So "X" - nothing to see here. Elon's in control - Part XXX

brickster69

A bit stupid to send a letter via x a few hours before Musk's chat, no idea what the point of mentioning Trump was at all.

https://twitter.com/vtchakarova/status/1823389105721684028

pjohnson

The delightful Ryan George (Pitch Meetings Guy).

his Elon is too stable.

https://youtu.be/u_Tx1SG0Clw?si=cNXrRpn8aNunkBRg

corkie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122499293#Comment_122499293

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122499477#Comment_122499477

@brickster69 Thanks for confirming my post (from politico) with a more reputable source (ft.com). Wondering if both spoke to the same EU Commission personnel?

Main take away: - "On Tuesday the European Commission denied that Breton had approval from its president Ursula von der Leyen to send the letter."

I wonder what position he will now be getting in the EU Commision now, or is he a scapegoated for not well planned out timing of the issuing of the letter, given the amount of feedback they got?

Harika

Musk interviewing sorry chatting with trump was like Swifties chatting with Taylor Swift.

Harris campaign will love the sound bites of it.

@Corkie have you tried clearing the Browser cache. You seem to be the only one having threat issues

corkie

@Harika I will try that the next time it happens, but reported in 'Bugs' thread, it happens to other threads as well. I'm not the only person to experience the bug. When threads cross the new page it takes at least 4 new posts in the page for the thread to unlock the page. On very active threads it probably goes unnoticed.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122487552#Comment_122487552

ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122499959#Comment_122499959

no, they are not the only one. and not only only this thread. Just stopped mentioning issues as it doesnt seem to make a difference.

Brussels Sprout

Elon Musk has clearly made Twitter immeasurably worse with his hands off approach to the racists and conspiracy theorists. It's actually worse than that though. It's not just the case that people are allowed to post pretty much whatever vile and false content that they want, Musk's Twitter actively incentivizes them to do so. That's because when people sign up to Twitter Blue they can become eligible to receive payments from Twitter if they "drive engagement".

In other words if they can get a lot of viral tweets or tweets with a lot of comments then they can earn money. What drives engagement more than anything on social media? Anger, fear and resentment. What we now have is a cottage industry of grifters who are making it their business to post inflammatory things in the hope that they get lots of angry replies and quote tweets. If you go to any tweet on pretty much any topic you will see that the comments underneath (which show Twitter Blue accounts first, by design) will feature accounts that have very few actual followers tweeting out awful things. These people are basically on a fishing expedition.

Essentially he has monetised trolling. The only bright spot is that apparently the actual payments have fallen off a cliff from the early days. You can actually see some of these accounts complaining about how their monthly payments have dropped off severely.

corkie

I know it is from last November or something like that? But been shared by a few accounts today. Even Musk has tweeted. Good that he can have fun with it. "Staying Alive".

Try that again, think he deleted the tweet and reposted.

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1823742501884453312

I get that everyone's twitter experience is different based on algorithms. New accounts with no personalized feed to analyse are feed the most popular vile content. With not much effort, I seem to have curated my feed to see things I like. Don't see much vile content myself and I'm not saying it doesn't exist. So we all are probably in our own filter bubbles, of content.

Don't get that paying subscription to service, you may get a payment back. Are they earning much back through it?

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122502952#Comment_122502952

In terms of cash flow, Twitter are unlikely to be making much cause their owner is using it as his political playground.

Meanwhile there's been an FEC complaint that the interview was a violation of campaigning laws. Their comments on unions has also resulted in the teamsters turning on him which is great. 😂

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-trainwreck-elon-musk-interview-140431231.html

Harika

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122502952#Comment_122502952

What you earn depends on how much clicks/views you generate. Payout has declined a lot and 90% of the users were not getting anything. 9 dollars for every 1 million views, no payout of below 50 dollar. So you need 6 million views to get 4 dollar.

