Social Welfare CE Scheme/TUS Phone Interview

Straight Talker

Hi i have a phone interview in relation to this on Wednesday morning. Does anyone have any experience of how this works? Will they offer me a position there and then, or is this a case of just going through my options?

endofrainbow

How could they possibly offer you a position without knowing your skills and experience etc?

It's basically a fact finding issue to investigate your options with regard to training, up-skilling and employment options.

Straight Talker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101415#Comment_119101415

Oh right it's more of a general activation meeting then, jobpath ce/tus are listed as the reasons for this meeting. Are people referred back to Seetec/Turas Nua within a month after finishing with them?

Dempo1

I believe, but open to correction Jobspath is ending with no new referrals, this said existing or previous clients are still engaged, it would be very doubtful a re referral would happen within a month of a jobspath engagement ending , normally a few months in between if a person hasn't found employment.

The new Pathways to work appears to be the new approach.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101583#Comment_119101583

much info on this new approach, since jobs path was rather disturbing?

FriendlySpider

They must be bringing loads of people in on this as I also have a call/interview with them on Wednesday morning. Dreading being forced into a position, it's humiliating to me.

Straight Talker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101712#Comment_119101712

My time on jobpath wasn't that bad. I'm well aware though that others haven't been so lucky.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101712#Comment_119101712

Indeed , I tend to agree , I had a bizzare and extraordinary experience with Turas Nua many years ago , despite actually in work, it was a time even those on reduced hours were referred , led to official complaint, solicitors and grovelling apologies.

I'm all for activation measures, supports etc but bulling and harassment, absolutely not .

Straight Talker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101718#Comment_119101718

Same with me Wednesday morning am was down on the letter.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101718#Comment_119101718

humiliation is ultimately one of the approaches of these schemes, we have successive governments that dont want to truly deal with and accept the root causes of long term unemployment

FriendlySpider

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101583#Comment_119101583

The last time I was on Jobpath/ Turas Nua the person I was dealing with told me there had been a behind closed doors deal for basically Jobpath 2, with another 2 or 4 year (can't remember) contract signed but they had to wait until covid supports like PUP were finished to unveil it.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101749#Comment_119101749

...wouldnt surprise me in the least, hence previous questioning, its very disturbing

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101749#Comment_119101749

Not sure , it's been extended a few times but I believe it's done with for new referrals, absolutely catastrophic mess and at enormous cost , over €230 million I believe.

FriendlySpider

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101734#Comment_119101734

Yes same just AM wrote on it, sure in their eyes I have nothing better to be doing then waiting for a call. I don't think I can refuse an offer so really feel anxious about the whole thing. Been so stressed since the email on Friday I've hardly slept.

FriendlySpider

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101758#Comment_119101758

Its such a waste of money and I've heard some awful stories. Imagine being put on it 3 times, just makes you feel low.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101777#Comment_119101777

I agree , honestly I wouldn't have believed some of the stories had I not experienced them directly myself, absolutely scandalous what went on.

There's obviously many reasons why some struggle to get employment or even retain it , of course there's a small amount who've no intention of working.

I feel with rising costs, inflation etc unemployment is going to Rise .

Straight Talker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101764#Comment_119101764

With covid still around, i would only be willing to take up a position where i have as little contact with people as possible. Office work preferably, but if i have to pick up rubbish then so be it. I did a ce scheme before where i worked in a charity shop, but there's no way i'd be willing to do a job like that now, where i'd be coming into contact with customers all day.

They reduce your payment by 44 euros as a first punishment, and if they deem you to have committed another infraction, whilst on that penalty rate then they'll cut off your payment for 9 weeks. So they won't cut your money off straight away. I'm sure that they won't attempt to force people into a position that isn't suitable for them.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101817#Comment_119101817

you ll probably find most positions are probably unsuitable for most candidates, this is a major failing of such schemes

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101831#Comment_119101831

Excellent point 😏

TooTired123

If you want to know why there’s a push to get people out of Jobseekers and into work you need look no further then this.

“79% of businesses struggling to fill vacancies”

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2022/0518/1299820-79-of-businesses-struggling-to-fill-vacancies/

Hospitality chiefs in particular are putting severe pressure on the Gov to find staff for the season which is a huge part of the economy. There’s still 150000 on the live register.

If anyone thinks that they’re on Jobseekers and they should be on another payment instead then they should message me.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119103787#Comment_119103787

this is an element of such pushes, but not the whole story, low unemployment is always a critical element of governments, but governments have little or no interest in addressing the underlining issues causing the unemployment in the first place, as this would mean admitting major failings at governmental levels, there is also wide scale miss understanding of these causes, and an element of ignorance

FriendlySpider

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119103787#Comment_119103787

Since covid people that were in the hospitality sector before have had a chance to upskill or change careers. With it being the first to be closed during lockdowns people couldn't rely on it unfortunately. Not to mind it's often minimum wage which with the price of rent/fuel/bills ect just doesn't add up.

Personally I feel I should be on carers but haven't applied as all I've been told about is how hard it is to get and applications are rejected.

