Ukrainian refugees in Ireland - Megathread

bazza935

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119453231#Comment_119453231

Scream racism on the bus 3 times and get a space wagon

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119452428#Comment_119452428

absolutely this poster whom is engaging in serious disneytime, there is also the matter of where the student ‘can’ as much as ‘want’ to get into… it’s not a choice… the CAO has a say… :)

As regards a want’ to get into…The RCSI beside Stephens Green ? has what is basically the best physiotherapy degree…. So a person living in Wexford.. not going to want to commute from Wexford, that’s not practical..won’t be able to afford a Dublin city centre room unless they work 5 nights a week whereby they’ll hardly have time to study….

so in some far flung out of the way corner of Dublin / co Dublin , no social life, not the time or energy with all the commuting, working to pay rent etc. basically being fûcked over.

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119453427#Comment_119453427

60% of RCSI students aren't Irish. Imagine, if they weren't here, that'd be over 2,000 places available to Irish students, and over 2,000 student accommodation places freed up for white, Irish students, too! Let's get Justin Barrett or Gemma O'D to organise a march right now! Coming over here, taking our jobs! It's a disgrace, that's what it is!

( /sarcasm, in case it needs to be said)

Subzero3

"Maybe across the street from where a bomb recently struck you'll see friends eating nice traditional food at a re-opened bistro.

"We are happy for some moments, there are not just the bad and sad things as seen on TV. Life goes on and there's hope that soon all this will be over".

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/ukraine-travel-company-tourists/index.html

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119452732#Comment_119452732

It’s a six figure sum…. Fuel, profit for the airline, crew, handling charges, btw… the aircraft will have to position back for its next flight, so one leg it’s flying empty…..

economies per scale is interesting… the more weight on an aircraft the more fuel is required to get it to its destination, the more fuel, the fuel itself weights…so that’s a problem….you load fuel to carry fuel.

For example a heavy widebody aircraft going DUB to LHR would require in access of eleven tonnes of JetA1.. so a five and a half hour flight to the Ukraine, more weight, fuel and bags, weather, how far away is the available alternate (a different country I’d imagine) , planning fuel for that ( legally they need to ) MEL fuel if required ? I’d imagine too a captain flying into an airport they are not familiar with, a war going on not a million miles away would be not settling for flight plan fuel and simply adding a couple of tonnes as per captains prerogative, . ‘ contingency fuel ‘ … its a war after all.the aircraft has to get back…

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119452428#Comment_119452428

Indeed medicine has limited availability. But not all courses are University ones. A quick look online shows a great variety of nursing courses all over the country.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119453567#Comment_119453567

If only there were an EU agency to coordinate all these efforts…

https://frontex.europa.eu/media-centre/news/news-release/ukraine-flows-across-external-borders-stabilise-over-summer-3gxpnO

iamwhoiam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119453821#Comment_119453821

Not a bus ride from every village or town in Ireland no matter how hard you try to convince that it is

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119453567#Comment_119453567

So... Ukraine is safe, they should all go back.

But also the pilots will need danger money because it's not safe flying into a warzone.

One of these things is not like the other. 🙄

Economies of scale referred to transporting the better part of 50,000 refugees, in total, not to the size of the aircraft. You'll be leasing or chartering aircraft specifically for that, not necessarily using commercial flights. Leasing companies will be making a profit on the lease of the aircraft, for a couple of months, not per passenger transported.

Flight time, Dublin to Kyiv, is under 4 hours, not over 5. It's just over 3 hours to Lviv, if you want to be even safer and not fly that far east.

You were caught out making up bullshit. Stop digging.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119453879#Comment_119453879

Have you bothered to look it up? Not every family can afford college accommodation as well as fees, so the students commute. So what if they miss out on some of the social side. Life isn’t always fair. Just ask the Ukrainians who have nothing to go back to. Homes, jobs and territories gone.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454472#Comment_119454472

The difference is that the Irish and EU students here have far more right and entitlement to these things than Ukrainian guests.

I feel the need to say this again - we are providing temporary refuge to those who are fleeing imminent danger. We are NOT (supposedly anyway!) providing a resettlement programme, providing supports for economic migrants, or anyone else who arrives with a sad story under this response.