Brussels Sprout

Trump is still posting his rants on Truth Social whereas his Twitter account appears to have ceased posting again (apart from a couple of posts linking to his talk with Musk yesterday).

Here's a fresh rant from this morning

I suspect that he doesn't even have Twitter on his own personal phone.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122503255#Comment_122503255

I think he's under some kind of contractual obligation that everything has to go out on Truth Social first by 6hrs or something

So many lies and flat out wrong information there..

"Fascist stuff , the old Soviet Union" ??? Not sure Stalin was a Fascist…

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122503412#Comment_122503412

Shhhh.... Details are for poor people…

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122503412#Comment_122503412

Perhaps he had the Commie-Nazi's from that Simpsons joke in mind

Bobson Dugnutt

Logged in for the first time in ages. It’s all fighting videos, US culture war politics and far-right accounts for me. And my account would have been curated around restaurants, sport and science. Just a cesspit. Will be closing it tonight once I export my bookmarks. Dangerous site ran by a dangerous man.

fullstop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122501760#Comment_122501760

Don’t forget the porn. All the porn. First 50 replies to every half-interesting post is essentially a mass of porn bots posting stupid **** like “interesting”, “good”, etc. to generate clicks…kinda how that bellend of an owner posts actually…

randd1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122498269#Comment_122498269

Not so much Joe Rogan.

People would have issues with some of his views, but an awful lot of his interviews are actually a good listen, and he has all sorts on his show, and for the most part he has fairly liberal views on things. He's the type of lad who could have Trump on his show one week, and Kamala Harris the next. He genuinely seems more interested in what people have to say because he's smart enough to know he's not that smart, and gives them free reign to do it. And some of the episodes, particularly the ones from physicists, sports people, comedians and war journalists, are just good shows. There's no harm in engaging with different viewpoints, which is what he does well.

On the other hand, Musk and Trump are just narcissistic man-children that think they should be the masters of the world and are completely divorced from reality. Peterson is a once normal guy with decent arguments turned con-man who realized he can make serious money by sounding like a smart version of a right-wing nutjob to angry dumb sh!ts. The sooner them grifters die off, the better.

And yes, tax the millionaires. Odd that when they used to tax the very wealthy, things were more affordable for everyone because they didn't have to tax the poor and middle class to afford public spending requirements.

corkie

Define 'Hate Speech'!

https://www.euronews.com/next/2024/08/15/ireland-to-clamp-down-on-social-media-companies-refusing-to-remove-hate-speech

• “Most of the tech companies probably will honour this new code of conduct from Coimisiúin na Mean because they will have to and it’s backed up by the Digital Services Act which is an EU-wide law with very large fines," Adrian Weckler, Technology Correspondent at the Irish Independent, said.
• “There a few outliers which local politicians here in Ireland and across Europe up to and including European Commissioners have taken aim at. The notable one is X,” he added.

If the UN can't decide https://www.un.org/en/hate-speech/understanding-hate-speech/what-is-hate-speech

However, to date there is no universal definition of hate speech under international human rights law.

Are we to believe Ireland and EU Commision can finally put a definition on it? Concerning if they do, they will also be ones to enforce censorship and moderation of the platforms.

https://twitter.com/Casey5122dark/status/1823757389067407833

Disclaimer: - Shared a tweet, not an endorsement of the 'X' account.

Also could 'X' work without 'recommender systems'/algorithms?

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41456017.html

In January, a survey by the Irish Council for Civil Liberties found that 82% of Irish people want “big tech’s toxic algorithms switched off”.

The NGO ICCL lobbying our politicians.

Is this attack on social media by our and UK politicians, just a deflection from more serious matters?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122506528#Comment_122506528

I'd say most people just don't want to be force fed Elon Musk's dick for breakfast and would prefer the opportunity to not consent to being brain raped by him on a daily basis, for example by turning off the toxic algorithms

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122506528#Comment_122506528

In relation to recommender systems, there's been huge demand for greater transparency on the underlying algorithms and how such feeds are determined. That's not just limited to civil rights groups. That's not just limited to social media, it includes Netflix, Spotify, Google etc. It's also a pretty important part of the DSA. Given the fact a recommender system on any platform can influence everyone so drastically means people should be allowed to gain a level of understanding of how it's determined.

corkie

Elon got a community note on them!

