, it's important to kep in mind just what Bolsanaro brought to the table so it knows why he, or his philosophy should be ignored later. Luna only won by 2%, like in the US, the right is still very strong in Brazil

E - This type of short term memory is even more likely to be the case in the UK if Labour do win the next election, the tories and their media will lick their wounds for 2 years before then ramping up and blaming for the issues brought about by Brexit, Austerity and 15 years of Tory mismanagement. The right wing media in the UK is more impactful probably than even in the US and the Tory party starts with a 5-10% advantage in any race because of it in my view.

F - Sweden and Italy have recently shifted towards right wing Governments and elsewhere within the EU, Orban has been taking his lead almost exclusively from the likes of Trump and Bolsanaro.

G - Are you sure the CCP is the greatest threat to the world? After we've watched the US initiate, or get involved in a massive conflict literally every decade since WW2 and Russia is currently involved in invading Ukraine and threatening the security of Europe and beyond. I am not a fan of the CCP and they absolutely do some horrendous stuff, which should be called out and it is worth noting that it mostly left wing people/organisations who actually call them out on this rather than anyone from the right so if they are a problem, and they are, the answer isn't right wing is it? But that aside, I've repeatedly referred in this thread about the dangers that 'we' face, we being the people who contribute and read Boards. The OP challenged the frequent practice on here of getting upset about right wing talking points focused on left wing and liberal ideals and so that is why I am focused on right wing points in a similar manner. And that aside, probably 99% plus of people who have read this thread I expect live in 'Western' society so again its appropriate to focus in this direction. I didn't talk about Duterte in the Philippines either, or right wing movement in Sri Lanka or the coup in Myanmar either for the same reasons.

H - North Korea is an autocratic-Dictatorship and I don't think any serious commentator would pretend otherwise despite what it claims to be. There's a reason why Trump was such great friends with Kim.

I - Trump had dinner with 2 nut jobs. Both of who were then invited on to a very popular right wing podcast. Two sitting House Representatives had recently spoken at a political conference organised by one of these nutjobs. Despite weak claims from Trump and republican leadership against the nutjob, I believe that the significant right wing community in the US will be emboldened at the fact that the meetings took place and will react to those denouncing it in the media with shrugs that 'they have to do that'.

J - This is a lot more than just Trump and a single dinner. He has infected the political landscape in a way that is going to take some time to cleanse. As I said in the OP, the massively impactful things affecting our societies right now, and likely in to the future are the environment, the impacts of Brexit, the fall out of the Ukraine war and the pushback against scientific advice, particularly with respect to health (and the already mentioned environment). For the last 15-20 years, starting with the conflicts after 9/11 and the financial crash major global concerns were driven by right wing philosophy (warmongers with respect to 9/11, reduced regulation with respect to the financial crash). The massive and continued widening gap between the uber wealthy and the rest also could be considered in this manner. The US has just seen half its population be told that they should not be explicitly in control of their own bodies, 1/3 of sitting senators just voted against having an absolute right to be in an interracial marriage. The likely GOP Presidential nominee for 2024 will have some groups of supporters who will fly Nazi flags beside his flag. And for all those who think migration is the biggest issue to be concerned about, the biggest driver of this (outside of war) for the rest of our lifetimes is going to be the impact of the climate crisis, so if your concern is immigration, maybe start asking what is causing it.

K - The left isn't perfect, I've never said it is, it's weakness in some areas is what has enabled Conservatives/Capitalist's to do the damage that they have done. (See Corbyn 2015 - 2019 for example, even Starmer now is weak in areas he should be much stronger, or the fact abortion wasn't codified in the US before Roe v Wade was repealed or that the fossil fuel industry has been allowed to dictate global policy for so long) And no one is calling for communism to be rolled out throughout Europe or beyond no matter who often you say that that is what I or anyone else on here is asking for.

