Clontarf to City Centre Cycle & Bus Priority Project discussion (renamed)

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119446891#Comment_119446891

I also walk, cycle and drive.

"I'm a cyclist myself!"

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119447087#Comment_119447087

A bicycle isn't a political prop for green mushheads, its a vehicle and people should be able to control it properly if they're taking it onto a road.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119446881#Comment_119446881

I mean you're talking absolute bollocks in this thread about being "nearly" hit by cyclists, the usual nonsense.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/driver-22-who-drove-through-red-light-and-knocked-down-man-avoids-jail-over-death-41376980.html

This is what happens when drivers break red lights, and you don't even go to jail.

Citizen Six

Drivers should be held to a higher standard. They kill people due to negligence and bad driving on a regular basis.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119447236#Comment_119447236

No it is a real problem when people cannot trust using pedestrian crossings because the green man has become meaningless and they must dodge traffic.

Lenient to nonexistent sentences are a problem across the board. I have no idea how you can kill someone and get a slap on the wrist, its craziness.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119447153#Comment_119447153

You know, you're right. Cyclists should be forced to pass a test. That way, well know that they will never break a traffic law!

Now please let's stop with this off topic line and get back on topic!

downtheroad

Decided to cycle into the office through Fairview this morning instead of my usual route over Alfie Byrne Road.

A Hyundai Ioniq driver decided he is the most important man in Dublin and left the traffic lane around Wright's of Marino, spent the rest of his journey in the bus lane through Fairview and North Strand.

Not a Garda to be seen anywhere from the end of Howth Road to the 5 Lamps.

Never seen the Howth Road as quiet in the morning.

Fairview traffic was at its usual level (appreciate there is now 1 less lane for private vehicles). When the usual September 1st traffic returns it will be heavily backed up. Jayu concern about buses from Malahide and Howth Road having access to the city is valid.

This morning I saw the most amount of cyclists on the new greenaway to the back of the Convention Centre that I've ever seen, great to see.

Lovely morning to be on the bike instead of in a car.

GLaDOS

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119443735#Comment_119443735

Richmond road a disaster this morning, traffic backed up onto Grace Park road

magicbastarder

Never seen the Howth Road as quiet in the morning.

it's probably the quietest fortnight in the year for traffic, though.

downtheroad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119447990#Comment_119447990

Awful road in general, like a country laneway

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119447990#Comment_119447990

What was the main cause of the delay there - the light sequence too short at the petrol station or too many cars coming from Fairview Strand blocking access for traffic on Richmond Rd? Or people slow to move off (e.g. because of phone use)? Or it was just one of those days where more people chose to drive that route?

GLaDOS

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448072#Comment_119448072

Yeah agreed, can see it becoming one-way eventually. Some of the paths near tolka park are tiny.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448199#Comment_119448199

Light sequence as far as I could tell. Probably waiting about 2-3 minutes for a brief green. (Get a long one every 4 cycles or so) Couldn't see any issues with traffic build up on the other side. This is probably the worst I've seen it since the pandemic started (in prime holiday season) so don't think it could be put down as "one of those days".

I imagine they'll tweak it, but if it's bad now, it's going to be horrendous once schools are back (I'll likely go back to the bus by then).

Murph_D

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119443999#Comment_119443999

https://irishcycle.com/2022/08/06/clontarf-route-unofficial-qa-aka-people-need-to-stop-lying-and-talking-nonsense/

cgcsb

Glorious quiet morning on all routes as far as I could tell, had the bike out going across the North side. Lots of other bikes.

Murph_D

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119445419#Comment_119445419

It is certainly not a kip. But less motor traffic and improved alternative mobility routes will certainly improve it, along with the additional kerbing, planting, paving and so on.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448317#Comment_119448317

"There also has to be the realisation that when motorists have had most of the space on streets and roads for so long, taking the away can feel like oppression."

It isn't as if people walked and cycled before cars took over streets and roads.

Rail, trams and horse taxis were how people got around, i.e. *mechanised transport* of which cars were just a continuation.

Then they ripped up railway lines to make way for cars. (Both in this country and throughout the UK)

Now people are meant to walk or pedal everywhere? Why not re-build the railway system that was part-dismantled? The red line Luas brought back the old Dundrum to Harcourt St line, now where's the rest of it?