That note didn't last long. Glad I screenshotted. Tweet.

No one is forced to use the platforms. And interactions on the platforms decide what your given.

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122507012#Comment_122507012

And you can say that all you want but legally everything from Tesco to Spotify to Twitter will be expected to be far more transparent on the underlying decision making. It's an ethical issue and the EU are playing catch up ultimately. I'm guessing the likes of California will follow suit with similar laws and all platforms will be expected to follow them. And guess what, they all have to follow the laws in the locations they're operating in...

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122506186#Comment_122506186

I'd agree that the non-political content is often quite good. The long form interview works really well and Rogan himself has a natural curiosity when it comes to things like astro-physics so he's never short of questions when interviewing experts in those fields.

However I have to push back at the assertion that Rogan is even handed when it comes to politics. He's not. He's massively biased in one direction and has only gone more so in that direction in the last few years. Yeah he has the odd person on espousing liberal views but they're in the minority when it comes to political guests on the show.

More often than not his guests are alt-right types (Jordan Peterson, Ben Shapiro, Tim Pool) or in many cases outright grifters and conspiracy theorists (Alex Jones, Robert Malone). He likes nothing better than having someone on who he can have a moan with about how "woke" the world is now. When he does have people "from the left" on they are often conspiracy theory/grifter types (Jimmy Dore, Matt Taibbi) or whatever the hell Tulsi Gabbard is these days.

I think the Pandemic broke him in a sense.

silliussoddius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122507064#Comment_122507064

Rogan is a hack, he still thinks Alex Jones is some reputable source of information, he more or leas tried to rehabilitate him after the Sandy Hook publicity. He should be on every anti-drug advertisement going. There should be a bullibility scale named after him.

https://www.sportskeeda.com/mma/news-joe-rogan-talks-authenticity-joe-biden-s-state-of-the-union-address-amid-allegations-pre-recorded-speech

francois

Fortune on X's financial position, and potential trouble for Tesla stock

https://fortune.com/2024/08/15/elon-musk-tesla-stock-sale-twitter-x-advertiser-boycott-finances-bradford-ferguson/

Brussels Sprout

Elon Musk is attempting to sue advertisers for not wanting to advertise on his platform.

Accounts like this one (with 95k followers) pumping out pro-Hitler propaganda are the reason that no reputable company wants their adverts appearing there:

And don't fool yourself into thinking that Musk's Twitter isn't aware of this account, after all it's one of millions on the platform right? Wrong. This account posted the following tweet

Twitter users reacted collectively and added a Community Note

Somebody in Twitter decided to remove that Community Note.

So somebody in the company had a look at that account and thought "This all seems fine, and I'm actually going to side with them on this and effectively encourage them to push out even more Nazi-loving content".

corkie

@Brussels Sprout Why are you giving the accounts crap content more views by sharing here?

I'm certainly not going to verify/confirm the accounts content by going to look at it myself. Don't want the algorithms feeding more of the same crap. Hope you have alternative accounts, because I sure wouldn't like to see your feed?

Community notes don't seem to stay up long. You have effectively proved that there is vile content on the platform, but we all know that, without the need to see it?

https://htxt.co.za/2024/07/xs-reluctance-to-remove-content-has-reportedly-upset-the-eu/

Last year the Centre for Countering Digital Hate conducted a study and found that antisemitism, racism, neo-Nazism, and white supremacy were flourishing on X and vile content remained on the platform long after it was reported. While X argues that few people see this content thanks to the aforementioned moderation policy, that’s simply not good enough as content not being removed emboldens those posting it and the content gets more extreme.