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119109233#Comment_119109233

If you are caring for someone for at least 5 hours of your day, every day. And that person needs full time care and attention. And that person needs help with everyday things like washing and dressing. And you are accompanying that person most of the time when they go out, then you will get carers as long as you pass the means test, and the carees GP completes the medical.

jkmanc1974

Looks like Turas Nua will be around for a good while yet - big recruitment drive in Munster at the minute

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119185090#Comment_119185090

They've been appointed to take over Local employment schemes/ Jobs club etc, I believe, government have stopped funding these schemes, staff made redundant and its part of this new pathways to work scheme.

Jobspath is not being extended, so onto the next scheme that will inevitably costs €100"s of millions 🙄

cezanne

seetec the originasl parent had a 2% success rate in the UK after millions were spent. They were for prisoners to get back into employment so those of you who are getting letters are just above criminals !! waste of money to be honest.

cezanne

I wonder are the travelling community getting the same letters & emails for a jobspath interview and assessment? Probably not as it would be considered marginalizing them & harassment, yet 80% of them are on welfare of some sort. No they are only going to hassle those who might feel humiliated which are the normies who lost their jobs due to Covid etc.

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119278085#Comment_119278085

Not a lot of Travellers are getting Jobseekers payments. Most get Disability/Carers and those payments aren’t subject to JobPath.

Steve30x

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119101583#Comment_119101583

This is incorrect. I know a few people who was with Turas Nua and a week after they finished with them they got called back for a second 12 months.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119299539#Comment_119299539

It's not , your quoting a post I made back in May. Jobspath has ceased for new referrals , existing clients can be re referred for up to 12 months but even that has probably ended by now.

So to repeat, Jobspath has ended , no new referrals and Pathways to work as commenced.

Steve30x

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119299567#Comment_119299567

No what I'm refering to is from two years ago when I was let go in a job in retail. I knew a few people who were immediately called back to Turas nua.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119299586#Comment_119299586

Apologies, yes thar was correct but NO new referrals since at least late last year , some existing or previous clients were recalled and are still engaged , all new referrals are to Pathways to work , which to be honest looks almost identical.

Steve30x

I was called to do an interview for a CE scheme this morning. I got the usual threatening letter that if I didn't send back the letter applying for a CE scheme that my payment may be affected. I have a whole lot of proof that I've shown to the social welfare and Turas nua that I am applying for employment. Theres hundreds of jobs applications from the employers that bothered to respond to my job applications.

They tried forcing a call center job on me multiple times

Steve30x

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119299596#Comment_119299596

From what I see the Turas Nua office no longerexists in this town. I haven't seen any life up there with about two months.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119299604#Comment_119299604

I believe all their offices cleared out as well as Seetec for over a year , basically they've had people bizzarely working from home and calling people, both companies Ironically let's lots of people go, I've not heard of a face to face meeting in almost two year's.

One of them tendered for the pathways to work contract I believe.

Steve30x

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119299632#Comment_119299632

There was still life in the Turas Nua Offices here in this town up to march. But its been lifeless up there with about two months now. I even saw the girl that was in charge of me two years ago this morning just walking through the town. In fact when I was with them they made me apply for a call center job in EishTech in Waterford city and when that interview didn't work out a few days later they had me log into their computer in their office to search for jobs. They had a keylogger on their computer and used my details to apply for a job in Eishtech a few days later again.

When I received the confirmation email of a second application I confronted the girl about it and she said she didn't apply for the job. When I went to the second interview I asked the interviewer who applied for the job a second time she said Turas Nua applied on my behalf. She also told me that they usually wait six months to reinterview a person and it was unusual for me to be back within a month. I didn't get the job though

cezanne

Seetec look for your consent to ring a new employer as well once they smarmy up to you in the initial phone call i listened in on a call recently as my buddy got the letter,. This consent is so they can get a commission on your being placed even though they had nothing to do with it. So if you are lucky & get a job by attending an interview you got by yourself they want commission if they have had one or 2 inane conversations with you . All bullshit. Sign nothing with these as they are no better than an NGO just milking the tax payer with in the guise of placing the un employed in work. Ring the ukranians they are more of a burden than a few folk who lost their jobs because of the Covid scam.

davesangel

I just listened in to my friend having one of these phone interviews (they wanted me there as a witness) so here is what happened:

First off, personal details are taken. My friend was asked to come up with an ideal job,and a second job that they wouldn't mind doing. They were asked things like if they drive or have access to public transport, if they require additional assistance and (which I found truly bizarre) an emergency contact number for when they go in for their face-to-face appointment in a few weeks.

They were then asked in about 3 separate ways why they haven't found work yet, what is stopping them etc. They also were sent a text with links to forms which they had to sign right then and there whilst the interviewer was on the phone. They also have to attend an online presentation later this week plus they have to email in a copy of their CV in advance of the face-to-face interview (which may be by phone but that is still to be confirmed).