Murph_D

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448435#Comment_119448435

That's some takeaway you got from the piece. But yeah, I'd be all for rebuilding the railways and trams! This is a commuting and transport forum, not a car forum.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448450#Comment_119448450

'This is a commuting and transport forum, not a car forum.'

I'm not insisting on car usage though, I'm just saying the alternatives to cars have to be realistic.

It isn't as if people didn't have access to mechanised transport prior to the invention of the automobile. They had chariots, single horses, horse and carriages, then canal boats, railways, trams, then finally cars.

So why should a 21st century person be told to suck a lemon if they don't want to use their own body as an 'engine' of transport?

magicbastarder

It isn't as if people walked and cycled before cars took over streets and roads.

um, they did? between 1986 and 2002 the number of people cycling to work in ireland fell by two thirds, though it has increased again a bit, with the 2006 census showing the lowest level.

i'm not sure if the question was in the census prior to 1986.

growleaves

Anyway I don't want to divert discussion from the specific issue of the Fairview set-up.

I'll start a new thread perhaps.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448435#Comment_119448435

Now people are meant to walk or pedal everywhere? Why not re-build the railway system that was part-dismantled? The red line Luas brought back the old Dundrum to Harcourt St line, now where's the rest of it?

Nobody is proposing that people walk and cycle everywhere. What is being proposed is that sustainable and efficient forms of transport are given priority. Many people would like to walk or cycle so this is part of the facilitation.

As for rebuilding railways: cool! Now how much more in taxes are you willing to pay to pay for this?

spurious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119447070#Comment_119447070

Maybe because clearing private cars on the North Strand makes it even more obvious now how many cyclists do it?

I know cars do it too, prosecute them all, the whole point of the rules of the road is that people can be sure in at least most cases no idiot will be flying into the side of them as they legally come out on a green light.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448545#Comment_119448545

Its just mad that we're working towards banning petrol and diesel cars by 2030 and not re-constituting the old rail system. We'll be naked before the storm imo.

To me it looks like an exercise in bad faith.

The government funnel taxes to oblivion (Children's hospital anyone?) then cry poverty.

Are we a society of medieval peasants? Surely we can afford something more than walkways.

The UK recently expanded the Underground into Essex (where many ex-Londoners moved to in recent decades).

Podge_irl

Again, buses exist and are actually quite plentiful and will become even moreso over the next few years.

Thelonious Monk

I am of the controversial opinion that they could build dedicated bus lanes to the airport etc, ones that cars just cannot enter, and it would be almost as efficient as having an underground, at a fraction of the price. A dedicated bus lane from the airport via the old airport road through Drumcondra etc could have been built years ago, I don't know why it was never put out there as a solution.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448590#Comment_119448590

The old rail system would cost billions to get up and running again and that is assuming that planning, land grabs, etc aren't an issue.

Anyhow, this has little to do with Farview & N. Strand both of which have a train lines which are likely to serve many who commute by car through those areas.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448674#Comment_119448674

Yes, the problem with buses is that there are too many cars in the way. Blocking bus lanes and disrupting flow. If miraculously all cars disappeared tomorrow, the bus fleet could be expanded and they’d flow smoothly and fast

our bus network has a car problem

Compo82

Richmond road was a disaster this morning, backed up to Gracepark road. I hate to see what it will be like in September with the schools back. Seems that cars are getting stuck because of the extra cars turning off at Fairview. Ballybough was actually moving ok.

I've never got hit by a car but I got runover by a cyclist who ignored a red light. I just don't get why cyclists don't think they need to obey the rules of the road.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448590#Comment_119448590

"Walking is for peasants" is exactly the mindset that has us in the state we're in today. Dublin is an eminently walkable city. I grew up here and didn't drive until I was over 35. And that was also before the LUAS, Dublin Bikes, bus lanes etc. People are lazy bastards and want the door-to-door solution every time.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119448590#Comment_119448590

Very little of the old rail system would be of any real use. That closed before the 60s was almost entirely closed with good reason. Winding Victorian lines, particularly the narrow gauge systems, couldn't compete with road travel by the 1920s and there's no justification to reopen them. 60s-70s closures are more questionable.

Dunboyne-Navan, the West Cork system, Waterford-Tramore (would probably have been replaced by a light rail line/system if it had survived), the Cork-Limerick direct line... that's about it. Portadown route to Derry in NI. Dunboyne, Ennis, Midleton were obvious to reopen and have been.