OFFICIAL Buildup Thread - Leinster vs Stade Rochelais Champions Cup Final 28/05/2022

Anyone know how much Leinster's failure to win yesterday will cost the IRFU? Because, petty provincial point scoring apart, that's what should concern supporters of all of the provinces. Less moolah for the IRFU means less moolah for the provinces.

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119131997#Comment_119131997

The French fans hate Barnes with a passion and booed every decision he made. They booed him before the game and when he got his medal. I think no matter what they thought he was riding LAR yesterday.

I don’t know why people are complaining about Barnes. He interpreted the breakdown a certain way and was consistent through out.

Leinsters problems were if their own making. Though I don’t know why people are highlighting the scrum and particularly Porter. Was the penalty count not two against 1 for and a free kick for while he was on?

redmca2

It is very frustrating that there is 80 seconds left on the clock when LR scored the winning try and all that was used up in delaying the conversion.

This isn't unique just to yesterday's match.

I would support that the clock be stopped during the taking of ALL conversions.

Ah lads, If someone has a chip on their shoulder ignore them, their impotent rage will have them on the wrong side of the mods soon enough and really - it's not worth your time.

Leinster will bounce back, the petty eejits on here will always be saddo's.

Back to the match. I thought Gibson Park was terrific yesterday, but that performance from Sexton makes me begin to doubt his capacity to deliver in a world cup in over a years time. Doris needs to spend his free time working on his handling as it's not improving.

Most importantly - I think Leinster and Ireland need to look at scrum coaching as it's becoming a real weakness.

A performance to forget but a season where a lot of new talent has gotten European rugby exposure. Focus on the positives, move onto the next thing.

Poorside

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132181#Comment_119132181

You have 90 seconds from try to convert it, 60 seconds for a penalty, been that way for a few years now.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119130476#Comment_119130476

You said the other 3 provinces were 'shitbox teams'....

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119131781#Comment_119131781

They must have learned that from watching Leinster play

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132040#Comment_119132040

That's all going to leinster anyway as they have practically all of the central contracts

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132090#Comment_119132090

I think Barnes helped LAR because he's so feckin slow whenever he does blow his whistle that he allowed the big boys to recover and maintain their stamina

But he did let loads infringements go throughout the game for both teams. Generally favouring the attacking side

If Barnes had seen the same camera angles the viewers saw most scrums would have been pens for LAR as Leinster were never driving straight

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132359#Comment_119132359

Not wanting to be overly negative, but I’m not sure about the bounce back thing. Next season is going to be a bit of a mess with the World Cup and I’m unconvinced Sexton will feature after the World Cup, or at least unconvinced he’ll be up to much.

And as we saw yesterday, Ross Byrne is not in the same league.

Barring some big signings, namely a big unit or two in the pack, this Leinster team will continue to stroll to league wins but also continue to fall short in Europe.

Dave_The_Sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132467#Comment_119132467

Leinster. Porter, Furlong, Ryan, Sexton, Henshaw, Ringrose.

Munster. Beirne, O'Mahony, Murray, Earls.

Connacht. Aki

Ulster. Henderson, Stockdale.

Might have missed someone. But Leinster have less than half, from what I can tell and only two more than Munster.

Akrasia

Yeah but furlong Porter and sexton may be the highest paid players in their positions in the world

Beirne only became a centrally contracted player this year and Earls is likely to retire at the end of this season

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132646#Comment_119132646

You can be guaranteed Sextons last contract is nowhere near what his previous one was. Also the contract he was on when he came back from Racing. Wasn’t fully paid for by the IRFU.

Dave_The_Sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132646#Comment_119132646

Yeah but, yeah but.

You claimed something that isn't even remotely true and are now backsliding.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132667#Comment_119132667

What I said was true. Most of the IRFU funding goes to leinster. The 'reply' conflated contracts starting next year with contracts ending this year.

But you can prove anything with facts...

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132677#Comment_119132677

I was wrong.

