Cattle trailer

mr.stonewall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752672#Comment_120752672

That's into the territory of air brakes and commercial spec. Expecting a jeep or van to stop that weight is unreal. Being overloaded in an accident is a no no,insurance won't stand over it. Could be the quickest way you have to sell a few acres.

The way I see it going is the cattle boxes are going to be smaller long term with the max size being a 12x6. This kinda pushes the limit with 3-4 finished cattle.

It would be interesting to have a poll here and see how many have a BE licence

Jb1989

How does the Americans get away regarding insurance and what not, when you see their big jeeps and goose neck trailers.

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752783#Comment_120752783

I'd say most lads have the licence now. Alot of lads at my local mart use the tractor now to pull the box just to get around the law. You will always see the same few lads with the 14 foot and land cruiser.

Tonynewholland

There's not a lot of new tri axel trailers being sold these days for a reason. Go near a motorway with one and your just asking to be pulled over. Likewise pulling a 3 ton excavator with a jeep it's just looking for trouble

mr.stonewall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752803#Comment_120752803

They have electric servo in the brakes and the size of the brakes are the equivalent of a larger slurry tank. The wagon up front is closer to a lorry than a land cruiser. The goose necks must be nice to tow as the weight is above the axle

mr.stonewall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752894#Comment_120752894

It would surprise you. I did the test a few years ago and very little of the locals had it. They only had it if they were over 60 or had the truck licence.

emaherx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752783#Comment_120752783

No BE license here, probably should do the test at some stage, but I sold the jeep and the jeep cattle trailer so no need at the moment. Far more useful in my setup to have a larger tractor trailer. Bought a small single axle general purpose trailer that can pulled by the car for collecting bulky items, but it's actually spends more time on back of 135 for going around the fields fencing.

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752917#Comment_120752917

I'd think most of the new jeep trailers sold are tri axle tbh. A certain amount of new 12x6 trailers are specced tri axle especially Ivor Williams in recent year's. A 14 foot tri axle has become the standard new trailer around here anyway in the last decade.

It's rare to see a new 10 foot trailer tbh, a new 8x5 is more common for lads pulling it with a car or small van. If a lad has a jeep then he's more likely to go for a 12 or 14 foot as he'll have the extra capacity when it's needed.

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752937#Comment_120752937

I'd agree that a lot of younger lads wouldn't have it, if they do it's as likely they have an artic license as that they went and sat the BE test. The only reason the older crowd have it in a lot of cases is that they qualified by having a license before a certain date or were given the artic category at the time.

My mother had a rigid license despite the fact she never sat in a lorry never mind drove one and gets enough of it to drive a petrol hatchback. I had to sit a test and all that went with it to gain both a BE and a rigid license.

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752917#Comment_120752917

Most builders aren't going over the 2.7 tonne digger now for behind jeeps.

zetor 4911

Is there such a thing as a 12ft 3 axle cattle trailer would make more sense as the extra 2 foot isn't needed because of weight restrictions.

Hard Knocks

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120753771#Comment_120753771

They are available

Jb1989

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120753771#Comment_120753771

Yes. A tuffmac locally here that I borrow occasionally anyway

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120754268#Comment_120754268

Do not speak about Tuffmac they are nearly overweight before you put an animal into them.

I think the 10X6 is nearly 400kgs heavier than an IW

Jb1989

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120754419#Comment_120754419

There you are 👍🏽

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120753771#Comment_120753771

Yes most manufacturers offer them as a extra over a standard double axle in a 12 foot. Conversely you could also buy a double axle 14 foot but they were never very popular and I'd imagine would be fairly unstable when loaded due to the large overhang both front and back with 1 less axle present.

I recently saw a double axle 14 foot demountable type Ivor Williams with the small 12 or 13 inch wheels underneath the body. I wouldn't fancy towing it with much less than a Sherman tank tbh, looked like something that would be on it's roof without extreme care on the part of the driver.

Tonynewholland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120753256#Comment_120753256

Even with 2.7 plus a few buckets and trailer mostly pulled by a land cruiser. Still well over weight

Markus Antonius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120752503#Comment_120752503

I haven't bought one yet so it's not too late. I had a look at those Bridgeway trailers and the minimum is 16x7 which is too big for me. I would happily go for a simpler trailer that would go straight on the pick-up hitch though.

