Cult of Stephen Kenny

Curse These Metal Hands

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100767#Comment_121100767

But I thought hiring inexperienced managers is a massive mistake? There are many who say Kenny should never have been given the job due to his credentials, but are excited about Carsely.

Curse These Metal Hands

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100767#Comment_121100767

But I thought hiring inexperienced managers is a massive mistake? There are many who say Kenny should never have been given the job due to his credentials, but are excited about Carsely.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100812#Comment_121100812

Hmm not sure whether I would consider Carsley as inexperienced. In fat I think he'd get a job in PL or championship without issue if he were interest and the right job came along. Kenny shouldn't be in the KDSL at this stage.

osarusan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100786#Comment_121100786

We have had those higher and lower rankings mostly based on the quality of players available. The manager can't buy better players. We are one of those countries like Scotland and Norway who can go for decades without getting to tournament finals. No other manager would have done better with the current crop.

Any competent manager would have avoided the results we've had against Azerbaijan, Luxembourg, and Qatar, with the current crop.

Even considering the limited pool of players we have, Kenny has had us consistently punching below our weight.

Tombo2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121098227#Comment_121098227

Funny, John Giles doesnt think so but what does he know.

There is no argument that says this manager has underperformed with the group of players he has at his disposal.

Its like whingeing about the Meath manager because they didnt get to an all Ireland final.

lbunnae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100786#Comment_121100786

Horseshit.

Curse These Metal Hands

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100825#Comment_121100825

Well, if the Premier league is just around the corner it makes no sense for him to take the Ireland job.

Tombo2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121099142#Comment_121099142

Why would Roy Keane take this job.....honestly.

There is no obvious candidate her at all.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100836#Comment_121100836

He has an opinion like the rest of us.

osarusan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100836#Comment_121100836

There is no argument that says this manager has underperformed with the group of players he has at his disposal.

Failing to beat Azerbaijan, Luxembourg, and Qatar at home is the very definition of underperforming with the players he has at his disposal.

Stanley 1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100714#Comment_121100714

McCarthy was an out and out Delaney fan, he still needed his pay off and there was a bonus scheme in place from which he stood to gain very nicely, not going to rock the boat, there was always talk his contracts were so generous, Delaney could have been his agent or may have gained financially somehow.

Gusser09

https://www.balls.ie/football/eamon-dunphy-stephen-kenny-criticism-570033

This lad absolutely slated Trap , MON, Charlton and Mick. What a joke the irish media, himself and Giles really are.

Anything for them too to stay relevant after getting removed from RTE I suppose.

boccers

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100825#Comment_121100825

He's inexperienced at senior level. As in he has no experience. I am excited to see if he does become our manager as he seems to be very highly thought of but he has only worked as a coach and underage manager so he is not experienced in terms of men's football.

Saying he would get a job in the most valuable league in the world without issue kind of sums up what we are dealing with here.

Sunny Disposition

Every Irish manager gets severe criticism. Even Jack Charlton during the year we reached the last eight in the world.

To me it looks like Kenny hasn’t installed a winning mentality. That said it’s a very average squad and we’re not way behind where we should be at best. There was no shame in the two recent results.

orangerhyme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100467#Comment_121100467

Scotland have much better players than us. They've a core of excellent players playing PL and CL.

Not to diminish Steve Clarke's achievements.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100825#Comment_121100825

Interesting point about Kenny. His stock has probably gone down after the Ireland job, not upwards. It would probably be very difficult for him to get a job outside the LOI now.

Everlong1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100847#Comment_121100847

Because he's been banging on for years about the culture of celebrating failure and lack of professionalism in Irish football and now has a chance to put his money where his mouth is and show us all how it should be done?

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100672#Comment_121100672

Who are these best players coming through though? Ferguson has been around for like 3 matches. We have Collins and O'Shea who are doing ok but they're not really anything special so far, our full backs Coleman and Doherty almost done. Our midfield is diabolical by all measures. Parrot, Obafemi, Idah... none of them are really working out.

It's a terrible squad, Scotland have a much more solid team.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101153#Comment_121101153

We have decent player available to us that should be beating Luxembourg , Armenia and Azerbaijan twice. However you are correct in your assertion that at the moment we don't really have game changers available.

That's the exact reason why we need a manager to come in a get the best out of this bunch. And tika taka 50 passes 30 meters from our own goals isn't it.

Macy0161

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100825#Comment_121100825

There's no way he'd be taking the Ireland job if PL or Championship clubs were looking for a manager - he's gone around a few clubs, and acted as caretaker, without getting the gig. But his main track record is in underage teams. Kenny has far more experience.

From talking up the players, now we're down to talking up the alternatives? Out of the realistic options, he's probably my pick, but "not Kenny" does not equal the next coming of Pep!

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121100825#Comment_121100825

Even if Carsley wanted the Ireland job and would take a pay cut etc. I would not be sure on him at all. He has only managed at underage level - the crop of players he had at u21 for England was exceptional.

I know people will be screaming Kerr got the Ireland job - similar etc. True.

But I would counter that with Kerr had an experienced senior squad, grizzled pros - plus he brought Roy Keane back. Leaders all over the pitch.

This current crop of Ireland players are really inexperienced, there is no stand out 'leader' except Coleman and he is always injured. So the only only hope is leadership from the sideline - needs to be a shouter, vocal, driven, a thick skin, experienced etc That is the type of manager Ireland is crying out for.

