Public Pay Talks - see mod warning post 4293

fliball123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119554442#Comment_119554442

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119554343#Comment_119554343

Show me one of those companies where as an employer they are 240Billion in debt and come back to me

The Unions are going on about needing cost of living measures in the budget as well as the pay increases. Anyone any clue what the cost of living measures will be? Were they part of the discussions, or are the unions just guessing/hoping?

pc7

Forsa have recommended the deal, have any other unions yet? https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2022/0901/1320049-forsa-pay-latest/

Gusser09

Just milling around in the office again and most people I meet regardless of grade are satisfied with the deal. That was about 9 or 10 people. 2 people were totally opposed to it but I thought they would be.

hungerjames

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119552217#Comment_119552217

Soon-ish, I got the email from Forsa today asking if my contact details were still the same, so they're gearing up to email everyone.

pc7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119554894#Comment_119554894

I'm off work this week so not sure what the feeling is, from friends in PS everyone is a yes, 1 would like more but reckons as good as it will get. Checked emails but nothing yet from union.

Sierra Oscar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119554843#Comment_119554843

Nothing confirmed, but a lot of discussion in the media around the one off measures - i.e. probably a few rounds of the Electricty Account Credit, a double payment of the Child Benefit Allowance and a few more measures. Then add in increases to the income tax bands which will benefit all workers.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119546176#Comment_119546176

War is peace.

Ignorance is strength.

A pay rise that leaves workers worse off is a "victory".

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119551869#Comment_119551869

Tearing me up inside? Really? Funnily enough, I've had bigger issues on my mind over the past month. It's just that when you try, yet again, to play the 'most obnoxious boy in the class' role, remember the guy who wasn’t happy to have the best bike but insisted on telling absolutely everyone that he had the best bike, when you bang that drum yet again, I'll call it out for the height of crassness that it is.

Looks like you missed the point of much of those WFH discussions, perhaps not being able to see beyond the end of your nose, or perhaps the end of your pocket.

Another electricity price increase.. I think 6.5% is a $hit deal now. I'm voting against.

fliball123

Another little nugget of where we are heading and for those thinking they are going to be getting 6% a year pay increases on the never never and those who continuously gave me sh1te for calling our upcoming recession. It will be here come winter or at latest by the end of Spring 2023 be interesting if the government have to renege on the commitments for pay increases come 2023.

https://www.independent.ie/business/irish/rising-yields-at-ntma-bond-auction-reveal-changed-rate-environment-for-government-debt-41953842.html

So in effect our debt is now starting to get a sh1t load more expensive (7 times more than it was in February) but like I say keep the heads in the sands lads nothing to see here

This is actually spun very positively by the powers that be but when the price for new borrowing increases and by 7 fold its a sure fire signal that we are going into choppy water.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119551869#Comment_119551869

Not having to buy lunches?

Do you think people working from home fast all day, or something?

If I'm not mistaken you posted this exact same nonsense in this thread previously. It's like a broken record.

Yes there are savings on commuting (though, for public transport users, the costs have come down so saving isn't that much) but the big and only getting bigger offset on that saving is having to heat a home all day in winter.

combat14

Finance grads get utility vouchers and 20pc pay hikes

‘War for talent’ sees starter salaries of €65,000 plus promise of flexible work, inflation-busting incentives

https://m.independent.ie/business/irish/finance-grads-get-utility-vouchers-and-20pc-pay-hikes-41952019.html

might be time for certain sections of public sector to negotiate a separate deal with government

Hotblack Desiato

Not going to happen.

Hotblack Desiato

Someone mentioned that it's a good thing that this deal is a short deal.

I'd say it's the only good thing about it.

The current deal we're on (1% and 1.5% increases) was an absolutely terrible deal too, but at least it was mercifully short.

The multi-year deals are hopefully now forever a thing of the past. We always got shafted with them, but plenty of eejits would just look at the figures saying "ooh, in X years time my pay will be Y, I'll be rich!" and voted for it disregarding of course what the cost of living would do to that pay by the time they got it.

Nobody can now afford to ignore the effect of the cost of living, yet we're now being asked to accept a deal which doesn't even come close to addressing this, along with vague promises of "something will be done" in the budget. It's not nearly good enough.

I'm over 25 years in and the cumulative effect of weak unions and apathetic membership has seen the value of CS pay slowly but surely erode in real terms over that time.

