Issue Getting Payment From Ex Client

Panic Stations

I started working with a new client back in mid November. I typically work with my clients on a monthly retainer and have worked with them up until the end of March when they decided to end the contract and said they wanted to take the business in a different direction. No hard feelings and ended on good terms. Said they were happy with my work but just wasn't the right direction for them.

At the time I informed them that they had a number of outstanding invoices to clear as they have been slow for getting payment across to me. At the time I didn't think much of it as they are quite a reputable business in the heart of Dublin.

I worked with them for a total of 4.5 months and I actually gave them half a month for free just to get up and running and a gesture of good faith. So far they have paid me for 2 months but I still have yet to be paid for the remaining 2 months and for the last month of chasing up the invoices they've been telling me that they'll "sort it this week" and that "they will follow up with X about it". I've basically been calling, whatsapping and emailing them for the past month trying to get paid but no luck. They owe me just over 2k.

Today I got a message for one of them saying that they were surprised I invoiced them for those months and asked exactly what I was invoicing for and also why I was hounding them so much about these. I'm a bit in shock over that response and pretty annoyed that they are now questioning the work carried out after we ended everything on good terms.

I'm in touch with a solicitor at the moment who's first steps will be to send a demand letter which I'm hoping will just sort it out straight away as I get the sense that this client doesn't exactly like conflict.

Just wondering if anyone has gone through a similar process and what the outcome has been and if anyone has any advice on what to do going forward.

Just feeling pretty annoyed and cheated. I gave them 2 weeks for free, really went above and beyond for them and could really do with the money.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058245459/issue-getting-payment-from-ex-client

I think i would take the hit... its clear they wanted to work with you but for whatever reason it didn't work... i expect their understand was that because it wasn't working you were not being paid... Going legal for 2k might do long term damage...

Sorry...

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048087#Comment_119048087

Yeah they wanted to work. But the fact they've gone back on their word saying that they would pay is what's annoying me. I've seen other people recently leave reviews on their business stating the same problem with them.

What type of long term damage are you talking about?

Damien360

As it’s €2000, can you lodge a claim in the small claims court. Cost you sod all and worth a try.

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048190#Comment_119048190

I was thinking small claims but is small claims court only for customer vs business cases?

mickdw

Not for business to business you can't.

Gusser09

I know there are certain people you can ise thst would have no issue getting the money that is owed. They would usually take their fee from the person who owes the money too. So if you are owed 2k they will get 2.5k off him.

mickdw

It's 2k.

I'd keep billing them and sending solicitor letter but at the end of the day not worth going to court over.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048153#Comment_119048153

Dublin is a small town... going legal for 2k might get around... you said they were a reputable business so i am thinking they feel they paid and when they seen it was not working for them they moved on... i am curious as to nwhat kindof service you provide...

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048247#Comment_119048247

Yeah, tbh I've seen other people leave reviews about this business not paying their bills and recently I saw another review about a payment dispute from them online which was recently taken down once the words "legal action" were mentioned in it.

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048237#Comment_119048237

Are these people operation within the confines of a law? lol

enricoh

Sod that, I'd be calling in any time I'm nearby and asking for my money. A lot of these won't pay crowds sting a lot of people because 4 out of 5 people walk away.

I done work before for a local hotel n they we're dodging my calls, emails etc- I called in a couple of times n eventually they paid. They even had the neck at the time to ask me to price up another job! Get your money, f&#k them n getting no more business off them. Who needs jobs like that.

Damien360

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048283#Comment_119048283

But if you are genuinely owed for non payment of a legitimate bill, where is the defamation ? A solicitors threat has no bite if you have all the proof to defend it.

squigglestrebor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048087#Comment_119048087

Would ya cop on. Take hit the hit hahahah

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048296#Comment_119048296

They signed a contract with me. I have proof of work carried out. Proof of results and improvements within the business. Also have many different emails, messages and call logs of correspondence between us.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048285#Comment_119048285

All they will do is go around and have a chat.

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048287#Comment_119048287

I always try do business with people how I'd like people to do business with me. Deliver on time and pay on time too.

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048314#Comment_119048314

They'll need more than a chat

Damien360

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048313#Comment_119048313

€2000 is not worth getting a solicitor and they know that. Has that business a decent online profile ? Post away on major platforms and when you get the threat from their solicitor, post up the proof and demand the site keeps your post live.

Had a smaller thing here on boards many years ago to illustrate my point with a very large Irish window supplier and I posted about it here in response to another poster. Boards got a solicitor letter, PM’d me that it had to be taken down and I could be subject to legal issues along with them. I PM’d my proof to boards and the post was re-instated. Boards is tiny but you get the idea.

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048365#Comment_119048365

I could easily name and shame them on a number of small sub communities here but I'd rather my money back for the work I've done.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048331#Comment_119048331

"Chat"

macvin

Give them what they are asking for - a detailed description of what the invoice is for.

If it goes legal you would need the same details.

And yes you can use the small claims court as it's under €2000.

They do deal with small business to business claims.

https://www.courts.ie/small-claims-procedure

xeresod

Don't forget that interest is ticking up each day they delay...see Late Payment in Commercial Transactions - DETE (enterprise.gov.ie) for full details but it's 0.022% per day (8% per annum) plus compensation of €70

Or just sell the debt to a collections agency - you'll lose 25-50% depending on the agency but you'll be finished with it and still have 1k-1.5k which is better than the 0 you have now!

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048573#Comment_119048573

A debt collection agency might be a good shout. Any recommendations?

