HSE charge for admission

Maybe you didn't realise this what you meant 'fair' actually meant.

I don't understand that sentence.... but I gather you're now defining what I meant, for me ????

Just stop. You got your answer. You just didn't like it.

Take it or leave it - at this point I really dgaf.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248158#Comment_119248158

The charge wasn't meant to prevent people from actively seeking medical attention.

The charge was meant to encourage people to seek medical attention from their GP first, before attending overcrowed Accident & Emergencies with non emergencies.

I don't think that point can be made any clearer.

Like I said, if anyone objects to the charge or how its applied - stephen.donnelly@oireachtas.ie

Spanish Eyes

Never get sick on a weekend.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248291#Comment_119248291

I'll accept that.

Western Pomise

Wondering how long do you have to claim back on A+E visits?……..have been there twice in last 12 months,once with a possible broken toe that needed an x-ray and once with a cut on my hand from a kitchen knife accident.

Have VHI so €200 cost…..how long do you have to claim it back?

If I couldn’t find receipt from last years visit I presume a call to the Hospital should mean they could re-issue a receipt for same.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248412#Comment_119248412

You can claim back from Revenue over the last 4 years. Re from VHI... I've that very query into the company's VHI liaison. I've some family GP visits to claim. If/When I hear back from the VHI I'll update here (assuming nobody else updates in the mean time).

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248309#Comment_119248309

There are GP Out of Hours services for weekends.

Spanish Eyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248508#Comment_119248508

Turn on your tongue in cheek meter!

My mother waited 9 hours for a call out on a Sunday from DubDoc. That was a few years ago, I don't know if that has improved. Also, I think there is something about you having to be registered with a GP who is a member of the out of hours group to be seen, but don't quote me on that.

Anyway, weekends are difficult times to get sick. I know.....

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119249283#Comment_119249283

9 hours at home is bad, but better then 13 hours in A&E. The most I've ever waited for a TLC Doc callback is 2 hours.

I once spent a horrific 39 hours straight in an A&E department with my elderly mother while waiting for a bed so she could be admitted (pneumonia) and got shouted at by staff for leaving her side to go to the toilet or get something from the vending machine because they couldn't supervise her (she had dementia and wandered if I left).

I'd have to have my leg hanging off before I'd go to an A&E.

I had this experience when admitted by ambulance to St Vincent’s Hospital for a strangulated hernia with small bowel obstruction. I was extremely ill on admission and afforded a secluded room on my own owing to nature of vomiting. Subsequently underwent major abdominal surgery.

One of the first people to appear in my A&E room was an Admin person looking for VHI details, but I was too unwell to cooperate and get my details. The lure of a transfer to the private hospital was offered, and I really cared less at that moment. Subsequent to my surgery I ended up for the rest of my stay in the High Dependency Unit.

The day before my discharge the Admin returned again, having tried a second time during my stay but I was really too unwell to engage with her, and said I was being transferred to the Private Hospital to recuperate, which was a blatant untruth, and proffered me a pen to sign a paper. I was in discomfort, and quite weak, and thought it would be good to get a few days proper feeding & physio before returning to my apartment where I live alone. I signed, then was turned out next morning and that was it. They really do put the pressure on.

spuddy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248296#Comment_119248296

...which also has a high cost.

This was my point. The combination of high primary care costs, and the A&E fee, actively discourages people from seeking medical attention. For a wealthy European country this is well below par.

Mam1996

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119247616#Comment_119247616

If he was kept in A&E and not admitted to a ward the €100 is payable unfortunately, only if he required admission he would have been refunded. Always best to tell them to bill you rather than pay upfront in case of admission, refunds are always difficult!

He wouldn't have been covid tested unless he met the criteria, the guidance has changed now so not everyone gets tested unless they are flagged at the initial covid questionnaire.

standardg60

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119249903#Comment_119249903

I've two experiences of A&E, first time i broke my collarbone, arrived in agony to be met by a queue out the door (a Sunday), feck that will go up in the morning. Pain had eased significantly by then, so looked kind of normal. Informed admission my collarbone was broken, sat for five hours, went back to admission to discover i hadn't even been entered on the system, sat for another two hours.

Eventually went to triage..'i've broken my collarbone'. 'Well we'll let the doctors decide that'. Sat for another two hours before being x-rayed by a distinctly going through the motions radiographer. Minutes later he appears rather surprised 'yes it's broken alright, are you not in pain?' followed seconds later by a doctor asking the same question.

Second time i had a clearly dislocated finger, waited no more than forty minutes. Doctor asked 'When did this happen?'. 'Yesterday evening but i wasn't going to sit in a chair all night'. 'It's always the same, the people who don't need to attend show up but the ones who do don't'.

Your argument is all well and good in theory but in reality applying charges is the only way to discourage the worried well. If you're sick enough money is your last concern.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119250330#Comment_119250330

Not everybody gets charged, about 50% of the population. Anecdotally (at least) those just above the GP only card qualification avoid going to the doctor to prioritise other expenses (this ultimately has a cost… late diagnosis) perhaps a half cost GP card would be an idea for another income level.

BohsCeltic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119243413#Comment_119243413

I overheard someone mention it to another person on the Luas that if you say you are suicidal you get seen to straight away, I could smell alcohol off both. He said it in a way that he had done it before, saves you waiting all that time.

