LC Written Examiners, 2022

deiseindublin

Bumping last year's thread looking for info for a young student teacher (Maths).

Did they ever publish JC rates last year? They haven't corrected before and wondering about applying and moving around dates/plans to be able to correct.

I think I heard someone comment JC is not great, but I suppose 'not great' is better than no pay at all.

Chances are a student teacher wouldn't be accepted but who knows.

Random sample

Depends on the type of student teacher. Bottom line is that you need to have a degree, so some subjects will take pme 1s, but not people who are heading into 4th year of a teaching degree.

I didn’t see rates published last year and did LC myself, but there’s usually a fair difference between the two. On the other hand, you get through the JCs a lot quicker.

gaiscioch

I accepted the subject and level I usually accept, but I really want to correct one of my other subjects for the first time. In order to have the best chance at correcting the new subject, should I just not accept the usual subject and apply solely for the new subject?

Random sample

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120256758#Comment_120256758

I’d send in a new application with the subject you want on it. I’d add to the form somewhere the other info (that you have marked X but would prefer to mark Y this year).

spurious

The big plus a student teacher would have correcting is that they would very often be on the low rate of tax.

The rates of pay for correcting have increased a lot and the online marking takes an awful lot of the bs out of the whole experience.

drserious4

Primary teacher here with fifteen years experience and a masters in history along with my B. ED.

Never taught in a secondary school but have taught local history to adults and given courses on teaching history to primary teachers.

Would it be worth applying to correct history LCs or JCs in future or would they not consider me?

Random sample

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120291505#Comment_120291505

The basic requirement for JC is a relevant degree, so definitely worth your while applying. I don’t know about LC, I would imagine teaching experience in the syllabus is needed.

gaiscioch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120291505#Comment_120291505

Yes, apply. You'll be shocked at how short-staffed the SEC can be.

Similarly, apply for jobs in every school you want when you get to that stage. It's quite shocking how few people are applying for so many teaching jobs in even the most supposedly prestigious secondary schools in Ireland. And, yes, this has very obvious consequences about the standard of the teachers who are being recruited in this context of few applicants - but nobody seems to be linking both yet.

Theduke1960

Until they pay more there will be a continuous shortage. Pure and simple and that goes for all SEC contracts. Supervisors and correction.

The covid probably a factor as people wanted to travel after it or got used to the time off but I'm convinced it's a money problem at heart.

2011abc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120357977#Comment_120357977

And many years after(they 'pay more ') ....They have completely destroyed the goodwill of teachers .They had a super skilled cohort of correctors /supervisors etc and blackguarded (can't let the auld phrases die!)them for decades with interminable payment delays ,below minimum wage effective payments ,multiple shenanigans eg not paying for July provision that might involve the slightest change to spec (they wont be able to get the best people to do that new enhanced July Provision scheme this year either-it will probably end up being done by the local swimming pool lifeguard or GAA club Under 9s assistant coach etc )They could offer 10k euro and many would refuse .They cant be trusted ,goodwill has been destroyed .Maybe the Junior Cycle kids will get their results as a Christmas present from Norma this year .Scarey times for irish education system .

Theduke1960

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120360637#Comment_120360637

Very interesting post. Thank you.

Very informative

I have a similar issue with an organisation I work for part time

They were not paying people enough to supervise third level students. Then they upped the work load.

People will vote with their feet

spurious

So true 2001abc and now, between the extra money and online marking, it is not at all as tiresome as it used to be, but the younger (and part time) teachers who could do quite nicely out of it (if earning below about 30k) have heard enough stories from older teachers that they are avoiding it.

The chickens came home to roost.

dory

Can anyone remember roughly when conference dates were published last year? I remember they were up early enough as they were trying to attract people and be as transparent as possible about dates you'd be needed. I've applied, but will only be doing it if the dates fit my plans.

Someone asked about pay a few posts ago - I asked last year in an email and they sent me the into very quickly. Worth emailing them to ask.

Cat82

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120372003#Comment_120372003

https://secexaminer.ie/conference-dates/

Came across this page this evening.

dory

Perfect, thanks! I'm a little bit earlier than last year.

briochebunny

Hi there,

Just looking for clarification around the marking period. I have been accepted to correct JC French this year and I have an event the weekend of the 8th. Is this a deal breaker? Do I really need to be available 7/7 24/7 for the 26 day marking period?

spurious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120439818#Comment_120439818

What date are you starting? You will be quite busy for the first week or so, to make targets (sample 20, 1st 100 etc.).

If your event is in the 2nd week or so, you might be able to make up time and allow for it. It depends how efficient you are at marking. Have you done it before?

Grueller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120439818#Comment_120439818

I corrected for years (about 16 actually) and unless you have an absolute power tripper of an advising team you will be fine.

Geuze

Would it be fair to say that the 48.5% marginal tax rate on income over 40k leads to a lack of supply of teachers to mark exams?

amacca

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120534413#Comment_120534413

Maybe it has changed but that was only part of it for me....the pay rate never mind the tax and the amount of time given up to do it were drawbacks too

I hated it tbh.....3/4/5 weeks of solid get up at 6/7 and work 4 hrs half hour off and then another 4 and a half hours.......it was tedious boring repetitive attention to detail work that came with a lot of responsibility (now I reckon I probably was a bit slower than some etc) ..... anyway you could get similar money working for a couple more weeks in the local spar with much less hassle/responsibility and not have to spend 8 hours a day hunched over exam scripts ...and enjoy your evenings without more of the same hanging over you the next day

Could be different now that it's moving online etc

Geuze

The 900 extra for LC in 2023 - is that just for "written" marking/grading, as distinct to doing it on a screen?