Tell me how

Kanye talking to Alex Jones today.

https://twitter.com/politicalplayer/status/1598369359386529792

Anyone trying to argue we should stop looking at the right because Trump lost needs to have a good chat with themselves.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945630#Comment_119945630

Is the whole point of talking inside of a body sock so he can try and deny saying any of this?

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945630#Comment_119945630

That's got to be a piss take surely.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945638#Comment_119945638

I believe the man is unwell, who knows for sure, you and I are never going to find out definitively. If he is, it will be announced at some point that he is getting care, if he isn't he'll probably use it as some form of a redemption arc at some point.

He has to take ownership over such comments like this, he might be mentally unwell, but he is putting himself on these shows saying these things.

There's something sinister watching himself and Herschel Walker and how the Republican Party has utilized them. I actually think Hershel is a worse case, I don't believe he has any interest in being a Senator and to see him doing interviews with Ted Cruz and Lyndsey Graham beside him feeding him lines, it looks very manipulative. And these are the people who talk about grooming.....

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945651#Comment_119945651

Afraid not.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945651#Comment_119945651

Nope he really doubled down and credited Hitler with inventing the modern microphone etc.

For some reason, B-roll of American History-X was shown over this, the scene where Edward Norton's white supremacist character fatally curbstomps a black victim.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945694#Comment_119945694

I thought that that was added by the person tweeting the video, but the infowars logo remains on front of the inserted video all through it.

That's very sinister. What could they say to attempt to justify that imagery over those words if this actually did happen as it looks?

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945630#Comment_119945630

Has anyone actually argued though that those who see themselves as on the left, should stop looking at the right? By all means knock yourself out; I’m just not sure who the ‘we’ in your above statement refers to as though the right are a danger to people who see themselves as being on the right? The idea of there being any danger to people on the right, from people on the right, doesn’t make any sense.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119940042#Comment_119940042

Are they? I dunno how else one is supposed to quantify this sort of statement in the opening post that is but an opinion from TMH’s perspective -

There are no shortage of real world negative if not outright disastrous and terrifying ongoing situations that demand our attention right now, and it feels like this has been the case for at least a few years, if not all the way back to the financial crash in 08.

That reads like someone getting hysterical to me tbh, about things that in all reality have little influence or impact in Irish people’s lives and in Irish society. I can’t argue with how it feels for TMH, they feel whatever they feel, but from my perspective, it’s critical to maintain a sense of perspective, one that shouldn’t actually include looking for problems to be getting all anxious about. If you go looking for problems, you’re bound to start believing there is no end of them, and if you’re on the left, well, it stands to reason you’re bound to see the dangers to your beliefs, values and principles as coming from the right. How credible is the threat though?

Or is it just a tiny minority of people whose influence is being magnified within echo chambers, like they’re egging each other on and validating each other to see who can be the most offensive/offended and it really doesn’t have anything to do with wherever they imagine themselves or others in any political framework?

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945706#Comment_119945706

murder porn for this audience.

I guess part of putting kanye in a sock was also a white supremacy thing then, white supremacists don't have to see anybody but white presenters and - well, their gimp. The only black person they actually see is from a film being murdered while he talks about their favorite idol, Adolf Hitler.

Overheal

Has anyone actually argued though that those who see themselves as on the left, should stop looking at the right?

Yes, seen several arguments ITT, especially in the past few days that, 'since MAGA lost the midterms, this thread is pointless' very much so imploring that people should stop looking at the right for threats.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945713#Comment_119945713

Has anyone actually argued though that those who see themselves as on the left, should stop looking at the right?

What was post 1395 arguing?

That reads like someone getting hysterical to me tbh, about things that in all reality have little influence or impact in Irish people’s lives and in Irish society. 

You think being concerned about the impact of Brexit, the continued mistreatment of the environment, the war in Ukraine, seeing access to healthcare being removed from people is getting hysterical? Interesting. Which of these in particular would you think so?

I watched the blase attitude to Trump and Brexit in the lead up to both key votes in 2016, and have watched the greenwashing of climate action since I started paying attention to these things in the mid-90's.

