Cult of Stephen Kenny

Fred Astaire · 08-06-2022 8:42am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172588#Comment_119172588

Yes I completely agree.

And for the most part I don't think the football has been more aesthetically pleasing - at least I get no pleasure from seeing our back 5 pass it between them repeatedly. I feel some people would be happier if they did away with the scoreboard and started only throwing up the possession statistic in the corner of the tv screen and in the stadium.

Dav010 · 08-06-2022 8:47am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172579#Comment_119172579

Apathy as a consequence of a period of sustained failure I’m afraid.

Did you smash it · 08-06-2022 8:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172599#Comment_119172599

Well the 4-0s vs Azerbaijan and Qatar and the 3-0 vs Luxembourg we’re better to watch than we are used to. 2-2 vs Belgium was entertaining aswell.

we were an incredible team under McCarthy and Oneill because no matter who was the opposition we would score 1 goal and 1 goal only. It was freakish but not great aesthetically

Fandymo · 08-06-2022 8:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172382#Comment_119172382

The senior international managers remit has absolutely nothing to do with underage development. Zip. Zero. Nada. NOTHING!!

Dav010 · 08-06-2022 8:52am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172616#Comment_119172616

How many teams have the players necessary to play football that is good to watch, and win regularly as a consequence of playing that way?

Gusser09 · 08-06-2022 8:53am

I mean the style of play is still brutal to watch though.

Fred Astaire · 08-06-2022 8:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172616#Comment_119172616

2 of those results were friendlies. Friendlies are meaningless.

Martin O'Neill's Ireland destroyed Uruguay in a friendly a few years ago - if that was Kenny lads would be using it as an excuse for him to get a 10 year contract.

Mick McCarthy beat New Zealand 3-1 in a friendly - again, nobody cared about that then but when Kenny beats Qatar in a friendly there's a communal orgy amongst some of the support.

I would also argue that it's far easier to throw caution to the wind - to go and win 4-0 v Azerbaijan or 3-0 v Luxembourg, because there was nothing to play for. Kenny had us eliminated from the group within 2 games. Mick or MON always had us in contention until the end. That meant we had something to protect and hang on to, which in turn is going to affect how you set up in games. When the pressure is off these lads are capable of beating international minnows. Considering he only has 2 competitive wins in 16, not even that happens often. When the pressure is on, they lose to them. Hardly something to be hanging your hat on.

Fandymo · 08-06-2022 8:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172643#Comment_119172643

You’ll be eating your words in 2034 when Kenny has had the time he so desperately needs and goes on an epic 2 competitive game winning run in back to back games vs Andorra.

08-06-2022 9:11am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172655#Comment_119172655

i cant wait that long for such glory, im a venal plastic fan who wants to beat andorra NOW

Did you smash it · 08-06-2022 9:22am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172643#Comment_119172643

being real about this, the fai have no money, there was a feel good atmosphere around the supporters, the ones who pay the money.

kenny will get sacked like all managers if saturdays performance becomes the norm ( it hadn’t been in the lead up to the Armenia)

then we’ll give someone else a try and the results may slightly improve but don’t expect us to be any great shakes.

Gusser09 · 08-06-2022 9:49am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172461#Comment_119172461

Ah but you're wrong again. Kenny picks the squad and then picks the players he wants on the starting 11. We have a squad full of players playing in the Championship. He could have gone with this team for example

GK Travers - Championship

CB Duffy - PL Squad Player. Still far better than anything Armenia have.

CB Collins - PL Regular toward end of season

CB Egan - Championship Regular

RWB Coleman - PL Regular

LWB Manning - Championship Regular

CM Cullen - Belgian Top division Regular

CM Browne - Championship Regular

CM Knight - Championship Regular

FW Obafemi Championship Regualr

FW Robinson Championship Regualr. The guy gets plenty of minutes and starts.

We have plenty of players playing at a high level of football in the championship.

The excuses for being beaten by the like of Luxembourg and Armenia don't stack up when it comes to the quality of player argument.

Most of Armenias team are playing internally in Armenia.

Did you smash it · 08-06-2022 9:54am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172818#Comment_119172818

I’m wrong again? Where have I been wrong before?

if you think picking a team is picking the players playing for PL clubs, then championship clubs, then L1 clubs in that order then any eejit can pick the correct team.

troy Parrott is league 1, got the winner vs Lithuania, ogbene is league 1, got the equalizer vs Belgium.

Fandymo · 08-06-2022 10:00am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172717#Comment_119172717

And if someone does come in and turns it around, the cultists will say “Yeah, but he doesn’t play football the right way”.

Gusser09 · 08-06-2022 10:01am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172838#Comment_119172838

I'm articulating the fact that we do have the players to beat Armenia and Luxembourg. There is nothing wrong or arrogant about stating that. It's a fact.