The three hardest words in the English language to say :D

Akrasia

7 hardest words, "I don't know how to do sums'

Earls contract is ending this year. Beirnes contract starts next year. They don't overlap and cancel each other out

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132701#Comment_119132701

Sextons contract ends next year too.

You can move the pieces around the board all you want, knock them over and **** on the board. It makes no difference. You made and objectively incorrect post and simply can’t admit it.

Teferi

Absolutely loving the munster gloating on here and across social media. Absolutely gas and very, very fitting that their biggest win of the year didn't come from their own team. Enjoy it boys.

Anyway, we're a big ugly mean bastard away from winning Europe. We've been a big ugly mean bastard away from winning Europe for 3-4 years now. It's maddening that we haven't resolved it and got someone in. When is Skelton's contract up?

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132713#Comment_119132713

Sexton is centrally contracted till 2023

Earls is out of contract in a few weeks

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119133056#Comment_119133056

You see you are just as bad as those that would support a foreign team against an Irish team. You sound like a soccer fan and that's very sad.

Fiyatoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119131413#Comment_119131413

So you see rugby above GAA and soccer?

it’s precisely this attitude that shows why the people of Ireland will always have the latter two head and shoulders above rugby in terms of popularity , following and participation.

rugby is still viewed as elitist at times, the price of tickets to a six nations match or most Ireland games to be quite honest reflects this.

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119133115#Comment_119133115

I would say that rugby is a better game and that the fans at games are more respectful.

pickarooney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132090#Comment_119132090

They booed him for two minutes straight after he gave a decision in their favour. It's just pantomime at this stage, along with the ridiculous idea that there's an 'anglo-saxon conspiracy' against all French teams.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132545#Comment_119132545

I think Leinster will find it hard to replace Sexton, but otherwise the squad overall is improving far more than declining.

People seem to be forgetting that Leinster were one late knock on away from a win, away, in France whilst notably underperforming.

I would not be remotely surprised if Leinster are competing in the final next year having well beaten every other team played on the way to the final.

As I said, a disappointing loss but overall an impressive season. Teams can have off days.

ironingbored

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119133259#Comment_119133259

This 👆️

People forget how bloody hard it is to win the HC.

A 3 point defeat to a French team in the south of France in 28° heat where we didn't play our best. A try at 18-10 and it was all over. Just not to be.

La Rochelle's budget was €27.9M in 2021/2022 season.

Real Madrid just won their 1st UCL in 4 years; Barcelona haven't won it since 2015 and City, despite spending £2B GBP have yet to win it.

crossman47

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119133140#Comment_119133140

I'll admit I was a munster fan hoping ROG won but that comment takes the biscuit. Rugby a better game than hurling!!!!

Dubinusa

Well Sarries should be back in the tournament next season. The French teams are obviously better than the urc and the premiership teams. Leinster were the only urc side in the sf and the other 3 were French.

I think when the Bok sids are competing in this tournament, it will make it even tougher. Next season, I think Leinster will struggle no matter the draw. Sexton will be 37 soon and RB will probably not be good enough to hoist a European cup. Sexton is playing great stuff but, I think his decline will happen soon.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132467#Comment_119132467

As a subsequent post has clarified, that's incorrect. Furthermore, it's pretty obvious to anyone with a brain in their head that the less money that the IRFU has in its coffers, the less money that it can distribute to the provinces. So an Irish team losing the final affects all of the provincial sides, not just Leinster.

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119132467#Comment_119132467

Who's fault is that?

Ardillaun

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119131820#Comment_119131820

I thought LAR were offside quite a bit but I’d like to be able to see VAR type imaging on offsides after a game to confirm and quantify how many were missed. Better again, it should be employed to detect and deter offsides during matches.

Skyfloater

35,000 turned up to welcome them home, not bad for a town with a pop of 75,000.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Y_kN4arfwU

Madeoface

No way Stan Wright can come out of retirement to solidify the scrum? He's only 43....

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119135175#Comment_119135175

I suppose Jack Dunne will be gone to Exeter so that might work...