I doubt a 390 would have any issue with a jeep trailer on the 3 point hitch, it's mostly supporting it's own weight.

emaherx

You still need to pull and stop the load and there is nothing stopping the arms of the tractor raising if weight shifts to the back of the trailer.

Your insurance could be an issue in the case of an accident as it isn't a proper hitch, there is a reason the manufacturer states for off road use only.

I presume you need to reach under your tractor to change to a drawbar. I've had a few 300/600 series MFs some were fitted with a hitch that has a clevis adapter that can be fitted in seconds without reaching under the tractor.

I see a few for sale on Donedeal, without the clevis adapter, but I still have an adapter here I don't need.

https://www.donedeal.ie/tractors-for-sale/massey-ferguson-pick-up-hitch/34368663

emaherx

This is the extended type hitch and adapter stored on a pin at back axel beside right wheel. It would be safer, quicker and easier than a 3 point frame.

agriman27

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120753771#Comment_120753771

I have a 12’ Hudson tri axle cattle trailer bought new in 2007

funkey_monkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120753771#Comment_120753771

You can get an Ifor Williams 12x6 with the underslung wheels (DP120) in a triaxle format as well as the TA510 - although I've never seen a TA510 with three axles. Personally, I don't think a 12ft needs 3 of the big axles with outside wheels.

All the options are shown in back of their brochure:

https://www.iwt.co.uk/products/livestock/ta510/?tab=brochures#tab

Falcon Trailers do a number of options on wheels and axles for 12ft trailers. They seem to be a nice trailer from what I've seen of them. They are on Facebook, but can't give a link to them here.

funkey_monkey

Bateson trailers - which I've always thought was a cheap looking trailer have got a really well thought out new one now. Really like their deck system and how the frame of the gates are used to support the deck. I'm expecting that the pin is able to support the weight easily. Nice feature too that you close that back door on then rather than having to push the deck gates up.

https://youtu.be/pqitOf1SyIk?si=K9nfw5SsFPIvBNDU

£9800+vat is possibly a bit steep in comparison to IW & Nugent though given resale value of the brand.

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121033941#Comment_121033941

It all looks a bit flimsy to me especially the dividing gates and latches ect. It would probably be ok for light/occasional use but I'd say the decks, dividing gates ect wouldn’t be long getting warped with heavy loads of sheep and cattle.

The issue with split dividing gates is that when you cut a gate frame you always weaken it and there's opportunity for it to deflect and bend when placed under pressure. In the video it looks like the back door you mentioned has to be lifted slightly by the operator to allow it to latch correctly. That doesn't inspire my confidence of build quality and tolerances in what appears to be a brand new unused trailer. Also there's lots of gaps in the dividing gate frames and other framework that look like a trap for animals legs. The internal hinges and latches don't look capable of standing up to hardship either imo and I'd be expecting them to fail sooner rather than later.

Personally I think there's better alternatives on the market but I've never seen that model in the flesh.

Grueller

If its flimsy you're afraid of lads avoid the modern iw trailer anyhow. They are well finished but jaysus a friend has a 3 year old one since new, that has little done and there's not a tight rivet left in it. I have a tuffmac this 5 years, it's a pig of a yoke, poorly finished and not near as nice towed as the ifor but it stands up to abuse at a fraction of the cost.

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121035311#Comment_121035311

The problem is towing capacity. A good few lads seem to have got rid of the Tuffmac as they are too heavy to pull. Anything that is too solid weights too much.

I think an 8*5 Tuffmac is around 1500 kgs compared to 800ish for an IW. I used to see a few dealers with them who were on the road all the time and have moved away from them

funkey_monkey

@Albert Johnson - I kind of hinted at that by referencing the pin used to hold it all closed. I would have preferred at least two snibs for the dividing gates. I think the bottom split door should fill in more as you say.

I still think it's a decent alternative. It's different and there is some thought put into it with some nice features like the front area and the more pointed 'aero' style. Roof storage with ladder built into back door. It's too close in price to the main players though. They never really took off here.

Not sure what you mean by having to lift the rear door though.