Steve30x

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322924#Comment_119322924

I have a friend who got a job in Dealz without Turas Nua's help. They don't ask consent to call the employer. They called Dealz so often that he almost lost his job. He called them numerous times to tell them to stop calling Dealz

davesangel

Quick question for yourself and anyone else who knows a lot more about Seetec than me: they are asking people to send them their CVs. Are they able to/do they send these out to companies on behalf of the clients without the clients' knowledge?

Also, my friend was told that they would be encouraged to accept jobs at a pay rate of the same that they currently receive in benefits...which means that after tax and travel costs etc, they would be earning LESS than they do right now and absolutely could not afford to pay their rent let alone put food on the table etc.

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119339570#Comment_119339570

If that person is single and on Jobseekers then they’re getting €208 per week. That works out at €5.30 per hour for a 39 hour week.

Any job recommended by Seetec will be at least minimum wage which at the moment is €10.50 per hour.

davesangel

Thanks - I was basing this on how much they get for their rent allowance plus the jobseekers allowance, and the amount they Seetec want them to accept per week from a job would be less than that post tax

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119340802#Comment_119340802

Seetac are not in slightest bit concerned about any additional allowances a Jobseekers gets, there only focus is getting a person ON jobseekers off that payment, they get administrative costs covered in their contract but the real prize is getting a person off a Jobseekers payment in order to get substantial fees. They'll also not be discouraged from claiming these fees even if a reffered client obtains a job themselves. They don't like being twarted by CE schemes, Training or further education as they get no fee income from that.

davesangel

Thanks for this. I read some previous posts on this from yourself and others, especially almost causing people to lose jobs they got on their own by hassling the employer for fees, it sounds horrific.

What if someone is pursuing training/further education for the purpose of getting a new job (which will guarantee a job further down the line), can they force a person off that? And if someone doesn't find a job within a year due to just no availability in areas that they're qualified in (ie, it's not for lack of trying), are their benefits penalised?

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119341217#Comment_119341217

No, they can not force anyone off an already approved scheme of training or further education. The crux of the mistake people make when referred to these companies is signing contracts and personal progression plans, there is no legal obligation to do so. Data protection obligations where initially disregarded and ignored meaning a person's information could be freely distributed (Resumes) , that has now tightened up but by signing a contract a jobseeker essentially waves permissions.

It's crucial however Jobseekers engage, document any and all communications.

davesangel

They made my friend sign a plan whilst on the phone and said they would stay on the line til it was signed, now she has to send through a CV - I'm astounded they made her believe this was all a legal requirement and wonder if there's any way around it.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119341334#Comment_119341334

Once signed, very difficult to reverse to be honest unless cohersion can be proven. My advice has been to advise people unsure to bluntly say they ate not prepared to sign a document they don't understand or agree with and unless a written explanation is supplied showing there's an obligation, there'll be no signature. Normally its never raised again.

The only thing a jobseeker is obligated to do is engage, carry out tasks and document everything.

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119340802#Comment_119340802

Is the person on rent allowance or HAP. I hope they are on HAP and if not you should recommend that they apply right away to be included on their local authorities housing list and subsequently for HAP. It’s very important to be on the housing list. We will eventually have to build homes for people and everyone who needs a home should make sure they’re on the list.

If they get a job either by their own efforts or through Seetec then they will lose Rent Allowance but if they’re on HAP that’s not the case.

If the job is minimum wage then what with tax credits and cut off point then your friend is unlikely to pay any more then a couple of euros tax.

No one is ever better off on benefits then working full time.

trickymicky

It does need to be Full time employment for them claim a payment. Speaking as a former employee for one them. Won't say which as they have a defamation clause in their contract, both of them do. They need to get someone to get 13 weeks of consecutive employment to get first payment and every 13 after that. They also get paid for people referred and sign their PPP (personal progression plan)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119341266#Comment_119341266

It does need to be Full time employment for them claim a payment. Speaking as a former employee for one them. Won't say which as they have a defamation clause in their contract, both of them do. They need to get someone to get 13 weeks of consecutive employment to get first payment and every 13 after that. They also get paid for people referred and sign their PPP (personal progression plan)

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119400783#Comment_119400783

The trick (and its not really a trick, so to speak) is not to sign the PPP, there is absolutely no lrgal obligation to do so as I discovered after issuing legal proceedings after an extraordinary set of circumstances, I must reiterate this was a number of years ago and under the Jobspath scheme, not TUS, Jobspath has ceased. CE is entirely separate and Turas Nua and Seetac had little to do with this, albeit that didn't stop them trying to get people off them.

Re the 13 weeks, I agree to a certain extent, but infact in my case I was in employment but hours reduced, this was at a time anyone was being referred, I experienced almost 12 months of harrasment, Data protection breaches, harrasment of an employer I'd been with 5 years and then the final straw, trying to take credit for getting a job I already had, it was beggar's belief.

Just let's say the company involved regretted the day I was reffered and so to did the DSP and despite a quite settlement, the disgraceful Jobspath continued albeit my case tightened up rules and governance but many people faced appalling behaviour. I don't blame staff, I blame two horrendous private recruitment firms who operate on the basis of profit only and cared not a Jot about jobseekers genuinely looking for employment.

One of the most scandalous and costly schemes ever concocted by any Irish Government.