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122511056#Comment_122511056

Cause Elon Musk is fine with the recommender system actively promoting Nazis. Most platforms would be actively banning Nazis but Twitter is actively receiving subscriptions from such individuals and seems to be happy to do so. That's more than simply vile content being present.

briany

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122506186#Comment_122506186

I like Rogan's interviews with people such as Amazon conservationist, Paul Rosolie, but the thing that Rogan has been pulled up on before was having his show being considerably more weighted towards guests of a right-wing political bent. It also seems like he was a lot more amenable to criticising Joe Biden than Donald Trump, like the time he mistakenly believed that Biden mentioned airports while talking about the American revolution, and commented on his mental acuity, only then to be told it was actually Trump who said it, and Rogan just laughed it off.

https://variety.com/2023/digital/news/joe-rogan-fact-checked-biden-trump-revolutionary-war-airports-1235849684/

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122511167#Comment_122511167

Not to mention the time he said his friend's wife was a teacher in a school where they had to put a litter tray in the girls bathrooms because a student there identified as a cat.

Which turned out to be something Fox News were trying to claim was happening in numerous schools but turned out to actually be schools having littertray-type stuff in their classrooms in case people are trapped there for an extended amount of time in the event of a school shooting (because America). So Fox News backtracked and stopped mentioning it, and when Rogan was asked about it he mentioned he was trying to get clarification from his friend's wife but she actually no longer worked at that school and couldn't get in contact with anyone who still worked there.

Rogan is an absolute idiot. The trouble is he used to know that and could actually have decent conversations with people where he tried to learn more about something. But the more popular he got the more he thinks he's the smart one, and his research (aka google until you find something interesting and already aligns with your own opinion) is comparable to actual facts.

corkie

@Brussels Sprout Just a few things that came to mind with you sharing them screenshots?

• Do you have the above setting enabled?
• Or had you to click through the warning to see them?
• I'm sure more extreme content is available but not suitable to share here!
• With all the screenshots you took, by any chance did you report any tweets (for all the good it would do)?
• On twitter, I can choose not to see and even block that content.
• Posting here people don't have the option not to see it.

@eightieschewbaccy Most platforms would be actively banning Nazis but Twitter is actively receiving subscriptions

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/x-twitter-elon-musk-nazi-extremist-white-nationalist-accounts-rcna145020

Elon Musk’s X is a thriving hub for Nazi support and propaganda, with paid subscribers sharing speeches by Adolf Hitler or content praising his genocidal regime.

NBC News found that at least 150 paid “Premium” subscriber X accounts and thousands of unpaid accounts have posted or amplified pro-Nazi content on X in recent months, often in apparent violation of X’s rules.

https://fra.europa.eu/en/eu-charter/article/11-freedom-expression-and-information

I would still be in favour of the above, even if it means above content is platformed. I have choice to read/view/block it.

https://twitter.com/rickygervais/status/1824079798240444906

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122511056#Comment_122511056

I posted screenshots. I didn't link to the account. If people really want to find accounts like that then they'll find them very easily on Elon Musk's twitter

It's not difficult to find accounts like that. I'm somebody who reads the replies under tweets. From there you can click on peoples profiles and that's how I often find accounts like this.

Before Elon Musk took over it was extremely difficult to find this kind of content. That's because after the first complaint some human would see it and the account would be suspended. Whatever department did that kind of job has been gutted under Musk.

No, I haven't changed any settings. I didn't have to jump through any hoops. I didn't even have to use the search function. I found these organically one or 2 hops away from tweets along the network tree away from tweets in my own timeline.

The reason I'm posting those vile images in this thread because I want people to see what unrestricted speech on social media ultimately leads to. Are they jarring? Yes. Disgusting? Yes. Clearly Ignorant? Yes.

Free speech absolutists like to focus on the "speaking truth to power" aspect. The thing is Musk has actually banned activist accounts in many countries that are speaking truth to power at the request of authoritarian regimes. Meanwhile in a liberal democracy with established civil rights what those absolutist are left arguing for is the right for cretins to post memes feting Adolf Hitler.