The only thing we are obliged to do is to provide these ACTUAL refugees shelter (even in tent form), food, and access to essential healthcare. We are NOT obliged to provide them apartments and housing, freebies, welfare entitlements (when we are already providing their basic needs), preferential access to schools or other services.

There is also nothing stopping these people returning home (to the massive area not impacted by the fighting), or going elsewhere should they not find the conditions here to their liking. This applies to all other refugees and the likes as well

We absolutely have NO obligation to put these other needs/wants of these people ahead of the needs and requirements of our own native or EU citizens and nor should we. We did not start the "war"/regional conflict and we have already provided more than enough direct aid to support Ukraine.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454534#Comment_119454534

Who is "We"?

It's not Ireland and it's obligations under the directive anyway.

Temporary Protection provides you with a wide range of supports, including:

• permission to reside in Ireland for a period of 1 year, and the permission may be extended for further periods after that
• full access to the labour market
• access to accommodation, if needed
• social welfare income supports
• access to education
• access to medical care

So again who is "We"?

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454547#Comment_119454547

I don't give a toss about an EU directive signed in a different time and under different conditions. It's not written in stone or blood and it's not a requirement that a country should run itself off a financial and societal cliff to meet the terms.

We have seen numerous times over the past decade that the EU can and does change, bypass, ignore or outright tear up its own "rules" when certain member interests require it (eg: the responses to the weaker countries - ourselves included - during the Financial Crisis).

"The EU made us do it" may be a defence used by the TDs all too often, but it doesn't wash with me or I dare say anyone else here who has been impacted by this nonsense

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454534#Comment_119454534

The difference is that the Irish and EU students here have far more right and entitlement to these things than Ukrainian guests.

They don’t though. It’s already been established that Ukrainian refugees have exactly the same rights as Irish citizens in respect of access to education.

The rest of it is just treading over the same old ground - Ukrainian refugees needs certainly are not being put ahead of anyone else’s requirements or needs, whether they be “our own natives” or EU citizens alike.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119453481#Comment_119453481

You have just illustrated why its not feasible for people to only commute to third level institutions near them.

60% of RCSI students aren't irish, all those people need to rent somewhere in Dublin to attend. Thats at least 60% of students who are not from Dublin, and need separate accommodation!

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454534#Comment_119454534

There is also nothing stopping these people returning home (to the massive area not impacted by the fighting)

"These people" 🙄 - the othering is important, isn't it.

I feel the need to say this again:

First, many millions are internally displaced and are being accommodated in western Ukraine.

But secondly, there have been many missile attacks on civilian targets, including those in "safe" "non-combat" areas. If your country was being illegally invaded, would you be happy moving your family from Dublin to Limerick, because Limerick is probably going to be safe?

How short people's memories are. It's literally only a couple of months since the 64km-long RuAF convoy was approaching Kyiv. They got as close as 30km from the centre of Kyiv and only aren't there now because of the fierce resistance they encountered combined with luck with the weather bogging down their main convoy.

• Odesa is on the Black Sea but nowhere near Donbas - repeatedly attacked with cruise missiles.
• Vinnytsia is in central Ukraine - attacked with rockets last month.
• Kremenchuk is also in central Ukraine, nowhere near a combat zone. A shopping mall attacked with missiles, during the day.
• Dnipropetrovsk: 13 civilians were killed by Russian strikes in the Dnipropetrovsk region in central Ukraine this week. Twelve of the victims were killed in strikes on the village of Marganets, on the other side of the Dnieper River from the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant

There are many more examples.

Finland and Sweden are now clamoring to join NATO. Why? Because they don't trust Russia to confine their expansion to the Donbas region (after they'd already annexed Crimea!). I think ordinary Ukrainian citizens, then, are perfectly justified in not hanging around in what boardsies deem to be "safe" areas.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454581#Comment_119454581

That, in a nutshell is what some are unable to understand. They rather listen to third and fourth hand waffle about Ukrainians going on holidays, working cash in hand, riding the system etc…..

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454571#Comment_119454571

Oh right, so you were masquerading nonsense opinions as fact.

Glad we cleared it up.

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454600#Comment_119454600

60% of RCSI students aren't irish, all those people need to rent somewhere in Dublin to attend. Thats at least 60% of students who are not from Dublin, and need separate accommodation!

