Texas School shooting 19 children and 2 adults murdered

Overheal

Wait is this the post being complained about?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119109741#Comment_119109741

I don't see the issue at all. It's a comment disassociated from the school shooting.

of which digs were made at

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119109778#Comment_119109778

...say wait a sec:

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114500#Comment_119114500

 My issue was the news was still breaking and it seemed like some were just interested in getting their digs in.

Pot, Kettle? Moving on? Tip me over, pour me out, and let's move on yeah.

captbarnacles

This Cheief Justice seemed to get it:

"Here’s the Milwaukee Independent looking at how Chief Justice Warren Burger discussed the Second Amendment.

The Gun Lobby’s interpretation of the Second Amendment is one of the greatest pieces of fraud, I repeat the word fraud, on the American People by special interest groups that I have ever seen in my lifetime. The real purpose of the Second Amendment was to ensure that state armies – the militia – would be maintained for the defense of the state. The very language of the Second Amendment refutes any argument that it was intended to guarantee every citizen an unfettered right to any kind of weapon he or she desires."

AudreyHepburn

Sickening. What is it going to take for the powers that be in the US to admit they have a serious problem and to do something about.

The right to bear arms does not and should not supersede the right of children to feel safe and to be able to go to school without fear.

Personally I think that there are two things that need to change immediately.

First of all no ordinary civilian has any need for military grade weapons and they should be not be accessible to the general public. You don’t need AR17s to defend yourself.

Secondly having a weapon should not be an automatic right. It must be rigidly controlled and there should a strict criteria that needs to met before you aquire a weapon, like there is here.

Here for instance you have to have a legitimate reason for having the gun such as hunting or dealing with vermin. Self protection is not acceptable as a reason.

Age restrictions and being of sound mind should be top of the list.

Harsh maybe but children are being murdered on a frighteningly regular basis. Half measures won’t work.

Overheal

That's good optics.

https://twitter.com/victorjacobo_/status/1529512043279265794?s=20&t=ZRIa06g61pm0vSxiY-mmpA

BruteStock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114480#Comment_119114480

Where does the individual come into this? Every factor associated with he tragedy but the individual is blamed. Guns caused this? What caused the sicko to use the guns? As already stated , its not a basic black n white situation. There's other factors at play.

Recently an Irish man got 15 years for a drink driving incident that hurt 4 kids in the US. Look at the thread on here. Nobody , not a single person attributed that incident to drink driving. Instead the individual was (rightfully) dragged across the coals. But nobody is dragging this Ramos guy across the coals. Why is that? Because people on both side (mostly the left) are only too happy to politicize the the incident

Quin_Dub

So - Fox News , in the immediate aftermath of the shooting instead of allowing any of their (few) actual Journalists cover the breaking story decide to have Jesse Waters and Jeanine Pirro provide the coverage.

As you can imagine it was a sh!tshow.

When no one really knew much about anything , "Judge" Jeanine was trying to suggest that the shooter was an illegal immigrant being chased by Border Patrol , thankfully the guest/expert they had on shot down that Fox News wet dream of an angle.

She then went on

Judge Jeanine later criticized people who are frightened of people with guns. “People today, many of them, are intimidated, they are triggered if there is someone with a gun,” she said in addressing the idea of armed guards at schools. “They are frightened. That’s this new narrative. When you see a gun you should be frightened instead of appreciating what they are doing for you.”

Judge Jeanine wasn’t the only Fox News personality to bash the idea that kids may be “triggered” by the presence of guns in schools. “Quite frankly, who cares how the kids feel?” one host asked.

Then they blamed the Parents for not carrying out tactical reviews of the schools before they send their kids there. Or that instead of spending money on stupid stuff like toys they should be pooling their money with other parents to do threat assessments and to buy bulletproof blankets for the schools

One of her guests, the father of one of the victims at Parkland High School, said it’s the parents’ “responsibility where you send your children to school,” and that parents should be scouting schools to determine if they can be easily accessed by a shooter.

One guest even suggested parents should be more responsible about what they’re buying their children. The guest said that instead of buying “toys and games” for children, parents should be spending their money on paying companies to do threat assessments of schools and buying “colorful and beautiful” “ballistic blankets” to hang up on the wall.

Then they decided it was the kids fault...

Jesse Watters and a guest started batting around the fact that the shooter reached out to a girl on Instagram ahead of the shooting. She and other kids and family members should have said something, they argued.

