Cold Case Review of Sophie Tuscan du Plantier murder to proceed. **Threadbans in OP**

flanna01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120034156#Comment_120034156

You misunderstood the post. I was referring to the 'professional hit' angle towards the murder...

If it was a paid killing - The hired assassin was a buffoon of the highest order!

I really doubt too many people would have questioned a French national walking along the cliffs of Cork, slipped and falling into the sea... Today's news, tomorrows chip wrappers so to speak...

Instead of a low key killing, one that may have gone by relatively unnoticed by the general public, as very few would have known her, your man creates a bloodbath that drawn the worlds media to the location...

Nah... Don't buy it!

I truly believe if the murderer was local, somebody else has to know. Bearing in mind there was no murder in the locality of this barbaric nature, before or since... You have to accept the murderer (if local) would have been tormented by his actions, and the probable life sentence awaiting them... They could not hide it mentally, and certainly not from their next of kin, be that family, friends or workmates.

A random traveller through the village would be a different story.

robwen

Sophie cold case: gardaí issue requests to speak with at least 20 witnesses

From male DNA gathered from Sophie's shoe, to a mystery sighting, gardaí are not short of leads, writes Maeve Sheehan

GARDAÍ have issued official requests via government agencies and Interpol to speak to at least 20 witnesses in France and the UK, who are thought to have information that could help the cold-case review of the murder of Sophie Toscan du Plantier.

There is one new potential witness in the UK who has not spoken to gardaí before. The woman has known Ian Bailey for many years.

Although Mr Bailey, an English-born former journalist, was the prime suspect in the 1996 murder of Ms Toscan du Plantier, the woman was never interviewed about him.

It is understood the Garda's request to interview the woman was conveyed via Interpol to police in the UK.

The investigation team has also issued requests through Irish, French and international agencies to interview a new suspect identified last year by Marie Farrell, a former shopkeeper in Schull, west Cork.

Ms Farrell originally told gardaí she saw a man outside her shop in a black beret and long dark coat watching Ms Toscan du Plantier - and later saw him close to the crime scene.

She first identified that man as Ian Bailey, but then retracted her information, claiming she was under pressure to identify him by gardaí. Last year she told gardaí she can now identify the man as an associate of Ms Toscan du Plantier's late husband Daniel.

The body of Ms Toscan du Plantier, a 39-year-old television producer, was found outside her remote holiday cottage near Schull two days before Christmas in 1996. She had been beaten to death. Her murder remains unsolved.

In July, following a period of intense scrutiny of the case, gardaí announced their cold-case review. Ian Bailey has always protested his innocence.

Garda Superintendent Joe Moore, who is leading the investigation at Bantry garda station, declined to comment on specific witnesses whom detectives want to speak to.

However, he said all new developments in the case will be fully examined.

"Friends and acquaintances in France will certainly be spoken to again,” he said.

He also confirmed that gardaí have submitted to the DPP the details of witnesses in other jurisdictions - as required by mutual assistance legislation. The request, if approved, is forwarded by the Department of Justice to the relevant ministry in other jurisdictions.

However, gardaí are also issuing requests via Interpol to informally speak to witnesses.

Despite the international dimension to the investigation, gardaí believe there is still more evidence to uncover in west Cork about the murder of Ms Toscan du Plantier.

Supt Moore said the investigation review starts with the crime scene at Toormore, outside Schull.

"We are starting from the ground up. We are satisfied that there is still information on the Mizen Peninsula in relation to this case,” he said.

"Somebody came there, and for some reason Sophie interacted with that person outside the house. There is no evidence of a crime occurring within the house. The crime occurred outside.”

He reissued an appeal for information about Ms Toscan du Plantier's movements between 4.30pm on Sunday, December 22, and Monday morning, December 23, when her body was found by a neighbour.

"After 26 years, no one should have any fear at this point about speaking to the gardaí,” he said, urging anyone with information to come forward.

"The serious crime review team looks at everything that has been done in relation to the case - every job that has been given out, every result that came back in, every statement that was taken, every report.

"There are many thousands of documents in an investigation like this.

"As regards the new team coming in, they can come in with a completely open mind. We are keeping an open view on this case.”

Gardaí last week searched the property where Ms Toscan du Plantier was killed to map the crime scene and re-examine the area.

Meanwhile, a mystery male DNA profile found on Ms Toscan du Plantier's lace-up boot is being sent for fresh forensic analysis in the hope that technological advances may help identify it.

The DNA was revealed by French forensic scientists who re-examined samples taken from 134 exhibits in 2011. The male genetic profile has never been identified.

A small number of unidentified fingerprints found in Ms Toscan du Plantier's house will also be examined again. A statement from a garda technical expert in 1997 said the "many fingerprints” identified in the house belonged to the housekeeper and members of her family - but "a few” fingerprints could not be identified.