We have an IW TA5 that you can't open the dividing door without taking off the bar above the rear door. How that got by the designers is a mystery. Also used an IW with deck that you can't store all the cross members as there is a lynch pin bolt head fouling the storage area.

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121035311#Comment_121035311

Ivor Williams are the nicest sheep trailer on the market imo excluding anything with a full lifting deck but that's a totally different price point. The IW deck system is the most user friendly, isn't cumbersome like some of the competitor and quick and easy to fold up and down. As a sheep trailer there a good all rounder and built for purpose.

I don't rate them for cattle work as there too light and the design of the loading/dividing gates aren't strong enough for big cattle. The hinges and catches on the dividing gates in particular are just a stupid design that's always going to give bother and isn't user friendly. You see lads putting chains on them to stop then opening when under pressure and I'd reckon you could design a better system with a Meccano set. Between those things and pop riveting instead of bolting everything together I wouldn't be buying one for cattle work.

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121035523#Comment_121035523

The pins (I don't think you could call them a bolt) holding the dividing gates closed are like something you'd see on the door of a garden shed. I wouldn't fancy there chances of holding back a couple of big suckler cow's or beef cattle.

As for the storage area in the triangle at the front I don't see the advantage tbh. Firstly unless that area is raised there's going to be a pool of shite flowing up to the front of the trailer when fully loaded. Secondly unless the division between it and the rest of the trailer is well secured I could see it being bent forward when you have to brake in an emergency when fully loaded with cattle. If it's aero dynamics you're after then triangular wind deflectors used to be common on older trailers. As for the roof storage anything you'd put on it would be swept off by branches and bushes that are almost meeting from opposite sides of the regional roads around here.

By lifting the rear gate I meant in the video when the rear door/gate inside the loading gates is being closed it appears that the fella demonstrating has to lift the gate slightly to get the pin to engage. It's only a brief thing and hard to see in the video but it looks like he lifts it to me anyway. When you'd have 5 good cattle (don't tell the RSA or VOSA) pushing against it for an extended period it's not going to get any easier to close either.

Grueller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121035554#Comment_121035554

That's all probably true but I don't have sheep so can't comment. I agree they are too light for cattle.

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121035649#Comment_121035649

I no longer keep the white vermin either and I run a Porter which I'm very happy with. I wouldn't buy an IW for cattle work and I don't see why other lad's do. There's far better alternatives available for equal cost. Tuffmac sell a world of trailers as do Nugent and both are a decent cattle trailer.

patsy_mccabe

I got stopped by the Guards and RSA while going into Limerick a few months back. I was towing an old Ifor Williams 12 x 5'10". No steel plate on the floor, no proper licence, no brakes, no break away cable. I did have a chain on it. I was repairing the trailer at the time and going in to get some new timbers for the floor.

The guard swung off the 4 wheels. One was loose on the leaf-spring. My only saving grace was that the trailer was empty, so technically, I was not breaking any laws. He made me turn around and go home.

I've heard that they stopped guys coming out of Ennis Mart and made them pull the hand-brake and drive forward to check that the breaks were working.

hopeso

This looks tidy enough.....

https://www.donedeal.ie/cattletrailers-for-sale/livestock-trailer/34166776

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121082860#Comment_121082860

I wonder has it any certification. Somebody has handed a IW aluminium sides and top onto a trailer chassis.

Silverdream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121036424#Comment_121036424

I was at Ennis mart today, I did a camel trek in from west clare with a tractor and trailer, took me over an hour and had a tailback of cars after me along the Kilrush road at one stage, pure nightmare with no place to pull in, lads passing on the bends and on the continuous white line, I had a lorry nearly run into the back of me at one stage!!

Arrived at the mart and saw plenty lads pulling Ifvor Williams trailers with vw passats and Berlingos.

patsy_mccabe

Houghton-Parkhouse T35 14' Cattle trailer - € 23,000 plus VAT. Never heard of the make before. Pricey but seems well built. (Would want to be, says you !!!!!!!!!

