Public Pay Talks - see mod warning post 4293

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122872338#Comment_122872338

It's 1% of payroll. If anyone gets more than that then someone else has to lose out, which is hard to see anyone agreeing to, so it'll end up as 1% across the board.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122870682#Comment_122870682

You're being generous giving them a 50% chance of getting it right 😁

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122873881#Comment_122873881

for whole of public and civil service we reckon? Would you expect us to hear that confirmed a few months before?

caviardreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122891269#Comment_122891269

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122873881#Comment_122873881

Would not be so sure on it being a blanket 1% for all this time:

https://www.forsa.ie/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/Local-Bargaining-Explainer.pdf

https://www.siptu.ie/local-bargaining-to-commence-under-the-public-service-agreement/

pc7

Interesting that ICTU saying 4-7% next year for private workers should be the aim for 2025 https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/private-sector-workers-may-be-set-for-pay-rise-of-up-to-7pc-next-year/a679679115.html

Are public sector 3% with the optional 1% iirc?

Heiser

I was moved to the higher scale of my grade back in early October, but still haven't seen the increase applied to my wage yet. Being told there's a big backlog in the NSSO. Anyone idea how long it takes these days?

Hotblack Desiato

Assuming it's civil service, you have to be in the higher scale post for a year before you are paid and it's not backdated!

Sad Professor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122941438#Comment_122941438

People on promotion are being told at least 6 weeks.

rostalof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122941486#Comment_122941486

That's what I've been told by the NSSO too.

TheSunIsShining

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122942199#Comment_122942199

Circular 24 from 1995 says:

Pay on Assignment to the Higher Scales

25 Officers assigned to a higher scale will move across to that scale at their existing pay on the standard scale following the assimilation arrangements set out in paragraphs 10-19 above and move along the higher scale by annual increments in the normal way.

26 An officer who is on a point below the ordinary maximum of the standard scale, i.e. excluding any long service increments, at the time of his/her assignment to the higher scale, will on the first anniversary of the assignment to the higher scale, be awarded an increment on the higher scale. This increment will be additional to the normal increment. It will not affect the normal incremental progression of such an officer and his/her incremental date will remain the same. The grant of increments on the higher scale will be subject to the usual rules as regards the grant of increments.

27 The arrangement referred to in the preceding paragraph concerning the granting of an additional increment will not apply to any person assigned to a higher scale whose pay on the first anniversary of his/her assignment would, in any event, be the value of at least one increment higher than it would have been had s/he remained on the standard scale.

28 Where an officer who has received one long service increment on a standard scale is assigned to a higher scale, entry to the higher scale will be at existing pay and the date of assignment will become the new incremental date. In addition, where the officer would have qualified within one year for a second long service increment on the standard scale if s/he had remained on that scale, s/he should be advanced to a rate of pay on the higher scale equal to the second long service incremental point with effect from the date on which s/he would have qualified for the second long service increment. As the officer would then be on an off-scale point, s/he should subsequently be moved to a scale point by reference to the normal procedures in this regard involving a new incremental date.

29 Where an officer on the maximum of the standard scale, who has not yet qualified for the first long service increment, is assigned to the higher scale - this situation will not arise in relation to serving officers referred to in paragraphs 15 and 16- the following arrangements should apply:

where the officer has two years' service or less on the maximum of the standard scale, entry to the higher scale will be at existing pay and the date of entry will become the new incremental date; .

where the officer has more than two years' service on the maximum ofthe standard scale, entry to the higher scale will also be at existing pay. The officer will, however, be advanced to the next point on the higher scale on the date on which s/he would have qualified for the first long service increment on the standard scale (i.e. after three years' service would have been completed on the maximum). That date will then become the incremental date on the higher scale.