French witnesses expected to be approached include a friend of Ms Toscan du Plantier who says the Frenchwoman told her about a "strange” man in Schull who wanted to meet her to discuss a poetry project.

Agnes Thomas said she spoke to Ms Toscan du Plantier by phone on what turned out to be the last day of her trip to Ireland. She was never interviewed by gardaí because she recalled the conversation many years later. However, she testified against Ian Bailey at the trial in absentia in France in 2019 that found him guilty of murdering Ms Toscan du Plantier.

Ms Thomas's account echoes the account of a French film producer, Guy Girard, who said his friend and colleague Ms Toscan du Plantier mentioned an Eoin Bailey who was a "writer in Ireland”. Mr Girard made a statement to gardaí in 1999.

Ian Bailey has insisted that he never met Sophie, never spoke to her, and saw her only once when a neighbour pointed her out to him. He was twice arrested but never charged in Ireland in relation to her death.

The investigation team will also revisit alleged sightings of a "Frenchman” with a scratch on his nose in a pub in Kerry days after Ms Toscan du Plantier was murdered.

A garda in Cahirsiveen, Co Kerry, made a statement soon after Ms Toscan du Plantier's murder, saying he was approached by a local bar owner on December 30, 1996.

"He said a Frenchman had left his pub and he had a scratch on his face. He was travelling in a Ford Fiesta,” said John Sugrue, a garda working at the time. 

At 3pm that afternoon, Mr Sugrue stopped a black Ford Fiesta. The man driving the car had a mark on his face. He gave his name, said he was from Mexico and an advertising producer. Mr Sugrue traced the registration of the car to a woman in Cork.

There is no statement on file from the bar owner or the advertising producer from Mexico. Asked about the witness statement, Supt Moore said: "It is something we have to look at.”

Ms Farrell was not the only witness who saw a man in a black beret and long coat outside her shop before Ms Toscan du Plantier was murdered.

Dan Griffin, a retired publican in Schull, who has since died, also identified a man in a long coat wearing a beret in his first statements to gardaí. In a subsequent statement he identified this man as being Ian Bailey, and said his "black beret” may actually have been his "very black and heavy hair”.

Ms Farrell's credibility has been severely questioned, both in the High Court and by gardaí. She was investigated for perjury but not prosecuted.

John O'Driscoll, the assistant commissioner who approved the cold case review before his retirement, told the Sunday Independent last year that Ms Farrell's new witness statement was a factor in his decision. "Whatever about the credibility of the witness, we now have a person named as a potential person of interest. It is very important that that would be pursued and brought to an appropriate conclusion,” he said.

Anyone with information can contact Bantry garda station on 027-20860 or the Garda Confidential line 1800-666-111

Irish independent

Samsgirl

I blame Jessica Fletcher. She has a holiday home in schull.

EdHoven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120034522#Comment_120034522

How do you know the incident that freaked Sophie out at Three Castles Head wasn't the "White Lady" but someone trying to push her into the sea?

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120033985#Comment_120033985

Who is this pub owner Dan Griffin who saw Sophie with a 'mystery man' on the day of her murder..?????

You see this here is typical of the rubbish you read around here about this case.

From the article below Dan Griffin never saw Sophie with a "mystery man".

What he did claim to see was a man with a long coat and a black beret, which he also thought might have been a black head of hair rather than any beret.

There is no reference to this person ever being seen in the company of Sophie as you imply, only that they were seen in the town.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120034939#Comment_120034939

Esel

Land dispute. Who would be Bull McCabe in that scenario?

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120036229#Comment_120036229

Nobody cos it didn't happen

EdHoven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120035346#Comment_120035346

"What’s interesting is a second witness also contacted the guards separately in January 1997 mentioning a blue fiesta.The man claims he was working at a petrol station in Skibbereen, West Cork, on December 20 1996 and saw Sophie in the car with a mystery man. The sighting occurred just hours after she flew in to Ireland on December 20" Ignoring this witness, of course.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120037462#Comment_120037462

I believe that it was established that that was not actually a sighting of Sophie but someone else.

Apparently the colour of the car was incorrect.

It was mentioned a few weeks back on this thread I believe.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120035110#Comment_120035110

Angela Lansbury dead, Jessica lives on and on.

saabsaab

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120037549#Comment_120037549

I don't think it was established at all. The colour was different but people can often confuse these colours at times depending on light conditions and memory. Grey, green blue?

chicorytip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120030669#Comment_120030669

You think he may have attempted to destroy evidence linking him to the crime? Could he have managed that without being observed - in broad daylight? Once Shirley Henderson had raised the alarm the first arrivals at the scene would have been the Gardai, I presume, and not Bailey.

