Ukrainian refugees in Ireland - Megathread

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119489686#Comment_119489686

Jaysus... I'm glad you're not typical of the youth of today. What a sense of entitlement! The rest of us (well... some of us!) were on tax marches, housing protests, marches for divorce, marches for marriage equality, marches for abortion rights, marches against war. So... it might just be you.

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119489771#Comment_119489771

So what you're saying is there's a$$holes everywhere and in every community? Don't think anyone claimed they were all saints.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119490186#Comment_119490186

As each week goes by, and the problems here mount up (in part a direct result of this "war" and its "refugees"), I find myself caring less and less about sob-stories like this, and those pushing them. Wars and conflicts happen all over the world. It's sad, it's wrong, but we can't save everyone!

Yes, Russia is completely in the wrong here. Yes Putin is a "very bad man" and it's a very bad situation for anyone who actually IS caught up in it ... but WE here in Ireland are not responsible for any of it, and we cannot keep bending over to be taken advantage of by not only economic migrants and chancers, but our own Government. We've done more than enough to help/respond to this issue. We can't do any more!

The only ones who will ultimately stop the attacks and end the fighting are the Ukrainians and Russians - either through one of them achieving outright military victory which seems unlikely, or negotiated settlement which is far more likely and likely to be pushed for hard by the EU as the darker and colder months set in. General support and interest is already waning and it'll decline still further when people can't afford to put their heating on.

Back at home we can't even manage the numbers who have already arrived and yet we still have the same people saying we "need to do more!" - to what end? For whose benefit? It's certainly not benefitting the natives who are paying for all this and seeing their accesses to the same services affected, and it's not even helping the "refugees" who are ending up in tents that they are unhappy with.

The only thing you and others like you are actually doing now is making the situation worse. Again, to what end? How much is enough?

Of course, very shortly realpolitik will take over as I said earlier (just as it has with the Green agenda in Europe), and economic and individual national interests among the members of that Great Big Happy Family that is the EU will soon put an end to this one way or another I suppose. The problem for Ireland of course, is that we'll be dealing with the fallout for years and possibly decades to come.

maninasia

It's not a civil war.

I dont care if you like or dislike Zelensky its irrelevant to the topic here.

Muddying the waters between how the war is prosecuted and our policy to the refugees, I don't see any value in that.

And I want defined limits on refugee numbers. That's up to us.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119480544#Comment_119480544

Stop with the word empathy.

Boggles

So it's not a "war" therefore "refugees" can't exist and even if it was a "war" which it isn't "Ukraine" isn't even in "Europe" so it's not Europe's problem anyway, but if it is a "war" it's a "civil war" between 2 countries and it's not Europe's problem because they are not fighting in this "civil war".

Have I missed anything?

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119490304#Comment_119490304

That's called a war, and everyone knows what is going on.

That's why there are refugees - genuine refugees. They're here because it's the decent thing to do, and all EU countries are playing their part.

Why are we still taking more in? There are less than 3,000,000 Ukrainian Refugees in Europe now, and we have almost 2% of them (just over 1.7%) and that number is not getting smaller. If all EU countries are playing their part, do we all take in the same amount? or do we just keep luring them in with promises of free money? etc.. while it adds strain to out economy.

We have now played our part. We have taken in a more than acceptable ratio, we have no room left, and we can be proud of ourselves.

1.7+% of all current Ukrainian refugees in Europe (not just EU) for a country our size and with the resources we have is more than enough. Are we putting any limits on what amount of them can claim asylum here? I would guess that of the ones going to the furthest part of Europe away from them, there is a fairly good chance that it will be a lot of them. Probably when the money pool starts running out.

maninasia

He is not an actor he is the president of a country at war and he has done a pretty good job to be fair under the most testing of circumstances.

Lets get the refugees in Ireland topic back on track.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119490954#Comment_119490954

Well if you're really asking...

It's a relatively localised conflict between 2 neighbouring countries on the edge of Europe - neither of whom are members of the EU, and where one (what we now call Ukraine) was actually dominated by several foreign powers over the past few hundred years, only actually becoming united after WWII and independent in 1991 following the dissolution of the USSR.

This is arguably then the latest instalment in a long history of territorial disputes and control over the region.

