Orban party Fidesz wins election in Hungary

foxsake

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118877888#Comment_118877888

that wasn't the point I made. your question isn't even tangential to the point made.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878324#Comment_118878324

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-48256318.amp

Because they get a tonne of cash out of it?

It plays well I am guessing for him to be seen as being anti EU bla bla especially to his non-urban vote (which seems to be massive) while reaping the benefits.

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878408#Comment_118878408

John majors only contribution to politics

"put up or shut up"

Orban should stop bitching or leave, they won't be missed.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878417#Comment_118878417

I agree entirely.

EU need to be far tougher on them...if they want to be members they should be following the rules...if not they can follow the UK and see how it works out for them...

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878324#Comment_118878324

Right but then will all the ex-Habsburg countries plus possibly France and Italy have to leave as well if right-wing incompatibility with advances in political liberalism are the unofficial criteria for membership?

If Hungary leaves, Poland will be next on the chopping block no?

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878324#Comment_118878324

Free money! The problems with Hungary started when he got elected. They've been members since about 2003-2004.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878488#Comment_118878488

Orban first served as Prime Minister of Hungary from 1998 to 2002.

Ireland didn't allow gay adoption when Hungary joined the EU in 2003.

Now Irish people consider it scandalous to be in a political union with a country that doesn't allow gay adoption.

So who can really say when the "problems" began?

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878456#Comment_118878456

No , it's not about having a conservative government, it's attempts to allow your own judiciary to overrule the ecj and other Tom foolery. They either follow the rules of the club or leave it's simple

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878220#Comment_118878220

It was mentioned on morning Ireland

The party also used email addresses supplied for vaccinations and bombarded them with fidesz ad's

Danno

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878279#Comment_118878279

Possibly they'd prefer the older EEC model than further unification of Europe.

If this question was asked all across the member states in one big massive vote, the result would be "Leave it at the EEC stage" and with that you'd have the UK back too. But that question will never be asked amongst the current EU ruling class. That is why you'll see Orban, Le Pen and more like them make gains over the coming years as a big recession kicks in. Trump and Brexit were the warning shots.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878708#Comment_118878708

Crazy in an EU country (though not sure Morning Ireland is gospel 😂)

Surprised no intervention there

whatchagonnado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118877536#Comment_118877536

This has to be a wind-up, surely? The irony, myopia and hypocrisy here is laughable. Your boy Trump has spent 16 of the last 16 months complaining the election was rigged. His supporters stormed government buildings using the 'rigging' as an attempt to stage a coup. So, tell us, who are the 'usual suspects'?

whatchagonnado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878711#Comment_118878711

If anyone could articulate the negatives of the EU and make a strong case for a regression, then perhaps. But nobody can. The intellectual heavyweights of Brexit spent 5 years trying and the best they could come up with was blue passports and selling apples in lbs and ozs.

The EU is a convenient bogey-man. Unfortunately, 'look how much better off you would all be if it wasn't for those pesky pen-pushers (who you voted for) in Brussels', is an easy sell, that has no basis in reality.

Boggles

Brussels should send a copy of Article 50 to his office daily for the next 4 years.

Sign it and fúck off, not a cent more for Putin Lite.

It's high time these dangerous fuckwíts were dealt with hastily.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878948#Comment_118878948

Diet Putin

In fairness Hungary aren't invading Slovakia.

Nermal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878616#Comment_118878616

The 'rules of the club' are always up for discussion.

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878974#Comment_118878974

Absolutely, they may advocate to change them via the democratic institutions in the EU. It's funny though, that they had to accept the eu rule of law to gain accession to the union, so why do they have a problem with it now?

ArmaniJeanss

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878711#Comment_118878711

That the most pro-EU countries won't hold a continent-wide referendum with your simple 10 word question is hardly a negative - it seems completely sensible to me to not have such a clusterfcuk of a question put to the people. "Go back to the EEC model rather than further unification" seems about as poor a proposition as could be put a vote (even ignoring that it's nonbinary and needs three possible answers with 'stay as we are rather than either of the listed options').

It's the sort of question that would need about 200 tonnes of supporting documentation to explain what 'the older EEC model' would actually mean and what timescale it could be achieved in. People may be quite surprised with what they lose out on when the rules go back to some undefined point in time within the 30 year lifespan of the EEC, whose rules were continually evolving over it's lifetime anyway. And a continent wide vote is bizarre as well - like are we deciding on a simple majority of votes, or a majority of countries, or weighted voting.

And the biggest kicker - it's not actually needed. The UK exit proved that the EU isn't actually a prison. If the French people want some form of 'out' then they have a starting point of voting for Le Pen. An impending famille Le Pen presidency has been promised pretty much since 1984 though.

Stewball

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878210#Comment_118878210

RTE have pissed off every party in the country, but only one party gets an apology afterwards.

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118878210#Comment_118878210

He's also gerrymandered electoral districts so they are almost impossible to beat. Ranked at 92 on RSF World Press Freedom Index just a few places above Ukraine.