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119048444#Comment_119048444

I should have probably have mentioned that the debt is slightly over 2k. Probably closer to 2.5k. (Over 3k Incl VAT)

kirving

How big is the company? Are the people you work with the same people who make the payment?

Not to excuse it, but as an example, the company I work for have a dedicated purchasing department, and a separate accounts department dealing with accepting/approving the invoices, who in turn outsource the actual payment processing to a shared financial services centre for the company in Europe.

At various stages I get notifications to accept the goods as received on System A, but then have to approve payments on System B. Messy, but there you go.

If I leave or move role, am on holiday, or if an invoice doesn't match a PO down to the cent, the whole process falls apart, and that months payment run might be missed. Payment terms of End of Month + 90 days would be common payment terms for us I believe - very tough on small suppliers.

Again, I'm not excusing it, but are you confident that it's out of badness, or a series of errors and other factors like people moving or being out sick?

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119049314#Comment_119049314

They're a small family business and I've direct contact with the two owners. There's no excuse as to delays in the payment.

I've gotten the odd text from them saying "x is on holidays" or "x is out of the office" but this has been going on for weeks.

kirving

Okay, that's not on so. Zero explanation for it.

Tow

Businesses can take other business to the Small Claims Court since 2010.

A relation had issues getting paid by a very well know business man, years ago. He arrived into their office in the morning looking to see him, and was told he was not there. So he sat in reception all day, chatting to everyone who came in/out and telling them why he was there. That evening the owner came down, threw him a cheque for the monies owed and told him to f*** *** out of his office.

Seth Brundle

In terms of the SCC:

Type of claims dealt with

a claim for goods or services bought for private use from someone selling them in the course of a business (consumer claims)

a claim for goods or services bought for business use from someone selling them in the course of a business (business claims)

a claim for minor damage to property (but excluding personal injuries)

a claim for the non-return of a rent deposit for certain kinds of rented properties. For example, a holiday home or a room / flat in a premises where the owner also lives

The claim cannot exceed €2,000. The current fee to make a claim is €25.

https://www.courts.ie/small-claims-procedure

That evening the owner came down, threw him a cheque for the monies owed and told him to f*** *** out of his office.

Did the cheque clear?

Tow

Yes...

Panic Stations

So update.

Yesterday after, emailing, calling and whatsapping I got a message back from the owner.

Not going to quote exactly what was said but he basically started off saying that he was surprised I had invoiced him for the remaining 2 months of work (I'm perplexed as to why this would surprise him when he never complained about the work I was doing and did he expect me to work for free?) and also began to have a go at me about how much calls, messages and emails he has received off me chasing an invoice and never received that many when I was working for him. (He never really heard from me because his wife told me not to contact him regarding anything about our work and that she was to be my point of contact). He then proceeded to question what exactly I was invoicing for and I sent him on a list of all the work I carried out. He didn't reply back.

Sent him a polite message this morning asking if we could arrange a phone call, saying I'd be more than happy to address any questions or concerns he had about the work carried out and that I would like to see if we could arrange something.

No word back.

CinammonGirl

As a sole trader, I would be furious about this. Similar situation a few years ago, smaller amount (500 euro) and client in different country, everything was online.

Just kept hounding him with emails. Got my accountant to draft an email to me (free of charge!), saying Dear CG, payment has not been received for this invoice, we will instigate legal proceeding if not received by xyz. Sent client on this mail.

I know you don't want to out him on online forums etc., but the threat of this might be enough. And do it then if he still refuses.

Agree also with posters who say go and sit in the office.

Defo don't let it go. Client has a total cheek IMO. Good luck!

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119051850#Comment_119051850

Yeah, I was particularly annoyed about that reply and would be willing to settle something but it just came as a complete surprise as now he's playing dumb about it. I could go a sit outside his shop in Dublin City Centre and just tell every customer walking in not to do business with them. They're the type of business where customer trust would be everything.

Furze99

Were you supplying actual goods of some sort - tangible things. Or is some sort of consultancy/ marketing with advice as the service. You can see where the latter is more open to dispute. But regardless, gather up evidence of work/ requests for work/ agreements and just keep badgering for a while, politely. If you do go to a solicitor and they take it further, you're eventually going to have to document all, so do it now and see what happens for a while.

Take it to twitter.

If they're that reputable then the damage a couple of tweets outlining the situation will do more harm than 2k.

No way I'd be leaving it or taking the hit.

"@dodgybusiness, seems there's an issue with your a/cs department as I've been emailing and writing to you with no reply......here's a copy of the invoice you still owe and the list of my work. I'd appreciate if you could sort this out before penalty interest starts to accrue".

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119052106#Comment_119052106

It was for digital marketing. I've records of all work carried out, emails and call logs from all communication. Nearly over 100 social media templates created too so there's more than enough evidence there.

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119052132#Comment_119052132

They don't appear to be on twitter now. Their current website is also down at the moment I believe from a credit card failure. (I still have access to all their accounts) There also still wasting money on Google ads by driving traffic to a broken website but that's no of my business.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119052188#Comment_119052188

I would advise against accessing any of their sites or accounts.

macvin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119052188#Comment_119052188

That would suggest that they are experiencing their own difficulty. They may not want to admit it and prefer to go on the attack.

I would suggest you make an offer of a discount if paid in the next few day - I'd suggest along the lines of €2k incl vat and you may get that quicker than chasing the full amount.

Start at €2500 inc vat, he may suggest 1500, then drop to 2250and hopefully you "meet in the middle" and get 2k

Panic Stations

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119052219#Comment_119052219

I'm not accessing them. I asked them to remove me from all of them. I still get these emails