Houghton Parkhouse Livestock Trailer for sale in Co. Cork for €23,000 on DoneDeal

Tonynewholland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121150863#Comment_121150863

Twice the price of other makes

anthony500_1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121150863#Comment_121150863

Wonder what's the unlaiden weight of the trailer. It looks a heavy pig of a yoke before you would ever put anything inside it. It certainly looks a fine trailer but as tonynewhollsnd said easily twice the price of the competitors version.

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121151081#Comment_121151081

I be wondering about the unladen weight as well. It is rated at 3.5T. It might only have a payload of half that.

Dose not look to be a lot of ventilation either. The half door at the front is a lethal Idea

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121150863#Comment_121150863

There an English company and make premium spec lorry bodies, the trailers are more of a side business given the price but are supposed to be the Rolls Royce of livestock trailers. They offer a lifting deck option on the trailers the same as what would be on a lorry body, a serious job compared to a standard ramp system but obviously more expensive. I know one man from Meath that buys store lambs around here that bought one in recent year's. It's a pleasure to load sheep on it as you just run them in on the lowered deck and lift it up then with the press of a button.

That's only a standard cattle trailer so I struggle to see what advantage it has over the competitors given that it would be double the price of any of them. It's a mind boggling price imo and I'd be afraid to ask what the equivalent trailer with a lifting deck would cost.

hopeso

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121151126#Comment_121151126

Is the loading ramp raised and lowered electronically on them too? Just when I saw the two switches behind the flap in one of the photos, and there's no visible springs

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152441#Comment_121152441

The one I've seen in the flesh the ramp is manually operated but you could be right about the one in the add. I was wondering what the switches were for and it's an arm as opposed to a spring attached to the ramp. The higher spec lorry bodies usually have an automated ramp so that could be a carry over on the trailers too. I've often wished that I had an internal light in my trailer for night work and I wouldn't be surprised if one of the switches was for a light.

hopeso

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152640#Comment_121152640

It should be easy enough to put a light into your trailer. All Ifor Williams have an internal light. The power is just taken from the wire feeding the tail lights, with a switch to operate the internal light. It means you can't have the internal light on without having the tail lights on, but that shouldn't be an issue in most cases...

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152845#Comment_121152845

I'm not much of a DIYer but I got a lad to put all new lights on a flat trailer during the summer and he seemed to make a right job of it. I was thinking of leaving the cattle trailer to him at some to service the brakes and put an internal light in it but it's in use a few times a week especially from now till Xmas. I've been threatening to order a new 14 foot Porter the last few years but I don't know if my current Dmax would be up to pulling it tbh. I'm not overly impressed with the power of it compared to my previous jeep.

Conversations 3

I pull one of these with a 3 ltr Dmax no bother. It's an older model.

Albert Johnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153598#Comment_121153598

I've a 161 2.5 litre one and I don't rate it that highly on pulling power. I'm assuming you have the older 3 litre version which had lots of power. I'd a 2.5 litre Ford Ranger and I thought it far more powerful. I wonder could I get my jeep chipped or what's the story? All I know is that the full of my current 12 foot trailer seems lots behind it when loaded without going for a bigger trailer.

funkey_monkey

Does anyone here have an IW with the wheels underneath? If so, you you take a look at it and see if it is stamped anywhere for 25mph max?

Seen it mentioned on TFF, but never noticed it on one.

Edit: Should have Google it first:

mr.stonewall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121155869#Comment_121155869

Mate had one, I nearly bought one, he flipped it and said they were too giddy. That's where it ended for me luckily

funkey_monkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121155985#Comment_121155985

Was looking at getting a used 12' triaxle one. Your have nearly the equivalent floor space of the 14' with wheels outside but a shorter body.

Would haul it with tractor mostly but able to use with Jeep too. The roads here are narrow enough that the 6" narrower width would be a good idea.

If you don't have them fully loaded they can swing a bit - even with internal gate as the load is nose heavy. Wheels outside have a lower centre of gravity, but I think not have the load directly over the wheels is the bigger difference.

mr.stonewall

It's very simple the centre of gravity is just higher. Imagine getting a shoulder with your 2 feet planted beside each other. Imagine getting the same with shoulder with your feet spread about 2ft apart., it's just some difference.

If it's sole use is tractor work on a solid paved surface or concrete, you would be fine. Different when it loaded or half loaded and tipping along at 40mph.