Clontarf to City Centre Cycle & Bus Priority Project discussion (renamed)

loyatemu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121772030#Comment_121772030

but if you do encounter someone going the wrong way (it happens in every one-way lane in my experience), surely you would move to the left?

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121774445#Comment_121774445

Yeah, you would think so. That's why I keep to the left. Yet I was struck by someone travelling on their right.

Keeping left also allows cyclists to overtake. And you often don't notice them approach from behind.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121774445#Comment_121774445

yeah usually but whatever way it happened we both ended up having to stop, like when someone's walking towards you and you end up getting stuck in front of each other for a second and both try and get out of the way to the same side at the same time and it becomes awkward and funny

bk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121771587#Comment_121771587

I'm not sure, though honestly I'm talking about moving over the driving lane no more then perhaps 50cm. An extra 50cm from the road + an extra 50cm from the footpath would give you a 3m wide two way path. There is even a rather wide concrete curb separating the bike path from the road which could be made narrower to reduce the impact on the road.

bk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121773156#Comment_121773156

Two-way cycle lanes outside the park (i.e. where the inbound cycle lane has been built) certainly would require tree removal, there just isn't enough space between the trees east of the footbridge.

I don't know why you keep repeating this as no one is suggesting this!

I honestly can't believe you are still talking about someone cycling inbound from Howth/Clontarf would cross over to a two way cycle path on the other side. I have stated several times that the the cycle lane on the park side would remain, inbound cyclists wouldn't have to cross. I honestly don't know how that can be made any clearer to you!

And I couldn't make it clearer that putting a two way cycle lane on the Marino Market side makes no sense and doesn't solve any of the issues of folks cycling the wrong way on the inbound cycle path or coming out of Fairview Park.

And this conversation started with me saying that a should be removed between Annesley Bridge and Marino Mart. Needing to take a traffic lane isn't news to me! The extra traffic lane on that stretch isn't really needed as there is a lane less immediately before and after it. I said that the space should be taken to create an additional cycle lane on that side and more pedestrian space. And no, that wouldn't be expensive, you remark a car lane as the bus lane and paving the bus lane. And once again, that doesn't change anything on the other side, inbound cyclists wouldn't have to cross over.

So pure fantasy! This project already faces enough public opposition without trying to take away whole traffic lanes!!

Two way cycle lanes all the way from Howth to the City centre might be good for some people but not everyone. Everyone in Ballybough, norther side of NSR, Fairview and Marino would have to cross the road every time to use the cycle lanes. The two way cycle lanes also becomes more difficult as you approach the city centre as there is more diversity in terms of where people are going to/coming from and this is very diffiicult to accommodate at junctions, etc. Not everyone is cycle to/from the Clontarf promenade.

There is where we fundamentally disagree. I live to the north of Marino, personally I'd VASTLY prefer to cross to a two way cycle lane on the south side of the road then deal with a one way cycle lane (which you would need to cross too at least one anyway).

I really don't understand the problem with crossing to get on and off a two way cycle lane, it is a nothing burger. I mean the people living in Clontarf already have to cross to get too/from the Clontarf cycle lane and I've never once heard anyone complain about it, on the contrary the people of Clontarf love it.

I would LOVE to have a two way cycle lane on Griffith Avenue, even if it meant having two cross to get too/from it. Once on it you would have a vastly better experience.

The advantage of two way cycle lanes is that they allow for a better and safer cycling experience, while requiring no extra road space.

Sure a two way on both sides of the road is the ideal, but realistically not possible on most roads. I'd take a single two way cycle path over a one way path every time.

bk

Interestingly the London City Design Standards say that two way cycle lanes should be used and placed on the quieter, less busy side of the road, for instance besides rivers or parks. So that cyclists have less intereactions with pedestrians around busy shops and less interactions with traffic lights and road junctions.

Of course, makes perfect sense.

They also point out the advantage of two way cycle paths for cycling tidal flows, where for instance a lot more people are cycling inbound in the morning and then swap to outbound in the evening. Which would certainly be the case here.

However they also do build on prefer one way paths on some roads too. Interestingly these standards for even one way cycle lanes are much higher then this cycle path, London specifies 2.5 meter one way paths + 35cm buffer. Where this is just 2m and can go down to 1.7m (and down to a crazy 1m on Griffith Avenue). I'd probably have less concerns if these were meeting the London standards of 2.5m, more room for overtaking even on a single way cycle path.

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121775265#Comment_121775265

Bridge is currently cleared for 5.19m. Any less could cause problems I'd imagine. Any bridge strike stops all rail traffic until it's examined and considered safe to reopen.

Tarabuses

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121775265#Comment_121775265

Why should pedestrians lose 50cm from the footpath?

Pete_Cavan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121775384#Comment_121775384

The issues of folks cycling the wrong way on the inbound cycle path from Fairview Park are likely exaggerated now due to the lack of outbound cycle lane. Most coming from the city centre will almost certainly remain on the outbound side until at ABR (plenty will have turned off before then anyway) as they will be on that side already. It is unlikely to be a big issue later and your focus on addressing it is misplaced. An outbound lane could be added from the park to ABR if there is space (there may not be) but that doesn't mean an outbound lane shouldn't also exist on the outbound side where there definitely is space.

And I'm not actively calling for an inbound cycle lane to be added on the other side of the road for that particular section, it was just a suggestion of something which could be done in the future. Call it a fantasy but it is more realistic than two way lanes being done on the inbound side from Clontarf to the city centre (I know you are calling for what is being done now to be ripped up but it is unfair to dismiss what I have said as fantasy when your preference is even more of a fantasy). Two lanes on the park side might make sense if they continued all the way into town but they won't, so in that context, two lanes along the park and nothing on the other side would force many people to cross the road twice which would definitely be worse than the current plan.