AbusesToilets

Watching the highlights there, the two penalties after halftime came about when we were attacking effectively. We let the pressure off each time by taking the kick. So unlike how we normally play. At that point, we had La Rochelle well contained defensively.

So frustrating to see how we let them into the game. Stupid penalty right from 2nd half kickoff. Gifts then an easy 3 pts, which was the difference between them winning and the game going to extra time in the end.

leakyboots

Hard lines Leinster fans, for whatever reason you never got your game going. I was reminded of the Tyson quote - 'everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face'. Leinster haven't really gotten punched in the face much this season with their first choice 15, until Saturday. I'm a bit surprised by those who think if Sexton had cleared that ball or Jimmy O'Brien hadn't knocked it out they'd have won - La Rochelle are a serious outfit (beaten finalists last year, going well in the Top14) who go the 80, they were coming at Leinster whether those things had happened or not. The errors didn't help but they came from La Rochelle pressure built up before that. There were some mad comments in the pre-match threads.

My read of it was La Rochelle caused havoc at the breakdown and they attacked midfield - did Lowe get on the ball much at all in the whole game? Once according to stats I saw, JOB got it twice. By contrast, La Rochelle's wingers got it 13 times between them. Methinks ROG did his homework.

I do think La Rochelle were the better side on the day even if they only took the lead at the death, which is a bit weird to say. 60-40 possession, three tries to none, a bigger threat in attack, won the sin bin period territory-wise to my eye and forced Leinster into making uncharacteristic errors (Keenan, JOB, Sexton in particular) throughout the match. Ross Byrne looked lost when he came on. Doris and Conan (three penalties conceded, did well in the lineout though I think?) were poor, JvdF was superb. I thought Ringrose fronted up well in defence also. JGP played pretty well too to my mind.

Leinster don't meet many teams who can match or better them physically but when they do they don't seem to have an answer at the top level, I do think there is merit to the 'being overpowered by bigger men' argument. This goes for all provinces really and Ireland. Munster took steps towards that by signing Snyman, I think if we actually saw him in a run of games he'd transform our pack and scrum. Coombes at 8 adds ballast also. Kleyn adds great bulk to our scrum and lineout maul, there's a difference when he's not there. For Ireland, I don't know if Beirne and Ryan are the best combo internationally, to me there's an argument for Henderson +1.

I know some Leinster posters were turning their nose up at Jenkins but he could be that hard b&stard needed in matches like this to stem the tide. I know CJ Stander got an awful time from some but he never stopped carrying over the 80 mins. It'll be interesting to see where Leinster go from here, they've a great crop of youngsters coming through but Sexton will surely be on the wane and I'm wondering about Leamy leaving - was he the breakdown coach and is this not a massive facet of Leinster's style - quick ball? Who's going to take over from him? You'd hope the experience of this match will galvanise the younger cohort.

I'm not going to get too much into the whole slagging debate - personally I was happy for ROG and Donnacha Ryan. It's a pity it was against an Irish side but if it was going to be against any of the four I'd hope it would be Leinster. I find it hard to believe Leinster fans would not have a certain amount of happiness if a side coached by Brian O'Driscoll with a Seán O'Brien forwards coach beat Munster. I think you can be pleased for an opponent for whatever reason without rubbing someone's nose in it. I was there in the stadia supporting Leinster in their first two HEC wins. Losing in the last minutes like that is a very tough one to take.

Still silverware to play for and Leinster are rightly favourites so all is not lost.

frosty123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119128900#Comment_119128900

Nonsense!! we're a modern sophisticated country, we'd don't need that 'little old ireland' attitude anymore.. we're mature enough to stand on our two feet and not care if anyone supports or not.

It's like back in the day 'oh you have to like U2 cause they're Irish' - bollocks to that I say🙄

brokenangel

So I watched the game right up to the 75 min then had to run out to the shops, fell and head my head and just woke up

Well done Leinster

5 stars at last

⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️



cuttingtimber22

Would it have been better for Leinster if they had conceded early in that onslaught and then had a chance to turn things around. I felt it was inevitable LAR would score. BOD made that point in commentary.