Every site that stops moderating content eventually just becomes a place full of Nazi memes.

This is what you want. You should own it not hide from it.

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122511883#Comment_122511883

And platforms like Twitter are still entirely deserving of criticism for profiting off of and promoting Nazis. Historically groups like stormfront pretty much disappeared due to violating terms of hosting services. I think most people would agree that this didn't act as some disservice to free speech. The fact a billionaire has made one of the largest social media platforms into a hub for white supremacists and neo Nazis is very much so a public safety issue btw. So regulations on such platforms tends to be a consequence.

And I think we're gonna see such consequences in the EU and US for such platforms. Most don't have the same issues as Twitter though.

corkie

I want people to see what unrestricted speech on social media ultimately leads to.

Every site that stops moderating content eventually just becomes a place full of Nazi memes.

This is what you want. You should own it not hide from it.

Never said that is what I want! I said before I'm not against the DSA in principal, but concerned that it may go to the extremes on the other end.

I sometimes read replies to tweets, but rarely go to trouble of clicking on the profiles of random accounts.

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122512480#Comment_122512480

Unrestricted free speech is literally what you want, you don't see the issue with them promoting Nazis over unpaid users.

I would still be in favour of the above, even if it means above content is platformed. I have choice to read/view/block it.

briany

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122511230#Comment_122511230

Impeccable timing - Peter Thiel is Rogan's latest guest.

corkie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122512493#Comment_122512493

I already called it VILE content, that I didn't need to see to know it existed! And enforced your statement with the link provided https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/x-twitter-elon-musk-nazi-extremist-white-nationalist-accounts-rcna145020

I maybe bad expressing my views on it, difficult topic to articulate on.

Supporting free speech means supporting the free speech rights even of people you vehemently disagree with. In fact, it means supporting especially the rights of people you vehemently disagree with. If you only support the free speech rights of people you agree with, or mostly agree with, or at least don’t completely disagree with, you are in fact supporting suppression of speech. ~ https://controlaltbackspace.org/free/

Vile content on twitter (probably more extreme than what is screenshotted) we are discussing but fine to be shared on here as well? @Brussels Sprout is utilizing his freedom of expression in the content posted.

comerla

I was a user of Twitter for 14 years and deactivated my account and deleted the app this morning.

I was on holidays the past couple of weeks and spent a lot of time in it and could not believe how much messed up sh*t it was serving me. Loads of anti- trans, anti immigration, pro-Israeli and also pro nazi stuff as referenced above.

Musk has ruined Twitter and it’s not good for anyone’s mental health to be on there after what they have done with it. This is a shame as it’s important to have a forum where content on Gaza etc is accessible but I just could not take any more of it.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122512892#Comment_122512892

I see people saying this a lot but if you just stick in your "following" feed I don't see any of that nonsense. Yes the "for you" feed is utter shite but I still find the service use able if I just never look in there.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122512949#Comment_122512949

Agreed. Once you stick to your Following account, for the most part it's fine. That said, the increase in hate content on the site means an increase in outrage engagement farming which means an increase in people you follow reply tweeting or screenshotting that content to post about it, thereby feeding said outrage engagement. So there has definitely still been something of an increase even on the Following tab, but at least you have some control over that rather than the crud it tries to feed you on the For You tab.

weisses

Just ban X in the EU ... its a dangerous platform plus it would piss off Musk ..... win,win

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122512682#Comment_122512682

Can you clarify, do you think it's okay that Twitter receives money and actively gives Nazi content a promoted position in contrast to other tweets?

The poster is sharing the content as examples of how Musk is promoting such content to millions and is happy to allow it to remain on the site. Basically it's making the platform ideal for radicalizing.