Shebean

It's actually very simple. The voters are being blackmailed.

Only the 'good' regions get government payments. If you don't vote correctly, the government money dries up in your area.

A GRUDGING VOTE FOR FIDESZ IN HUNGARY’S POOREST REGIONS

Yet Szabolcs-Szatmar-Bereg has pioneered other forms of electoral abuse, many of them well documented by the independent media. One is simple: buying the votes of, often, Roma people for cash or food. One phrase sums this up: eladni a szavazatot egy zsák krumpliért, meaning “selling votes for one sack of potatoes”.

The other one is bit more sophisticated.

“Imagine 10 poor people and someone approaching them and saying to each: here’s 5,000 forints,” explains Bernath, who was a member of several election commissions and claims to have witnessed this practice many times.

“They all are taken by bus to vote. The first one enters a polling station, picks up their ballot, but throws an empty envelope into the box. Instead, he fills out the ballot outside the station and hands it to the next bribed member of the chain, who votes exactly the same way.” The essence is that whoever organises the chain controls how everybody votes in the patron-client scheme.

This sound vaguely familiar. Mail-in ballots without ID???

Danno

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118879132#Comment_118879132

People may be quite surprised with what they lose out on when the rules go back to some undefined point in time within the 30 year lifespan of the EEC

Do you think? Would the 2008 crash have happened if Ireland could have been in charge of it's own interest rates? Do you think the single currency has been a success for Ireland? Would our national debt have swelled to the extent it has? Would our cost of living be so high?

Ardillaun

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118877239#Comment_118877239

Yeah, the world really needs more leaders who love Putin and hate gays.

theteal

My Hungarian colleague tells me he lost heavily in Budapest but the rest of the country "followed blindly" (his words)

After a quick search, sheesh

patnor1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118877498#Comment_118877498

Post like this show you do not know much about Hungary and Hungarians.

gmisk

Duplicate

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118879268#Comment_118879268

Which party?

Dempo1

It really isn't a surprise at all, I'd say EU leadership have a dose of indigestion this evening. I'd say there's only one thing thats stopped Orban pulling out of the EU and it's the Likelyhood he'd bankrupt Hungary if he did. Another vile individual rejoicing this evening will be his close buddy, Putin.

Mike Murdock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880023#Comment_118880023

And yet they'll still push to allow the even more nationalist Serbs into the Union, and then pull a surprised Pikachu face when they show their true colours....

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880057#Comment_118880057

Yep your 100% correct. Orban has been re elected democratically and its alarming. I don't know we're the EU is heading but it's certainly looking a fractious few years ahead. There's a growing far right movement across the EU and it's very concerning.

ArmaniJeanss

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118879759#Comment_118879759

That all seems pretty unrelated to your idea of having an EU wide referendum with an oddly worded question, with no explanation of how the votes are counted nor any explanation of how a vote 'to go back' could be binding on those countries who vote for 'going forward' or indeed vote for status quo.

But to answer your questions to the best of my ability (and with zero clue how they relate to your referendum idea which I would have loved to see you tease out).

*********

Would the crash have happened if we could set our own interest rates? Probably, as there is scant evidence to suggest countries with that ability were able to avoid the crash.

Single currency a success for Ireland? Moderately so.

Would our national debt have swelled to the extent it has? The total would certainly be less, though the interest payments would be tougher - having to both borrow and subsequently re-pay in a foreign currency at rates (fx and interest) that could fluctuate wildly.

Would our cost of living be so high? Probably lower, though a lot of the factors which influence our cost of living are external (price of oil/gas, shipping costs etc).

Danno

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880089#Comment_118880089

Since this shyte kicked off in Ukraine - what have the EU done to protect it's citizens from the spiralling costs of living that are going to bring untold poverty to Europe?

Sweet F.A.

The Italians are jumping up and down looking for an EU-wide energy price cap. No sign of it happening.

But by fook if one of their beloved banks were to crash overnight, the EU would swoop in without a second to spare.

The EU is a club - a fookin golf club where the richest of the rich and their political puppets play with our lives - with contempt.

Dyr

Couldnt help but wonder at what the European press were describing as an "anti-LGBTQ" that was contrary to "European Values" referendum actually was. Turns out it's the electorate being asked these five questions:

Do you support the teaching of sexual orientation to underage children in public education institutions without parental consent?

• Do you support the promotion of sex reassignment therapy for underage children?

• Do you support the unrestricted exposure of underage children to sexually explicit media content that may affect their development?

• Do you support the showing of sex-change media content to minors?

• Do you support the availability of sex-change treatments for minors?

If that referendum was run in mos EU countries, the answer to every question would be a resounding "NO"

Perhaps "European Values" means making sure that the public never get to vote on such issues 🤔

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880023#Comment_118880023

If you're going to isolate countries that developed close relationships with Putin, Italy, Austria, Germany, France and Belgium will be outside the door with Orban

Of course, Europhiles don't like admitting that Putins best buddy in Europe was their hero, Merkel.