Selfish is you ask me

Some people have no problem spending hundreds on a new phone but have issues in spending it on their health.

They want someone else to pay for it!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119254317#Comment_119254317

And others pay thousands on health insurance, to make sure they have the best for their family.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119254363#Comment_119254363

But you stated earlier that you didn't want your son to use his health insurance and were annoyed he divulged he had insurance?

Why have health insurance but not use it?

Seems unreasonable that you'd rather let the taxpayer cover the cost of any tests, when insurance you've already paid for should cover them.

Might leave more in the budget for other areas where it's needed.

witchgirl26

In terms of claiming back some of the €100, I've done it for my son a couple of times for A&E visits and gotten 50% back from VHI. And before I get dragged down a route, yes he did need to go to A&E, no a GP couldn't have seen him & no I wasn't waiting for a referral to go up.

Anyway in terms of the €100, I think it's a fair enough charge to apply for those who attend but aren't admitted. The only reason it's waived if you're admitted is because if you've health insurance, they'll then charge them for the overnight etc. and if you don't, you're into the public health system and need to be kept in (which they only do if you really need to). My little boy is on my insurance & they billed any extra tests/scans needed to his health insurance once we were in. We weren't prioritised in A&E based on having the insurance or skipped up the queue for it but it was nice to know it was all covered & during a very stressful time, not have to worry about it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119249551#Comment_119249551

Just to note that St Vincent's is a Public Voluntary Hospital and pursuing it's own policy in maximising revenue as a private entity, something it has quite a negative reputation for at this stage.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119257222#Comment_119257222

The health insurance is there to pay for medical needs not covered by the public sector (why else go to the extra expense?). I pay taxes, plenty to cover the public services. I'll go further, by paying private health it partially relieves the public sector. You're welcome. So, again, no he shouldn't use his private health insurance in a public hospital if not admitted*. And, as far as I know, isn't obliged. He/I will have to pay €100 for it anyway.

Private health insurance for private health care. If you need further clarification do please let me know.

As I've said, I've paid plenty of taxes, more than average... and as mentioned above private health care helps relieve the reliance on the the public sector. So, no, I and other private health insurance purchasers ARE helping the public budget. AND if we do get admitted in the public sector we also contribute to that. Shur, do you want us to donate blood while we are at it?

*this will lead to higher private health insurance costs.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119259445#Comment_119259445

You could "partially relieve it" some more by not using your health insurance selectively - especially as via your insurer and Med1 you get most of it back.

Note your asterisk. So that's the real truth of it - it comes down to you not wanting to pay higher insurance costs, which is a more honest answer.

No need for me to thank you for anything. I pay my fair share of tax, same as you do. There is no "more than average".

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119259548#Comment_119259548

Statistics not your thing, fine. There’s no obligation for me to pay more than necessary. I’m okay with what I contribute in general.

Are you ever going to get over me calling your earlier response pissy?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119259630#Comment_119259630

You're the one who brought up what you contribute into the discussion, as if it was of any actual relevance.

And you are the only person who got pissy on this thread.

Just be glad your son is okay, and stop fussing about the lousy €100 when you'll get most of it back one way or the other.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119259959#Comment_119259959

Thanks for your concern.

Anonymous12

Sorry for hijacking thread:

I recently was referred from A&e Limerick to The Croom for an operation. I attended and was asked on admission did I have private health insurance. I said yes and gave my details not giving it another thought.

Fast forward weeks later and the cost of my surgery was declined by my health insurance as I’m not covered for the Croom (didn’t know that). I’m now liable for the costs (€thousands) whereas if I’d just said public patient on admission there’d be no charges. I’m sickened.

The accounts department don’t want to know.

Anything I can do or any advice?

Thanks.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119243536#Comment_119243536

MABS is available to deal with cases like that.

Usually they will identify unnecessary expenditure and suggest ways to cut them.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119249903#Comment_119249903

Who said we were a wealthy European country? At the end of 2021 - the last year statistics come to hand, but rest assured the national debt would be even higher now - the national debt stood at a whooping €237 billion. This equates to €47,233 for every person in the country and is one of the highest in the world. That despite all the free EU money and grants we got, and the unsustainable tax we get from multinationals laundering their foreign profits through Ireland.

I was in a European mainland country several years ago and had reason to go to the A+E there. I was seen promptly, and the cleanliness, excellent attention I received and general hospital made the chaotic Irish A+E system seem a bit like the third world. Not only that, but it was free abroad. Here I pay €100, as well as taxes and private health insurance. .

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120017670#Comment_120017670

You were in a vulnerable position. The hospital took advantage of it. Did you give the HI details in Croom or in A&E in Limerick.

It's standard practice by hospitals to ask for HI details that puts an onus on them to assertion whether you are covered for any treatment and inform you of any liability before treatment.

I would outline a reply as above and contact HIQA regarding it. You could actually go and pay a Solicitor to get them to send a reply as above.

I definitely would not be paying. If you were referred by A&E then they were not entitled to request same.

Anonymous12

Thanks for the advice Bass Reeves,

To close the story I had to write a letter to their accounts department explaining that I had been referred from UHL A&e. Ringing and talking on the phone got me no where. They eventually changed me from private to public, but that was solely for the hospital charge. I then had to chase the consultants secretary to get their bill changed too. A bit of a stressful situation but hopefully this thread can be of use to anyone that this happens to again.