As long as we keep signing up for bad deals out of fear, apathy, or a promise that the next one will be better, we will continue to get shafted.

"Keep hold of nurse, for fear of something worse."

Sam the Sham

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119554177#Comment_119554177

You keep repeating this--and have already been corrected once--and it's lacking context. Specifically: from 2009 to 2013 there were 3 successive pay cuts in the public sector. What happened between 2014 and 2021 was largely pay restoration as the country emerged from recession. By setting your start point at 2014, you've deliberately picked a date to twist what happened to fit your narrative.

fliball123

I have yet to be corrected and its there for anyone to look in the history books at how those cuts unfolded we were told to get our house in order by an external auditor (the IMF) and they stated that we were paying our public sector too much (it wasn't me or anyone else in the country) so it had to be done. Sure the government of the day where on giving interviews and denying the IMF where coming into the country and some even on the morning of them arriving in Ireland and we are seeing the same approach from our politicians today head in the sand, nothing to see here..... 6.5% increases. Sure what could possibly go wrong.

I have retorted this all the time and 2014 is the year that most experts will tell you we were out of the crash and in 2015 we were back paying the public sector the same or more per head than were before the cuts came into force. Also one of those cuts was a contribution to a defined benefit. I have corrected others and said that this narrative of pay restoration came from the unions spinning.

tayto lover

The Government offered this deal because they know what’s coming down the line with the price rises etc that we are going to have to face.

There’s no other reason. I’m not so sure that it will be accepted now when I see the electricity/gas price rise, taxi fares up 12% too, food bills rising fast as well as rents and mortgage rates.

When you examine it properly it’s not so great at all. The wee carrot of the backpay shouldn’t entice people to vote ‘yes’ either.

jaffa20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119555782#Comment_119555782

The deal is 8% for the lower paid. Hoping there will be other cuts to income tax and supports for rising energy costs available from the budget too.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119555038#Comment_119555038

They need to look at the social welfare supports for employees.

I get the rise of a few euro and loose my medical card when 4 of us have medical issues requiring doctors and medication.

WFP also reduces significantly, so I'm in effect worse off for getting an increase

Sultan of Bling

No vote for this deal should happen until after the budget is announced.

Pogue eile

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119555269#Comment_119555269

Do you actually read any of the articles you put up, or do you just read the headline, get a hard on and make up the rest?

From your latest Article;

However, the State is flush with €27.5bn in cash from a frenzy of low-rate borrowing through the pandemic, when ECB policy pushed yields into negative territory, giving Government’s a chance to spend on Covid supports.

And the Government’s modest borrowing needs this year – the exchequer is on course for a €5bn surplus – mean the NTMA is spending down a €6.3bn chunk of its cash balance rather than relying on market funding.

With estimates for GDP growth this year at about 5pc and tax receipts growing by more than 25pc across the major headings, the cost of debt service is unlikely to become a headwind for the Government finances in the near future

fliball123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119556470#Comment_119556470

If you read what I said I said they have reported this as positive yet the borrowing of this money is costing us 7 times what it was costing in February.

Hfelloni

I’m assuming the 3% only comes into play if you’ve been civil servant since February 2022!

Pogue eile

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119556506#Comment_119556506

Ok, so you didnt actually understand the article, cant say im overly shocked.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119556206#Comment_119556206

100% agree. The Budget is on September 27th.

salonfire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119553821#Comment_119553821

Dublin aside, this is completely possible for a €320,000 house; €320,000 being the average house price.

Take a couple of mid-level PS employees both on €50,000, they could easily get a mortgage of around €300,000.

How is this not affordable?

This is worst case scenario because if we are to believe the posters here if one of the couple is private sector, and thus better paid, the house is even more affordable.

Augme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119556653#Comment_119556653

Given most Civil Service jobs are in Dublin, discounting Dublin from your analysis seems kinda flawed....

LegallyAbroad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119556653#Comment_119556653

So if two mid ranking civil servants pool their income together they can just about manage an average home nowhere near where they work?

salonfire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119558064#Comment_119558064

So what's your solution? Pay everyone in the entire country Dublin rates?

There should be a Dublin weighting for those whose workplace is there, similar to London.

Of course the unions don't want that because it removes their ability to use Dublin to drive up wage demands for the entire country.