30 Where an officer who has received two long service increments on the standard scale is assigned to the higher scale, entry to the higher scale will also be at existing pay. As this is an off-scale point, the officer should subsequently be moved to a scale point by reference to the normal procedures in this regard involving a new incremental date.

rostalof

Thanks. I've read the circular previously and it was confirmed by the NSSO that as I'm on the top point of the scale for less than 2 years, I have to wait a year from the date I was placed on the higher scale for the next increment. That was my interpretation of it and that's what they confirmed. If you've spent more than two years on the top point, you move onto the LSI1 increment on your next standard increment date, which continues as your increment date.

nearby_cheetah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122924698#Comment_122924698

Unlike the pay rises given to the public sector, increments are not simply ignored when discussing the % increase.

So a private employee getting a 4% increase means exactly that.

Hotblack Desiato

Yawn

nearby_cheetah

I take it from the previous response, you are unable to refute the point I was making.

The poster that linked to the Independent article seems to have forgotten about the increments and is under the impression that public employee pay increases are just "the 3% with the optional 1%".

I hope I cleared things up for him.

pc7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122950313#Comment_122950313

If you are at the top of your scale in public sector, it means 3%, exactly that.

nearby_cheetah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122951698#Comment_122951698

Ceilings exist in the private sector as well. So if you want more then upskill or get a promotion.

Dodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122952021#Comment_122952021

hi private sector work here, but the obvious reply to that is “if you think public sector salaries are so good, get a job there”

This tit for tat nonsense adds nothing to any debate on the issue

pc7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122952021#Comment_122952021

I don't want more, my role works for family/work balance, I was just pointing out not everyone gets increments. You seemed so adamant it should be counted.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122952042#Comment_122952042

Every salary across both sectors should be rising to deal with the cost of living. Fair enough inflation is slowing but the cost of living won't go down.

Absolutely it's not a private v public thing.

nearby_cheetah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122952042#Comment_122952042

Why did you not respond likewise when the article to the Independent was linked. If that person thinks it's better for private sector, then go get a job there.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122951493#Comment_122951493

Yawn

pc7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122952141#Comment_122952141

I didn't say that, I was just pointing out the article, this is a discussion board and thread on pay agreements. Anyhow, I'll leave you to it.

Dodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122952141#Comment_122952141

because I jumped in here at the last page. I don’t visit the thread all the time as it’s effectively the same arguments over and over again

I’ve posted in the past that the vast majority of people don’t get involved in these ridiculous arguments. They do what’s best for them and their families. The public v private debate is pretty much over with so many people now working in both when it suits them to do so

For some it’s security and flexibility in the public sector. For others it’s wages in the private sector.

And even that is reductive.

I think any person who argues that workers in any sector shouldn’t try to improve their lot is ridiculous though.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122952021#Comment_122952021

Yawn

readoutloud

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2024/12/30/public-pay-identified-as-fiscal-pressure-point-for-incoming-government/

Interesting to note both that public sector pay is viewed as a risk and that public spending would need to grow significantly (ie: higher wages / increases) to match private sector.

"The paper, which has just been published, sets out forecasts for increases in wages in the Irish economy between 2025 and 2030. It states that wages in the Irish economy are expected to grow strongly over the term of the next government, with annual increases ranging from 3.7 per cent to 4.2 per cent."

"Noting that the current pay deal in the public sector will expire in 2026, the analysis says if a future public sector pay deal grew in line with wage increases in the private sector, and the number of workers grew in line with expected population growth, the annual increase in State spending on public pay would rise from €554.7 million in 2026 to €1.66 billion by 2027."

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123000705#Comment_123000705

Of course if wages grow and population grows then this is not "risk" at all, as the same proportion of state expenditure goes to public service pay.

The only rational policy is to pay the going rate, while expecting modern productivity, and to increase services if population growth requires it

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122951493#Comment_122951493

You forgot to clear up that increments are performance related pay, and don't apply to all staff.

Fletwick

The top of the scale is the true salary for that role.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123000705#Comment_123000705

That's a really creative way to spin things, I'll give them that much!

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122941486#Comment_122941486

When I went onto the higher scale for my grade it was paid within a few weeks and fully backdated.

Hotblack Desiato

Yeah as another poster pointed out, it depends on where you are on your current pay scale.