All of these things have been impactful in my life to a lesser or greater degree, or the lives of people I care about. A hell of a lot more impactful than Gillette making videos asking men to be considerate or whether or not someone identifies as a woman, that's for sure, and yet I've had to watch people on here getting very invested in these topics but not the ones I allude to in my OP or since.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945751#Comment_119945751

Looks like one of those who argued this has deleted their account, which is totally fine, that could have been for any reason.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945751#Comment_119945751

I probably should have clarified I was thinking of a credible argument, but fair enough 😁

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945777#Comment_119945777

I don’t see post numbers on mobile TMH, but I’ll accept that fair enough, arguments were made that the left should stop looking at the right.

No, I don’t think merely being concerned about the issues you mentioned is in itself hysteria, I was referring to the degree to which anyone should be concerned with these issues, and there’s a difference between a passing concern, and blowing something out of proportion as you’re doing. Granted I’ll accept that your concern is greater if issues affects you closer to home, but they don’t affect most people closer to home in the same way you’re arguing they should, at least in theory.

I just don’t know why you’d expect people who see themselves as being on the right would be concerned about the things which you see as having a negative impact on society from your leftist perspective. It appears more so that you’ll position anyone who doesn’t share your opinions in that mould, even though they themselves wouldn’t - I’m thinking of the kind of people who are on the left who don’t share your socially progressive point of view, former academics for one group anyway who have been dislodged from their respected positions within their respective communities, I believe they refer to themselves as ‘classic liberals’.

I can’t really think of any good examples of dangers to society from either the left or the right tbh as I don’t think there are any. I suppose the last thing which was of any particular significance was the proposed ‘objective’ sex education bill from 2018, of which it’s stated purpose was this -

An Act to guarantee the right of students to receive factual and objective relationships and sexuality education without regard to the characteristic spirit of the school.

https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/bill/2018/34/eng/initiated/b3418d.pdf

There wasn’t any discussion of it on here, but it would undoubtedly have had an enormous impact on Irish society and our education system had it actually become legislation. It didn’t though, because it was rejected by the organisations which represent over 90% of schools in Ireland, and the ‘objective’ claims in the bill are already taught in 10% of Irish schools.

A retired priest in Kerry makes a tit of himself (again), and there’s discussion for days about it, and the whole thing is blown out of proportion in pretty much the same manner as you’re doing in pointing to all the things and making the point that people don’t appear interested in discussing what you want to discuss. I might suggest it’s a blind spot in your perspective that you only see what you want to see, but in reality it’s simply that people care more about things that they imagine have a more immediate impact on their lives.

In your case it just happens to be all the things, and you attribute responsibility for those things to the political right, as you would. For others it may well be that Gillette are moralising and capitalising on trying to sell their products to a wider market of consumers, and the kind of precedent they’re trying to impose upon society that you don’t see the issues with from your perspective.

I do see your point, I just think you’re blowing things out of proportion is all, but it’s understandable that you would, in the same manner as the people you’re critical of are prone to the same sort of behaviour. I can certainly appreciate the irony in John Cleese becoming the very thing he rallied against, and while you may well have only become aware of it in the mid-90’s, this video was made in 1987 -

https://youtu.be/HLNhPMQnWu4

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119946056#Comment_119946056

Shining a light on the motivating factors behind Brexit, Trumpism, the war in Ukraine, anti-science and climate change resistance is most definitely not blowing things out of proportion.

Surprisingly few have tried to argue on here that these factors weren't right wing in origin, some have tried to declare it as such but without offering contrary evidence, but I reckon you may be the first who has suggested that these events are not very consequential elements in the lives of many people.

Tell me how

Rishi Sunak looking to go beyond the recently introduced policing bill.

https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1598380418545422356

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119949106#Comment_119949106

Sounds in relation to climate/end oil loons. About time lying in the road and gluing your self to stuff should be illegal.