Deusexmachina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119133056#Comment_119133056

Yes I think you are right. It's a real pity but I do think we will have to buy a monster or two at second row. We might also have to reassess just how good our front row is.

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119136047#Comment_119136047

Not sure about a monster 2nd row! There's only a couple of monster 3nd rows that are top quality. Ethebeth is in my opinion, the best lock in the world. Big hard man. Skelton is great, a monstrous big man. Willemse is also very good and very big. But, after them 3 freaks of nature There's not many that size close to that level.

Leinster have a problem with Portrt being way off the mark at the scrum. There's no hiding the fact, that's he's been mediocre. If he gets it together then it will be a more solid pack. Bear in mind, that Aldritt is 264 lbs! Conan is about 245! That's a fairly big difference. Ross Molony is about 17 stone. He said himself that he is107 kgs. That's too light for this type of opponent.

Coming up theres Deeny, 114 kgs and Ryan, 116 kgs. Then Jenkins and McCarthy. Size won't be an issue. Porter scrummaging might be!

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119136148#Comment_119136148

My issue with the whole size argument is we both the Irish provinces and Ireland seem to get monstered worse than anyone when we come up against big packs, like you don't see Wales or Scotland get beaten as badly despite the fact when we play these teams we tend to have the upper hand. When I look at that and then look at how much we as a country obsess about our players size, far more than I see people on forms in other countries talk about (including Scotland & Wales). This all leads me to believe do we just have some sort of defeatist mindset once we come up against a big pack that we cant overcome them and therefore get monstered as a result, I mean when you are getting monstered by 7 man English pack which isnt filled with monster like SA or France have then there needs to be serious questions asked.

TRC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119136195#Comment_119136195

To be fair, we didn't get monstered around the park in that England game. All of our difficulties in that game, bar our scrum, were of our own making. Our scrum did get monstered, but our scrum gets monstered by everyone.

Neil3030

Happy for ROG and Ryan.

Gloating at Leinster's loss is very beta.

But the "you must support Irish teams" energy gives me the creeps.

Nermal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119136035#Comment_119136035

I thought that too. Reminiscent of Superbowl XLVI.

Neil3030

Except you have to win the restart in rugby, which on the day seemed like it would have been a 50-50 for Leinster.

AbusesToilets

I really don't buy the argument we were monstered. Our defense stifled them for the majority of the game, and we resourced rucks well. We still had quick ball. We wouldn't have defended successfully for 10 straight minutes in the 22 otherwise, and we had frequently driven them back in defense. They had one in the first half that started deep in the 22 and ended up on half way.

The scrum issues are largely down to Porter's poor technique, as has been said. I'm confident he'll be improved come WC time.

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119136206#Comment_119136206

It didnt though? Only against England & France. Against Wales & Scotland our scrum went well yet when these teams played England they performed far better than we did, its a pattern and makes me think is there more to our scrum getting beat than just size?

crisco10

Overall, I'm a bit confused by a lot of the negativity.

Leinster were not at 100% due to a LAR playing well with good tactics. And yet, we're 2 scores ahead going into last quarter and only lost to last play of the game?

There is any number of sliding door moments in that last 20 that needed just one to go the other way. E.g. dulans drop goal doesnt viciously bounce back, keenan stays infield, LaR fumble at some stage (not on advantage) in that last 8 mins etc etc.

That is really not a disastarously bad performance in an away game in France

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119136512#Comment_119136512

I think the negativity is in the context of this being 2 years in a row Leinster have been beaten by La Rochelle, and it's the 3rd time since their last euro win that Leinster have been beaten by a team with a similar toolkit.

You can also add on to this that the Leinster pack is basically the Ireland pack, and we have seen Ireland come unstuck in similar circumstances in recent seasons.

Which is to say, you cannot entirely put it down to being just unlucky on the day, and there is definitely an underlying issue in Leinster that has not yet been addressed.