The "additional €6 for each script satisfactorily marked at Leaving Certificate" - is that the rate per script? Or is it some sort of extra payment?

Thanks.

Fees

In recent years there have been increases in the rates paid to written, oral and practical examiners and we have again received additional funding for these rates for 2023. 

Tied into our recruitment campaign relaunch (30 March 2023), we are also letting potential applicants know about a once off enhancement to the payment rates this year in the form of a 2023 Written Examiners Recruitment and Retention Incentive Payment.  This is additional €900 for Leaving Certificate and Leaving Certificate Applied written examiners and an additional €700 for Junior Cycle written examiners.

Payment Rate Summary for Written Examiners

In the case of the Leaving Certificate, with the addition of the 2023 incentive payment, examiners will typically earn between €7,721.00 and €10,844.00 depending on the subject marked.

In the case of the Junior Cycle, with the addition of the 2023 incentive payment, examiners will typically earn between €4,858.00 and €5,010.00 depending on the subject marked.

In summary examiners will earn:

• Marking conference fee of €235.28 (if applicable) 
• Administration fee of €235.28 
• The revised arrangements fee of €235.28 in the case of digital marking conference
• Subject specific script fees
• Higher script rates for additional marked scripts above the subject specific threshold.
• The above rates include 5.07% under the Building Momentum agreement
• An additional €6 for each script satisfactorily marked at Leaving Certificate
• An additional €3 for each script satisfactorily marked at Junior Cycle
• On a once off basis for 2023, the Recruitment and Retention Incentive Payment of €900 for Leaving Certificate examiners and €700 for Junior Cycle examiners.

Further details will be given to you when you are appointed.

Random sample

The €700/€900 is for everyone, whether online or not. You also still get the admin fee if you are online, with very little admin work compared to what used to be done

The €3/€6 bonus per script is on top of the script fee. It was introduced last year/ the year before (I can’t remember) as a bonus €150 per 25 scripts.

For me, the tedium of opening bags, numbering scripts, picking a sample etc was the worst part of the job. Now that it’s online, you just click a button and get your sample.

in my subject I can download 20 at a time, which is a days work. I haven’t found I’ve been working into evenings as much as I used to on paper. Also, each bundle is 20, regardless. In the old way, you could have a bundle of 15 or 30 depending on the centre size. I always felt I needed to do a full bag each day, which led to longer days.

Even at the 20 a day I beat the deadlines and can have a life at weekends.

am_zarathustra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120534692#Comment_120534692

Completely agree with this. The opening and numbering and post office visits (and pressure to make closing) were actually the worst part. One room in the house was taken over too, like a constant reminder.

Now I'd be the same, download 20 and off I go, I love that you can correct all the sections separately, really helps with keeping the scheme fresh. The calibration is so easy for the Advising examiners too so it's much smoother. I found there was times last year where I was ahead of myself and waiting for scripts to be released. And definitely was taking it easy or having a day off at the weekends.

dory

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120534413#Comment_120534413

I got 48% of what I earned last year. So 52% tax when you add in all the extras (PRSI etc etc).

Still came out with just short of €8k. I worked non-stop for 4 weeks, didn't take a day off. Will be a bit more chill this year.

For those asking about rates for JC. I emailed last year and they had no problem telling me exactly what my rate per script would be. It was a little closer to the exams though (but I presume they know now).

chases0102

Roughly, what would a teacher clear if doing a subject like JC History? Just trying to figure out if it is worth it, especially if Childcare needs to be accounted for in order to effectively do the job.

Random sample

It really depends on expenses. If you and your school are 100 km from athlone that’s an extra €167 for the overnight, tax free. Mileage makes a fair difference too.

I would expect at least €1800 for the 26 days work.

obviously it depends on kids ages, but I would have found a summer camp for 4 hours would leave mine wrecked afterwards, so I’d get a couple of hours done while they’d sit in front of the tv, so I’d get 6 hours during the day, and 2 hours done either early in the morning or late at night to fill out my day.

amacca

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120575054#Comment_120575054

Do you just mean expenses of 1800? That seems a lot lower than the total rates a couple of posts back up

Random sample

I haven’t marked JC since before the additional payments were added in. The €1800 is the minimum I would expect to be paid into my hand for JC.

chases0102

Thanks for the info above, very helpful.

My kids are 3 and 6 - not great ages I don't think and may mean it might not be possible (I am already doing the Superintending)

I know it's hard to say specifically, and you're probably erring on side of caution, but 1800 for 26 days work is about 70 Euro a day.

gaiscioch

€70 per day is not much, especially given that it is the best weather of the year. It also defeats the purpose many of us had when we chose secondary teaching - i.e. to inject work-life balance into our lives by using the holidays for something more personally rewarding than working for somebody else. If somebody is going to spend their holidays working, the finances of teaching as a career are very poor indeed - you would have been better choosing a more financially rewarding career if you're going to use all your teacher holidays for work.

That said, it is worth doing the examining at least once for your own career. You will stand out in an interview and if you're in a stable, secure job where you don't need it on your cv, word gets around that you're exam focused with marking experience and you will have a lot of people contacting you for grinds, etc. You will also find that your students really, really appreciate if you can give them insight into the marking and what they need to do to stand out in their LC exam. The entire dynamics of your classes change when you have that exam focus where the kids thoroughly enjoy competing against each other every week in class exams.

If you're a younger teacher who hasn't marked for the SEC yet, you're not being wise. It's exceedingly difficult to mark when you have young kids. Give yourself the edge now by marking. None of the younger teachers in my school mark exams, preferring to use the summer for enjoying themselves. In this context, be an examiner even once, and you have an edge over them. Also, let your principal know you are doing it because when classes are being allocated she/he will know you're giving a bit more to your professional development.