Removing a traffic lane there would be entirely reasonable, there is one lane immediately before and immediately later the two lane section so reducing it to one lane is not . While there would be resistance, it would be entirely in line with all local and national policies. We are looking to reduce traffic so with less traffic in future the second lane could be removed.

Ironically, removing the second lane would be the best way to have lanes in both directions along the park. The inbound driving and bus lanes shift over and the current bus lane could accommodate two lanes outside the line of the trees. The three lanes at Malahide Road junction would probably have to be retained though but you keep saying an outbound cycle lane could be added from the park to ABR anyway.

Citizen Six

Anyone who thinks they are going to put in a two way lane between Alfie Byrne and the park is in a fantasy land. Pretty much the same goes for removing a traffic lane. There's just no way they are going to redesign something that's taken so long and cost so much. Besides, the project engineers don't think there's anything wrong with it. And they believe people cycling in the wrong direction will disappear once the outbound lane is finished.

MarkN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121735688#Comment_121735688

So why is one person entitled to use an area over another? Great attitude from a moderator also.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121778687#Comment_121778687

My "and so?" was a reply to your post which appeared to justify the people blocking a bus lane, a segregated cycle path and a footpath simply because their kids wanted to go for a swim. There is no excuse for people blocking public infrastructure like that except pure selfishness.

Oh and I'm not a mod in the cycling forum but if you have an issue with my post then please feel free to report it!

maisie45

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121777338#Comment_121777338

Drove through there today and stopped to take right turn up Malahide Road.

Loads and loads of pedestrians and paths are narrow around the bridge , the idea of reducing the width further is ridiculous.

While waiting at the traffic lights I saw three people cycling the wrong way on the cycle path towards Clontarf,one was s food delivery driver going very fast, presumably on an electric bike.

Someone cycled from the Howth Road onto the path snd narrowly missed anothet cyclist going the wrong way, an accident here is inevitable.

There were a couple of people cycling too fast too, the cycle path is narrow, lots of pedestrians so cyclists need to adjust speed to the conditions.

There will be no increase in cyclists while you have other experienced cyclists booting down cycling lanes, some today were out in Lycra and it is intimidating to have them at your back wheel trying to overtake, this issue has to be addressed as anyone powering at speed needs to be on the road.

Tenzor07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121784990#Comment_121784990

Dang Lycra louts! I've seen that Gang around hanging out at Lycra Biker bars sipping espresso's and eating Almond bakes, they should be banned I tells ya!

Thelonious Monk

Around 0900 this morning the Garda were ticketing a van and a car illegally parked in where I've taken this screenshot from Google, which shows about 6 illegally parked cars lol. Anyway was good to see, thought I was hallucinating.

cgcsb

The Malahide Road Junction is a real mess, hope it gets sorted soon, trying to make a turning movement through there on a bike at the moment is lethal. Is there a clear completion date yet?

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121787331#Comment_121787331

End of June is the date they are telling people.

Gloomtastic!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121787249#Comment_121787249

The dry cleaners that bought Edges Hardware opened up the back yard for customer parking. There are always cars parked in front of the entrance so you can’t use it. They’re making a lot of noise about it, hence the guards.

Beta Ray Bill

Is there a revised completion date for this project?

It was originally supposed to take 21/24 months (Can't really remember)

Seems barely 50% completed.

The DCC website says Q2: https://www.dublincity.ie/residential/transportation/active-travel/projects/clontarf-city-centre-project but that has definitely been changed

CatInABox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121791597#Comment_121791597

An officially updated date? No, last we heard unofficially is June, I think, a few posts above.

This project is over 80% complete. One entire side is almost completely open, and what remains of the other side is not the water pipes and their connections, but the public realm works, i.e. pavement and cycle track works, along with related services (traffic lights, etc)

June seems about right, one of the issues that has arisen again and again is unmapped/unknown services below the surface. Each time it happens, it all has to be mapped out and dealt with.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121791774#Comment_121791774

There still seems to be a lot of exposed pipes and nothing has been done to them though, over the bridge that goes over the canal for e.g. it looks like they've done nothing, also the whole length of the strip outside where fairview grill is

bikeman1

They are pushing for June the last time I spoke to someone involved. Marino Mart will be delayed after this was the current expectation.

I also understand that they want the area from the footbridge to Fairview Grill sorted in advance of the 8 concerts at Fairview Park, the matches in Croke Park and also the Bruce gigs in Croker. A push is on from the local businesses to achieve this after years of disruption.

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121791774#Comment_121791774

Yeah, they are still dealing with water pipes. There’s a picture in this thread from last week.

I believe there is public information saying Q2 as completion date. DCC engineer told me that was always the planned completion date. But I didn’t think that was the case.

Plenty of people deliberately spreading misinformation about the project though.

Gloomtastic!

All the councillors will want their photo opportunities before the local elections in June.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121766560#Comment_121766560

Given how many cyclists fly past me on the footpaths on a daily basis, I very much doubt it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121767425#Comment_121767425

Thankfully your views are in the minority as most people understand the value of mature trees and don’t want to see them chopped down so people can get to their workplace 3 minutes quicker.

Thelonious Monk

Was just in Westwood. Gardaí trying to stop motorists hogging the footpath and bus lane, I think. They were ticketing people yesterday too. Someone must be putting pressure on them to deal with people in cars doing stupid sh*t.

Gloomtastic!

https://www.thejournal.ie/active-travel-esri-study-public-perception-6304219-Feb2024/

…..

JRant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121788705#Comment_121788705

They have a sense of humour at least.

bikeman1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121793057#Comment_121793057

As a famous TV character used to say, “I DON’T BELIEVE IT”