Rows Grower

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038396#Comment_120038396

He was one of the first people at the scene after the murder, he didn't attempt to destroy evidence but his presence at the murder scene did make some evidence gathered afterwards useless as regards securing a prosecution.

He told one press photographer that he (Bailey) had taken pictures at the murder scene at 11am on December 23rd. He told another that he had been at the scene before the area that was preserved was extended at 12pm that day.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038619#Comment_120038619

What evidence that was gathered was deemed useless?

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038619#Comment_120038619

So he went to the scene to contaminate it, and still managed to leave no trace?

Edit; I wonder what happened to the photos he took at 11am?

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120036229#Comment_120036229

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120036263#Comment_120036263

So ownership of the shed caused no issues between Alfie and Sophie, and Alfie and the Hellens had no boundary problems?

Everyone got on with everyone and popped round for cups of tea? I don't think so. Sophie was as welcome as a fart in a spacesuit.(Hellens aside).

Leo Bolger wanted more land for his horses and approached Sophie with a view to buying some, she owned about 15 acres spotted around the area, but she refused, so he had his horses on Alfie's land. However she allowed the Hellens use some of her land for free for their horses. ( Although that could have been a commonage they shared). So the way I see it, you've got Sophie and the Hellens on one side, and Alfie and Loe Bolger on the other, I also read on another forum that Finbarr Hellen installed the gates that cut off the access to Alfie's shed and field. Hardly the peaceful getaway that Sophie thought she was buying into.

Rows Grower

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038729#Comment_120038729

The discussion has clearly gone above your realm of understanding.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038823#Comment_120038823

You need to think it through a bit more, Rosie.

Rows Grower

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038892#Comment_120038892

Maybe you need to stop overthinking things and just read the facts again.

You can have your own opinion, but you can't have your own facts.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038941#Comment_120038941

In your words "ookeydookey" or whatever.

EdHoven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120038791#Comment_120038791

I noticed looking at the original scene of crime photos there is a green mail box on the gatepost. Now it cannot be Alfie's as his diligent postman drove up, even at 6.30 p.m. on Sundays. So presumably it was Sophie who put it there, to emphasize the gate should be kept closed.

flanna01

*Anybody else aware of this...?? Seen it on another thread?

"Officers have been accused of not pursuing other lines of inquiry. A German man, who was having an affair with Sophie, was named in a 2001 DPP report.

Holy ****! I didn't know the German musician knew Sophie let alone was having an affair with her. Is this affair documented?

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120040171#Comment_120040171

Is there a need for every aspect of her private life to be documented?

flanna01

Different angle to murder theory:

Alfie Lyons and Leo Bolger.

there are reports that Sophie did not enjoy a great relationship with the neighbours; that her home had been entered and the bath used whilst she was away; that Lyons has permitted Leo Bolger to grow cannabis on his land and that she had reported some things to the police? After she had changed for bed did she realise that someone else had been in the house again? Was the book of poems left open at the page about death in order to spook her? An expensive bottle of wine was also possibly stolen. Did she put on her boots and go out to challenge the neighbour? did she threaten to expose their cannabis production? Was she chased by two doped up men who decided to silence her. The discovery of the body next morning with the abandoned car seems slightly staged. It would be pretty obvious that she was the likely victim, but Alfie Lyons gave a story about going to her house to warn her that there was a body in the driveway. the house is very remote and the neighbours were the only people in the vicinity. bolger was later convicted of being a major player in cannabis production with £150k worth of plants and he grazed horses on her land immediately adjacent to where she was found. There was no sexual motive. This seems more plausible that a local nutter getting up in the early hours and hiking three miles across rough terrain, in order to knock on the door of a middle aged french woman and ask for a shag.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120040203#Comment_120040203

So the book of poems that is assumed she was reading was instead left there as a warning, and only spotted by her on Sunday night when she was going to bed ?

What abandoned car ?

She was chased by two doped up men, I thought stoners were more relaxed than that.

Now I know 39 and 39 totals 78 and 78 is a decent age to live to, but you'd be hard pressed to find anyone calling someone aged 39 "middle aged" as you did.

saabsaab

I often think that more than one person could be responsible? I mean many injuries and then a concrete block was one chasing her and another came in and finished it?

chicorytip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120039879#Comment_120039879

No, I think it belonged to Alfie and Shirley and had her name emblazoned on it. There may have three postboxes - one for each household - which might not be apparent in the photos you mention.

flanna01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120040289#Comment_120040289

It was a quote - Not my composed by my fair hand....

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120041245#Comment_120041245

But you posted it here so I'd expect you to be able to articulate further on it.

kirk.

Poor Alfie I hope the gardai are up to speed on all his shenanigans

Murderous drug baron and he got away with it all