Stewball

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880009#Comment_118880009

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/rte-apologises-to-paschal-donohoe-over-manner-in-which-childrens-shoe-question-was-put-to-him-on-morning-ireland-40263165.html

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880229#Comment_118880229

I wouldn't have thought Merkel close to Putin at all, I got a sense she despised the man and that was certainly obvious any time they met 🤔

I don't know about isolating anyone , just pointing out there's an alarming rise in Right Wing support across Europe and Polands current leadership as alarming as Orban.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880255#Comment_118880255

I thought the only Party involving RTE, that got an apology was ...that impromptu going away party during Covid Restrictions , and the Grovelling apologies were quite enjoyable at the time 😁

sameoldname

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880205#Comment_118880205

You would think that a referendum on judicial independence would be more important than worrying that teaching kids that gay and trans people exist will somehow turn all the kids "queer". But hey, maybe I have my priorities wrong.

Manach

From a historial PoV, that this week marks the centenary of the passing of the last Hapsburg Emperor (Karl II) suggests that the destruction of the Austro-Hungarian Empire has been a disaster for the human race: A.E.I.O.U.

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880341#Comment_118880341

Good riddance, they obviously had enough of that vowel language.......I'll get my coat

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880333#Comment_118880333

Which of those questions are about gay people

Which of those questions are about turning kids "queer"?

Do you ever wonder why you have to insert red herrings to make a point? Or do you just mindlessly repeat talking points?

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880257#Comment_118880257

Orban was not the one who enabled Putins invasion of Ukraine, that was Merkel

There's a reason why Zelensky singled out her and Sarkozy to come to see those mass graves, he knows they weret complicit.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880460#Comment_118880460

If your referring to Gas & Oil , I suspect a lot more than Merkel and Sarkozy in the EU "Enabled" (If that the correct term) Putin's appalling behaviour.

I think Zelensky's accusations about people be complicated is perhaps OTT, let's be Frank here, who in EU leadership gave a damn about Ukraine before the invasion and more to the point who will actually care when it's over. We've been here before and the hypocrisy is breathtaking. There's a vulgar harsh Realty that will play out when this invasion ends.

Putin will retain control over the two regions he already controlled.

Any notion of Ukraine Joining Nato is over and permanently.

Putin will as he's done before, be brought back into fold and leaders will be falling over themselves to appease him.

And EU Leaders will be saying , We promised what 🤔 Ukraine, were is that exactly 🤔

I also suspect any notion of Ukraine Joining EU off the table.

Nato has been proven to be useless and EU leadership, shallow and weak .

Ten of Swords

Mod - Can we stay on topic please, if you want to discuss the war in Ukraine in detail please use the appropriate thread

road_high

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880134#Comment_118880134

All the EU has pushed is this ultra woke and penal green energy fantasy that is decades off, resulting in dangerously unreliable energy supplies and spiralling prices.

On food supply, the same mirror image green rubbish has hammered productive agriculture in the same way where food security is also now a disaster. And prices out of control for consumers.

It scares me when I hear these green Marxists in the EU get up spouting their diatribes as I know it’s the least well off who are going to suffer yet again.

I’m no fan of Orban, but when I see the above results and look at the crap we have to put up with from our own Green shower I can see and completely empathise with the appeal of an Orban type figure. This appears partly what’s going on in the likes of Hungary.

Unless the EU becomes a lot more on the side of the ordinary citizen and their every day concerns then I’m afraid it may not last much longer as a Union.

road_high

In agriculture the EU continually bans all manner of inputs like agrochemicals - without proven replacements- all this while “might” have some environmental benefits results in dwindling food supplies and increased costs to consumers

km991148

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880205#Comment_118880205

There is a lot more than those questions, I'm sure you know this.

But even the first question alone is worrying.

(Do you support the teaching of sexual orientation to underage children in public education institutions without parental consent?)

You think it's appropriate to prohibit children under 18 learning about sexual orientation? What about the significant percentage of under 18s that are gay or bisexual? Or do you think they only magically become gay at 18.

There is also the promotion of heterosexual lifestyles through tax incentives (and media). Aggressive media campaigns to highlight the amorality of same sex couples and deliberate campaigns to conflate pedophilia with homosexuality (including proposed laws). Anti gay crimes are on the rise and the police are known to turn a blind eye. This is just from the top of my head, but I'm sure you will find the info readily available if you search.

Anecdotally I've heard from a few different sources how hostile is becoming for any one from a non het background.

Perhaps a little more reading should be done before conclusions are drawn 🤔🤔

km991148

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880711#Comment_118880711

The ordinary citizen in Hungary is getting absolutely shafted. Most know this but cannot speak out. Do you think the Hungarian police are like AGS?

Why do you think so many are leaving?

sameoldname

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118880456#Comment_118880456

Literally the first question in your list talks about teaching sexual orientation. Last time I checked, being gay was a sexual orientation or did you not know that? It's gonna be hard to have a discussion with you if you can't understand what you yourself wrote.

And you accuse me of being mindless? Well done.