“We have to do a better job. If you see something, say something,” said Chad Ayers, VP of the Proactive Response Group. “I honestly think that in this day in age, kids are afraid of being the school snitch. That’s got to go out the window.”

Then they all started musing about what might be the problem

“We, as a society, have a problem,” said Bret Baier. “Wherever you want to put the blame. We, as a society, have a problem, and that is clear.”

“Something’s going on out there,” Laura Ingraham added. “There’s something happening to our national psyche or to families or to mental illness. I don’t know what it is, but there’s something very corrosive happening in our culture.”

(oh, oh..! know what it is Laura , I know what it is!!! - It's f*cking ghouls like you!!!)

So for Fox News , the problem is the kids , the parents , the schools , public health and anything else they could think of.

But not Guns.. Guns aren't the problem, No siree.

In fact , according to Texas AG Ken Paxton , the problem is not enough guns. Oh and , Kids getting murdered in schools is just a thing everyone is going to have to get used to as well apparently

“I’d much rather have law abiding citizens armed and trained so that they can respond when something like this happens, because it’s not going to be the last time,” Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton said on Newsmax, acknowledging the slaughter of children at schools is now an intractable part of life in America.

“We can potentially arm and train and prepare teachers and other administrators to respond quickly, because the reality is we don’t have the resources to have law enforcement at every school,” Paxton added on Fox News.

As I said before - Horrible , Horrible People

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114695#Comment_119114695

Is the Irish guy dead?

Manic Moran

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114674#Comment_119114674

He is correct, but also misses the larger picture as the entire 2A has been overtaken by time. At the time it was written, indeed, it was to ensure that the federal government could not prevent the states from raising a militia for protection, the country had been dealing with the Shay's Rebellion and Whiskey Rebellion and as far as it went, it had nothing to do with individual rights. However, the militias in question were formed by gathering together the people who already had the weapons in their personal ownership.

The larger picture he didn't point out in that quote is that at the time, the federal government could not pass any gun control laws (or drink control laws, or censorship laws, or whatever) even if it wanted to and if the Bill of Rights never existed. The concept of "incorporation" didn't come about until after the Civil War. The Commerce Clause interpretation came around in the 20th century. The actual constitutional protections of firearms were the ones which existed in State constitutions, as those were the only bodies which could pass laws which affected individuals. Thus the effective meaning of 2A has expanded over time to encompass the individual in federal law much as federal jurisdiction as a whole has similarly expanded into what was previously the sole purview of the States.

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114411#Comment_119114411

I haven't.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114737#Comment_119114737

That particular Irish Guy is scum.

He was on the run in the US from Ireland for doing the same thing here (in Donegal) a few years previously.

But the analogy is of course nonsense anyway.

Ramos is obviously deranged but as someone pointed out earlier if he was anywhere else on earth we'd be reading today about how a guy had stabbed his grandmother and had then been apprehended by the police a while later while trying to escape.

The critical differentiator between this guy (and all those before him) and people of a similar disposition in the rest of the world is the ease with which he could load up with weapons..

That's the bit that needs discussing , not whether he was hugged as a child...

Overheal

Beto vs. the Free Speech people

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114766#Comment_119114766

Jesus Christ...." He looks a bit Trans"?????

How hard are you looking to find some "leftist woke" ideological connection here to deflect attention??

Shameless..

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114789#Comment_119114789

At least he's doing more verification than Rep. Paul Gossar.

https://www.businessinsider.com/texas-shooting-uvalde-paul-gosar-touts-false-claim-transgender-woman-2022-5

Remember some of your teachers from your schooldays. Would you trust them with a gun? In a gunfight? How easy would it be for a 17 year old make to take the gun off them? It’s a ridiculous idea which would lead to more school shootings.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114804#Comment_119114804

Yeah a 66 year old school teacher vs. a psyched up mass murder aaaaaaaaand go

tanko

The weasel words from from Biden would turn your stomach, he couldn’t care less.

Overheal

He indeed legally in the state of Texas, bought rifles and ammunition within 24 hours of his 18th birthday. There was no wait time on buying the rifles.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/05/25/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-gunman/

nothing we could have predicted to prevent this from happening said the Governor....

Valdez said Ramos drove around with another friend at night sometimes and shot at random people with a BB gun. He also egged people’s cars, Valdez said.

Just a month or two ago, Garcia said, he called Ramos to check in on him.

But Ramos said he was going hunting with his uncle and didn’t have time to talk. He hung up. Garcia later saw the photos of large guns that Ramos had posted online and wondered whether that was what they were for — going hunting, or to the shooting range with his uncle.