SchrodingersCat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122511230#Comment_122511230

Rogan really is an idiot. He falls for stupid right-wing conspiracy theories all the time.
In a newer episode, like a week ago, he was claiming that the democrats were pre-recording the State of the Union addresses instead of having them live.
One of his staff asked him how he knew. He said if you looked at Bidens watch you would see the time flip around.
The staff member asked him how the democrats got the republicans onboard with this conspiracy, considering they are there and seen in the audience.

He pauses and says “ah man, the trolls got me”.

He is an idiot who cannot critically analyse anything, and will just believe what he is told. He is dangerous because he gives a platform to people who will take advantage of that, like Alex Jones.

Enzokk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122512682#Comment_122512682

I never understood the need for free speech or the willingness to give this to people. I mean we do not allow people to drive when they are intoxicated because we know it leads to bad outcomes, why should free speech not be subject to the same checks we do with every other aspect of life? What makes free speech special?

I get it, some nefarious actors will use restrictions to their benefit, but that is already being abused in countries where you have the freedom to say almost anything. Take the bill to restrict protests if they were loud or were a nuisance in the UK. It will happen, but funnily enough the same people saying you should be able to be as offensive as you like with your speech is also the same people ready to ban those speaking against them when they don't like it. Funny that.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122512949#Comment_122512949

For the record I never use the "For You" feed. I exclusively use the "Following" feed.

However, as I mentioned above I like to read the replies to tweets and I often click through to view the profiles of people's accounts. That's often how I regularly come across this abhorrent content.

Now somebody might say - "Well why don't you change your behaviour then?"

To that I say that I have been using this site for 12 years. This is how I have always used it.

I liken it to someone who lives in a city centre. If they remark that they've seen more open drug taking, aggressive begging and petty crime on the streets recently and suggest that something should be done about it by the authorities then the response shouldn't be "Perhaps you should move to the suburbs instead".

Putting up blinkers so that we don't see the toxic content on Twitter misses the point. Millions of other people will still see it and it'll continue to poison the social and political discourse in countries throughout the world.

corkie

US Congress didn't like Mr Breton letter so replied.

https://twitter.com/JudiciaryGOP/status/1824564435853197820

So they don't like the interference in US politics.

As @Harika tried to point out below the house is controlled by republicans

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_House_of_Representatives

https://nypost.com/2024/08/16/us-news/eu-plot-to-silence-great-americans-like-elon-musk-blasted/

“In furtherance of our oversight, the Select Subcommittee has examined how other governments, including the European Union (EU), have sought to censor speech online,” one of their reports noted.

While members of Congress cannot investigate foreign governments, they can defend American companies and protect them by publicly pushing back against censorship.

Congress doesn't like EU censorship. Wondering how there viewpoints hold up if Trump gets elected.

Harika

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122513589#Comment_122513589

Not US Congress, Republicans

Harika

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122513193#Comment_122513193

There is a long ongoing discussion if social media like X is a publisher. If you see them as this, they are liable for the content on their platform. Not even the Daily Mail would put up the garbage that Elon shares, as they would be sued to the ground.

corkie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122513884#Comment_122513884

America has Section 230!

https://aura.american.edu/articles/journal_contribution/Section_230_Parler_and_the_Illusion_of_free_speech_on_the_Internet/23769723?file=41709219

Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act was born. The law
itself is fairly curt and straightforward because presently, only section (c) stands [5]: “No
provider or user of an interactive computer service shall be treated as the publisher or speaker
of any information provided by another information content provider [6].” For further
clarication, this means that websites and other internet-based services are not held responsible
for what users themselves post or the platforms, the users themselves are responsible ….

Probably why UK is targeting individuals and sentencing them for social media content.

And I agree that free speech online is an illusion!

https://twitter.com/Klaus_Arminius/status/1824774219621708159

Disclaimer: Sharing a tweet! Not endorsing the account linked or mentioned

Harika

Waynegb88 not subtle...

Anyway should not have pleaded guilty. Examiner today mentioned that the UK have better understanding how to deal with such rioters/misinformation breeders than Ireland.