Did you smash it · 08-06-2022 10:04am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172862#Comment_119172862

there is a cult around Kenny but there’s also a feel good atmosphere from supporters which leads to big gates at the Aviva.

if Kenny gets us relegated from group B of the NL he may pay the price as the cult is a fickle mob just like the Kenny out brigade is also a fickle mob.

Fandymo · 08-06-2022 10:10am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172873#Comment_119172873

Why tf would anyone feel good about how godawful we are at the moment??

Did you smash it · 08-06-2022 10:15am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172897#Comment_119172897

Ask the fans who have been flocking to the Aviva for dead rubbers

Fred Astaire · 08-06-2022 10:17am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172717#Comment_119172717

I have a season ticket so I pay the money (just so we're clear). Not every season ticket comes with a Stephen Kenny indoctrination package.

Saturday has been the norm because Kenny has 2 competitive wins in 16 competitive games. Saturday was very much the norm. The outliers were the two victories at the end of the last qualification campaign.

I've supported us for a very long time, and barring complete rubbish no hopers like Kenny and Staunton, and managers staying on one campaign too long - such as Trap staying for the World Cup qualifiers in 2014 when his reign had run its course - we have always been at the very least in the mix up for qualification in the final group game. Sometimes we make it to a playoff, and sometimes we win that playoff. What we always have, is a chance. Under Kenny, we don't have that. Kenny has us out of groups after just 2 games. You'd have to be utterly deluded to think there is any chance of him qualifying us for Euro 2024.

Did you smash it · 08-06-2022 10:20am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172865#Comment_119172865

We should be beating those everytime we play them but I wouldn’t say we can be complacent about beating them.

Teams win by scoring goals, Ireland have had just three squad members with good goal scoring seasons: obafemi, keane and Parrott. These are mainly very young and with the possible exception of Parrott very inexperienced at international level. Look at foden and Jason sancho for England. Very talented players but haven’t really being very good consistently for England yet.

Breaking through at international level is gradual. Even superb talents find this.

Macy0161 · 08-06-2022 10:31am

I'm actually not Kenny's biggest fan (still haven't forgiven him for ditching Longford!), but we just don't have the players. In that context, I'm happy to persist in trying to play football.

If people want to blame anyone, blame MON and McCarthy for not nailing down Grealish and Rice when they had the chance!

Gusser09 · 08-06-2022 10:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172997#Comment_119172997

We don't have the players to expect to qualify for tournaments. I agree. We don't have the players to expect to get results against top 20 teams on a regular basis.

I think we have the players to consistently beat teams like Luxembourg and Armenia on a regular basis which ensures that we remain relevant in groups until the last couple of games. Everyone knows that we need to take 6 points in a qualifying group off the like of Azerbaijan, Armenia and Luxembourg. You have to be doing that. We have pretty much always done that before.

Fred Astaire · 08-06-2022 10:50am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172997#Comment_119172997

We have the players to beat Luxembourg, Azerbaijan, Armenia, Bulgaria, Finland. There is absolutely no debate to be had there. From that set of 9 competitive games, Kenny has 2 wins, 3 draws and 4 defeats. Completely unacceptable.

And if we "just don't have the players", all the more reason to be pragmatic in our approach and utilise a style that makes us organised and hard to beat - rather than trying to force a style of football that is unsuited to what we have available.

Grealish was a non runner from the start. O'Neill badly messed up the Rice situation agreed.

briany · 08-06-2022 10:54am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172717#Comment_119172717

The cycle with the Irish team since McCarthy v1 has been boom and bust.,though the booms were not overly spectacular. Kerr and Staunton were flops. Trap was a stabiliser for a few years til his bubble got popped. O'Neill the same thing. Mccarthy and Kenny quite similar to Kerr/Staunton.

The Irish football system has been underdeveloped for decades and the quality of player being produced has been on a downward spiral since the 90s. No manager you get in will change that. The best they can do is temporarily halt the progress with some sort of tactical nous and man management.

But, like picking a scab, it may feel good, but it helps nothing. A manager helps arrest the decline and that in turn eases pressure on the FAI to really do something about some fundamental problems in Irish football. If said manager actually manages to fluke into a tournament using the same old, same old, it's worse again. No-one wants to even acknowledge the problems when it's party time. It's all very short term thinking.

There hasn't been a truly great player to emerge out of this country since Robbie Keane. Address that and managers were get in will likely start to seem as lot better.

kowloonkev · 08-06-2022 12:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119172435#Comment_119172435

The match going fans and the players clearly disagree with the experts on boards after hours.

Gusser09 · 08-06-2022 12:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119173503#Comment_119173503

Yeh I'm sure the players love getting bet by Armenia and Luxembourg.

Fandymo · 08-06-2022 1:10pm

Scott Hogan. One of the only Irish players scoring at Championship level dropped from the match day squad. Absolute donkeys like Robinson, Parrott and Will Keane in ahead of him.

Dav010 · 08-06-2022 1:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119173503#Comment_119173503

You are going to struggle to find fans in the Aviva or particularly those who paid good money to travel to Arminia, who share your optimism at the moment.