Plus a manager who can spot tactical changes where needed. It was pointed out second captains podcast by Damien Delaney and Ken Early that Kenny did not seem to spot that Holland changed to a four even post match!

https://www.secondcaptains.com/2023/09/11/episode-2736-you-say-you-want-an-evolution-ireland-1-2-netherlands/

The Irish manager needs to react quickly tactically be more aware, Kenny always seemed poor tactically.

The podcast was also noticeable in that Eoin wanted Kenny to stay on because he felt sorry for him. It was as if they were talking about a dog they were going to put down - talking of dignity! Sadlier said he tried that approach but there comes a tipping point - also it is a senior international team not some junior club.

Gusser09

We keep coming back to the obvious thing here. Kenny has utterly failed in terms of results. Who can get the most out of the group of players? Can these players handle the key targets which are set for them? (Being in contention for a playoff or automatic spot going into the last 2 or 3 games of a group). Or are these players comfortable now with Kenny and no real expectation being placed on them from the management other than not playing direct ball.

boccers

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101274#Comment_121101274

One thing I always wondered and I presume it is the case but would managers have someone up high in the stands to send down messages? Very hard to see anything on the sideline or on a screen.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101275#Comment_121101275

I do believe that a really good manager can improve any bunch of players. You'd have to say that Kenny is seriously underachieving at this point (look at the Greek result. A good manager could certainly improve our results and see us picking up points.

Thelonious Monk

I really don't know why people think we should be getting results against Greece away. They have a good league, a proper football culture, teams in the CL every year, Euro champs in 2004, good stadiums, a bigger population. We can only dream of being anywhere near that kind of a football country.

AdrianG08

Stephen Kenny is unfortunately not at the level required to manage at international level. He is not at the level to manage at the top level. Pains me to say it, but its absolutely true.

I'll preface this (as it seems for some reason to be important what side of the fence we sit) by saying I am a LOI fan, love going to live games, regular at the Aviva for international games, yada yada....

The FAI have a body of work that needs to be completed in order to set Irish football on the right track for the next 20 years. They need to fight for every penny of funding they can to raise the standard of football in this country, they need to fight tooth and **** nail on this. THAT is their number 1 job. All this talk of implementing a passing style of football etc.. is absolute lip service, this requires a journey, implementing it with the senior team should be the destination, albeit the culmination of years of changing the culture at underage level.

Millions of euro need to be spent on infrastructure, stadia, training facilities, academies, the league in general, coaching etc... and only then will the work start in terms of us being on a level pegging with countries of similar size.

In terms of management of the men's senior international team, this is where some peoples interest in Irish football begins and ends. Sack Kenny and we are anti LOI, keep him on and he will drag us into the doldrums.

In my opinion, the deeper issues with our game need to be sorted, I'd have been happy to retain Kenny provided our seeding wasn't starting to slide, I do not expect him to qualify for major championships given our playing personnel (the worst in my lifetime), nor do I expect him to change the entire playing style/footballing philosophy of Irish football. Its unrealistic. But as soon as we start giving away 2-3 campaigns on the back of supposedly "developing the next generation" (baring in mind we reverted to Shane Duffy at CB and Jimmy McClean at LWB the other night) then we are in thin ground. Before we know it we will be 4th or 5th seeds for qualifying for these major tournaments.

The next managers remit should be to properly start to build a squad, whilst even if we don't qualify, we don't finish any lower than comfortably 3rd in our group. More importantly, is the development of a plan for Irish football for the next 20 years, that includes both public and private funding to drag our football philosophy and economy into the 21st century.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101356#Comment_121101356

It is a combination of all the results as a whole. Koeman did Kenny tactically. Kenny did not know how to respond and when he did it was too late.

Ireland had a great chance of beating Holland, a gift of start. But like the pattern of many Kenny matches in the heat of battle he faded along with his team later in games. That game management has to come from the sideline.

Look at the team that beat Germany 1-0 in 2015.

https://us.soccerway.com/matches/2015/10/08/europe/european-championship-qualification/ireland-republic/germany/1653352/

It was no great shakes on paper - defenders are arguably better now. Plus Robbie Keane did not get on the pitch - his career was winding down.

Also look at Mick's record in qualifying -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2020_qualifying

He only lost one game that was only 3 years ago - yet Kenny threw all the young players in tried to get a new style of play (the players are not suited to) and expected to have better results.

I think this the players are not there is over egged. If a decent manager set him his team tactically correctly there is a chance of qualifying - other teams with far less standard of players Northern Ireland, Finland, North Macedonia, Slovakia, Iceland, etc have qualified for tournaments.

There is also the extra chance of qualifying via the nations league etc, and more play off places, a bigger tournament. It has never been easier to qualify for tournaments in the history of football.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101356#Comment_121101356

But we didn't even show up. That could easily have been a 4-1 defeat. It's not as if we went there and hit the woodwork three times and had a penalty saved.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101116#Comment_121101116

They have better players in certain positions but they're winning their group while we're near the bottom in ours, that wide of a gap is down to management.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101153#Comment_121101153

I listed them already. A while host of players have made breakthroughs in the last few seasons.

As already pointed out, Scotland are better in some positions but they are overachieving, with us coming near the bottom of most groups, we are underachieving. Just like Scotland were before Clarke took over. Hopefully getting a new manager in can change things.