On Tuesday, Garcia was in algebra class in San Antonio when he started receiving a slew of texts with the news of what had happened in Uvalde. He didn’t believe it at first. He opened his phone’s browser and Googled the shooting and saw Ramos’s name.

“I couldn’t even think, I couldn’t even talk to anyone. I just walked out of class, really upset, you know, bawling my eyes out,” Garcia said. “Because I never expected him to hurt people.

“I think he needed mental help. And more closure with his family. And love.”

This is so obvious. If you want a solution it has to have multiple strands. Mental health checks. Age restrictions. Gun safes. Different access levels to different firearms. Limited ammunition purchases.

I’d also suggest that as US schools go to lockdown in the event of attack some sort of firearms response on site is needed. Teachers are generally incapable but perhaps a picked group could be trained as a stopper group and an armed and properly kevlarred team of four always on duty in a secure area to evade initial assault on them. Remote weapons sweeping corridors could be useful in larger US school settings (2000 pupils up) as any movement on corridors after lockdown is hostile.

It needs military input and if the US has one expertise it is in gunfighting. In short, solutions will not fit into identity politics.

Brucie Bonus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114695#Comment_119114695

I would suggest because its so common.

Manic Moran

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114804#Comment_119114804

Why?

Teachers have been armed in several states for years, I am not aware of any school shootings caused by an armed teacher, or someone who relieved an armed teacher of his firearm (why would they advertise that they had one in the first place?). I am aware of at least one school shooting which was stopped by an armed teacher (Pearl High School, granted, he had to go to the parking lot to get his pistol), and one where armed students stopped a shooter (Appalachian school of law).

Teachers are the same people you meet on the street, and the people you met on the US streets on your school days were not the people you met in Ireland. Not too many Irish teachers got drafted for the Vietnam War, for example.

There is nothing particularly odd or unique about teachers except of course that we entrust them with our children. Just like anyone else in the US, some can shoot, some can't. My reservist platoon sergeant in Iraq was a high school teacher in his civilian job, I'd absolutely (and have) trust him in a gunfight. Over 23000 teachers are products of the "troops to teachers" civilian skills training program since the mid 1990s. I don't know anyone who says that teachers must be armed, that would be a stupid idea. But at least give them the choice, if they're allowed to be and choose to be armed off school grounds, they are not more dangerous on them.

And at least a partial chance against a spree shooter is better than no chance at all.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114882#Comment_119114882

which stomach-turning words?

Brucie Bonus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114756#Comment_119114756

No need to get sensitive I literally said I wasn't attacking you rather the idea the gun lobby wants a mourning period.

Gusser09

Im sure Biden and Obama do care

Hell i bet even Trump is sickened.

However its the republican senators that are complicit in the murder of young children.

ceadaoin.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114913#Comment_119114913

My local school district has its own police department. Not sure if that's a thing in every state or county though. For obvious reasons, they focus more on high schools with each school having at least one officer assigned there.

As a parent of a 4th grader, I've been thinking about this all day. Dropped her off at school today with a lump in my throat. Awful, just beyond words to think what those parents and community is going through.

Guns and easy access to them is a problem. so is the fact that so many young people, who are little more than children themselves, are so angry and disaffected that they would commit an act like this. Absolute sick fuckers and a reflection of a sick society. Not sure how we even begin to tackle that though.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119114967#Comment_119114967

If he is, then I'm sure he, Cruz and Abbott as well as a few other republicans won't be attending their speaking engagements at the NRA annual meeting on Friday where they will have 14 acres of the latest guns and tech for sale.

Some teachers might have the capacity but carrying weapons into a classroom and they would be seen is a problem in the making. Select and train and arm and armour prperly and keep secure: yes. Mass arming? Madness.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119115034#Comment_119115034

Well it's not as though you need any special training, licenses or permits in Texas to carry a firearm....

The solution is obvious. Multi stranded and team not one, team of trained onsite responders. Smaller schools may have an issue but retired police and military and grandparents could be used.

Solutions are just that. Only possible if you abandon ideology and remove limiting bureaucracy. The solutions are there.

ceadaoin.

I've just read that this school did have an armed officer who saw the shooter but didn't "engage" with him and instead let him enter the school. I mean, it seems like the theory of more guns to protect kids would work but the person has to actually be capable or willing to use them to be of any help

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119115040#Comment_119115040

Solutions mean abandoning failed ground.