None of that has anything to do with the fact that Ireland has more than done its part to help though.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119491010#Comment_119491010

He's a former comedy actor who is now a politician and President - nothing wrong with that. Reagan similarly had an acting background for example.

The problem with Zelensky stems with his hosting of celebs and trash magazine writers/photographers which seems a bit distasteful while his country and citizens fight the Russians. He seems to have taken to his new-found fame and international praise a little TOO well.

Ronan|Raven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119490021#Comment_119490021

Claremorris?

ShamNNspace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119491058#Comment_119491058

Around that area 🤔

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119490954#Comment_119490954

Are you talking to me?

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119491236#Comment_119491236

I think they are quoting the noise in their head. A lot of quotes...

Mac_Lad71

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119489784#Comment_119489784

So you want me to provide my name, address and pps number just to satisfy you.

Spain do pay money but not as much as treasure Ireland as you well know.

I've actually met and spoken to Ukrainian welfare tourists unlike you in your utopian ivory tower.

I mentioned it before but I really hope that this government start renting out full hotels to give over to students. All I'm hearing are tales of woe about trying to get student accommodation, locally here and nationally.

It's an out and out disgrace that they're being displaced to house refugees. This country needs a well educated work force who work and pay taxes. Our economy will buckle if the government keeps increasing our Social Welfare Bill like it has been.

road_high

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119491056#Comment_119491056

No time for Zelenskyy since he took a completely unwarranted pop at Ireland over our apparent lack of support for their (utterly farcical) EU membership application- as we waste billions propping up his brave welfare tourists no questions asked. That was the thanks we got.

If I was in charge I tell the self serving prick where he can shove it along with any support for EU membership. They are the last thing the EU needs. Turkey should be let in way before these jokers. Least they’ve been trying to join for decades and have something to offer in terms of an economy

Strumms

There really seems to be a ‘fûck the students under a bus’ approach. A real smart assed, malevolence to it all.

nobody in my family will be impacted but any politician from this government who in the next few years knocks on my door canvassing will just be reminded of their desire to make citizens in this country well and truly second class and enabling the absolute shafting of vulnerable young people whose reward for working hard to attain a college place with which to further work hard, attain a qualification that will enable them a further education with which to get a job and contribute to society only to find out they are fuckéd for somewhere to live… the Ukrainian thing, that’s why… a war, over 3000 kilometres away, yet, welcome one and all, and remember… NO LIMITS

a day and a half travelling to get here.

road_high

Driving through Waterford earlier another nice collection of welfare tourist vehicles all the way from the “devastated” war zone- a nice BMW X3 driven by a guy 30s-40s chillin in his baseball cap. Not a care in the world- and why would he?

Brand new lovely Peugeot 5008 parked up by tramore prom on their holliers- same car retails €40k plus here. This whole thing is an unbridled farce

uli84

nice discussion, anyways, what is the story with them “refugees” - are they going to start working and pay rent etc like everyone else or the freebies are for indefinite amount of time?

slay55

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119491946#Comment_119491946

Only time will tell but I doubt it . All the Ukrainian lovers on here will say most are working and contributing

Subzero3

Cash in hand and keep the benefits. Why would u sacrifice 3 meals a day in a hotel and 208 quid a week to work in McDonald's for 450 a week after tax, then have to buy your own food and pay for rent and fuel costs.

Thats only for sucker's like us paying tax.

Mr. teddywinkles

I see kingspan are investing 400m in a plant in ukraine on the rte news this morning. Must be going to built in between the bomb craters

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119491029#Comment_119491029

So I will add it's not really a country so there can't be a "war".

😂

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119492473#Comment_119492473

You can add whatever you wish, but it doesn't change the reality or accuracy of what I said.

It's a regional conflict that is predominately confined to a limited area in a vast country (Ukraine) involving 2 neighbouring countries with a history of bad blood between them, over an area of land and resources that has changed hands numerous times over the last several hundred years.

It'll eventually be settled (likely in the next few months) with a redraw of the map. Whether that's right or not (it isn't by the way) is besides the point. This is about politics (as all such things are) - hence the weaponisation of the EU's gas supplies by Russia. Putin knows that when the pressures at home become too much, Zelensky will be told to get to the table and hammer out an agreement by his new EU friends.