Not necessarily. The RCSI has its own accommodation blocks and student services will help with other options. The Non-EU rate is nearly €60,000 so they can likely afford a slightly higher rent. It's still attractive to US and Canadian students because it has prestige and its fees are equivalent to or better than the top North American universities.

maninasia

Stick yer fingers in your ears Mary everything is just fine.

780 rentals in the entire country you will do your bit too taking in folks right?

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454603#Comment_119454603

I think ordinary Ukrainian citizens, then, are perfectly justified in not hanging around in what boardsies deem to be "safe" areas.

Only, it's not just boardsies that deem them to be 'safe' areas, is it? Even just going by your 'first' point, it isn't just boardsies.

First, many millions are internally displaced and are being accommodated in western Ukraine.

44 million + population.

An estimated 5 million have left Ukraine, with hundred of thousands returning.

An estimated 1.45 million have gone to Russia.

An estimated 7 million moved within Ukraine.

An estimated 32 million didn't move.

So it is not even the 'ordinary; Ukrainians, it is some of them, but mostly the 'unique' Ukrainians.

The biggest displacement happened at the start of the war, yet 6 months later we are still taking in at least 100,000.

Hundreds of thousands returning to the country, possibly even millions at this stage, less areas being attacked, less people being displaced from inside Ukraine, yet, you and a much much much lower portion of Ukrainians are telling everyone else in the world about the dangers.

The 39 million + in the country need to be told and warned about this now. How can we get the message to them?

Spanish Eyes

We are full up. Someone put up the drawbridge quick.

716 countrywide rentals? Could it be the daunting vista of landlords not being able to evict non paying/anti social/messing tenants for over a year or longer. It's a double tax on accommodation providers (where they pay a mortgage and get no rent), apart from the REITs who have a special little tax arrangement AFAIK.

Add in the Asylum/Refugee/Ukraine influx and it was never going to work. The day is coming when Irish citizens will demand respect for themselves and their children and will totally resent anyone "Furren" taking their houses and and living on the scratch. Why would they go back? They can pretend they are staying but unless and until a la carte returns back to their country of origin and/or holidays there are massively policed, it's no wonder they do it, and we are the mugs.

To the Barricades mes amis.....

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454674#Comment_119454674

An extremely intelligent and thought provoking post. Fair play to you.

Everything is NOT fine. People have to think outside the box and find alternatives, rather than sulk and complain on Internet forums.

No, I won’t be taking anyone in as my house and location are not suitable. Instead, I volunteer 10 hours a week, supporting refugees and locals where I can. That’s how I know so much about them. First hand knowledge. Not rubbish paraded as fact.

iamwhoiam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454472#Comment_119454472

Dont patronise me I am not stupid .I dont need to ask my lovely family of Ukrainians thanks I am fully aware of their situation . You are not the only one that knows about the Ukrainians plight you know . Jeez

The difference is I am also aware of the students plight as one doesn’t cancel out the other for my sympathy

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454669#Comment_119454669

The RCSI has its own accommodation same as other universities have their own 3rd level accommodation - however thats now been filled with Ukrainians. Also no 3rd level institute nationwide has enough dedicated accommodation to cater for their entire student population - there are always many many more people in rented private than on campus.

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119454728#Comment_119454728

"estimated", "possibly"... lots of facts, there.

"We're taking in at least 100,000" - you're out by a factor of 2.

7 million displaced internally. Out of a population of 41 million, that's 1/6th of the whole population - not counting Crimea. That's the equivalent of nearly everyone from greater Dublin leaving the county and moving to the rest of the 25 counties.

The 1.45 million who have "gone to Russia" didn't do so voluntarily!

"less areas being attacked" - bullshit. See earlier posts. It's more areas, not less, being attacked. Including shelling adjacent to nuclear power plants.

CeCe12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119452689#Comment_119452689

What a predictable response.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119455145#Comment_119455145

Interesting that you were expecting the question alright

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119455010#Comment_119455010

Your point was about non-residents, they are covered on that front if they can afford to spend €60,000 a year and they do not have to scramble or fight for accommodation .

DaithiMa

I've heard it all now. Are people seriously trying to claim that Ukrainian refugees are having zero effect on the availability of student accommodation? Do you think people are stupid?