All Russia has to do is wait it out, which they are politically able to do. Putin and his supporters don't care if the Russian people suffer as a result. These guys are billionaires and insulated entirely from the effects on the street. As with the military, the public are seen as expendable assets when necessary in pursuit of their goals.

That's what the modern crop of Western leaders and social media crusaders are missing. The Russian leadership has the control and will to see this through to the end, regardless of sanctions or weak statements from the EU or Biden, or being cancelled by social media. They don't think like we do, and they're not beholden to or influenced by the nashing and wailing on Twitter.

Putin and his government know this too. It's why they have also weaponised Ukranian migration, as they were well aware of the problems and division it would cause in Europe - especially in the aftermath of the economic damage caused by covid, and with a recession already on the horizon before a single Russian troop crossed the border.

The goal here isn't to conquer Ukraine in my opinion. It's to continue to weaken and distabilise the EU (something that needs very little effort really) and strengthen Russian interests in the region to where something akin to the old USSR eventually takes shape.

Putin and his supporters are playing the long game. If Putin himself dies or is somehow replaced, it'll likely be by someone who will be of the same mindset or even worse.

Of course, all this is wasted on you Boggles and I know that, but it would do you no harm to read some history of the countries and politics involved before you embarrass yourself still further.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119492633#Comment_119492633

Your fawning over big bad Vlad is quite something.

But if his goal as you suggest was to weaken the EU, he has failed miserably, the discontent from the EU was primarily coming from the Eastern Countries, the war has now galvanised the entire EU and in stark terms pointed out why these countries are far better off in the bloc.

It's why they have also weaponised Ukranian migration

You can say refugees, it won't be make you any less of a hero.

But what's the antidote to the weaponization of refugees, the Temporary Directive. Penny Drop?

The goal here isn't to conquer Ukraine in my opinion

So you are getting different intelligence to the US, UK and NATO? 😂

The goal was and still is to conquer the entirety of the sovereign country, destabilise Europe / World and push on into other countries.

That's not possible now because of the bravery and sacrifice of the Ukrainian people combined with the Wests support, both militarily and financially.

So the master strategist has cut his country off from the most lucrative markets in the world, made himself a lapdog for China and forced 2 of the richest countries in the world to join NATO, one which neighbours him all whilst trying to hide the bodies of 10s of 1000s of young Russian soldiers.

But he knows exactly what he is doing? 😂

Anyway probably best you take your unique insights to the appropriate thread - I'll gladly continue the debate there with you, this one is for inventing stories about refugees.

Subzero3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119492793#Comment_119492793

What exactly is your point?

Potatoeman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119492793#Comment_119492793

Putin completely miscalculated the response he would get after the Crimea invasion. That response emboldened him to launch the current invasion. It made the EU look weak and Germany have a lot to answer for with their soft response and dependency on Russia gas. Though the idea that the EU is united in their response is very dependent on many factors and an energy crisis during winter may very well break it. It’s very easy to insist on a united front when the lights and heating haven’t gone off.

Unrealistic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119491897#Comment_119491897

I'm struggling to see the point you're trying to make here.

Is it that people who owned nice cars are somehow bulletproof and can't therefore genuinely be fleeing war? Or that they are obviously rich so should be sunning themselves in Cannes rather than in Waterford?

Owning a Peugeot doesn't exactly make you part of the jet set.

A thought exercise: fast-forward a couple of decades to a future where Britain has spiralled into a (more) jingoistic junta and decides to recapture the entire island of Ireland for the UK. Should anyone who manages to get their family into a car and onto a ferry from Rosslare to mainland Europe be told to f%@k off home if their car happens to be worth more than a certain amount?

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119492930#Comment_119492930

Wasn't just Crimea. Putin was acting with increasing impunity for years. He overstepped the mark, now I imagine he is checking his underpants every morning.

So you think an energy crisis at the whim of the master strategist every year going forward is better for the EU as he invades more countries and destabilises Europe and the world further?

Or do you think it might be better to front load the pain now and detangle ourselves for good?

A lunatic waging war in Europe, was never going to be cost free, whatever the Putin fanboys would have you believe.