Ireland running out of accommodation for Ukrainian refugees due to surge in non-Ukrainian refugees?

Strazdas · 05-02-2023 2:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204718#Comment_120204718

Problem with these protests is that they are often organised by the far right. A message appears all over social media saying "there will be a protest march in such and such a place on Thursday at 7pm" and ordinary people from the area do come along. What they don't realise though is that it was the far right groups who set up the march and heavily publicised it across all channels.

As a strategy, it is very clever...make it look like all the protests are organic and coming from the ground up, just 'ordinary concerned citizens' and people not realising there are shady and sinister characters with ulterior motives behind the scenes pulling all the strings.

.Donegal. · 05-02-2023 2:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204755#Comment_120204755

Losing bad you've really run out of things to say now. I’m expecting your next post to say you’re going to tell your mammy on me. Jesus Christ

DebDynamite · 05-02-2023 2:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204753#Comment_120204753

But who are you, or anyone, to say that all the protesters at the various protests are being manipulated into not agreeing with the current asylum system. They can see with their own eyes that not only is it not benefiting Ireland in any way, it’s putting enormous stress our services and resources.

In fact, I would wonder why anyone with any sense, who cares about the wellbeing of the country does support it.

Boggles · 05-02-2023 2:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204812#Comment_120204812

You are trying to conflate people who want sensible policy with racist Helen whipping up the local unemployable brigade via lies on Facebook.

People with legitimate concerns don't want anything to do with that level of feral scum or what they stand for.

olestoepoke · 05-02-2023 2:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204211#Comment_120204211

Are you implying that the protesters are weak minded? Maybe they need re education or counselling like the US swimming team.

realdanbreen · 05-02-2023 3:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204587#Comment_120204587

Hear hear. And we wondered how an asshole like trump got elected. Well we have our own home grown knobs here who are doing their best to overturn our democracy. Every one of 100 odd posts to their name gobshytes on here need to be called out for what they are ,Xenophobic racists!

DebDynamite · 05-02-2023 3:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204767#Comment_120204767

But where is the manipulation coming into it? People have formed their own opinion from what they can see with their own eyes, and that opinion is that this is not good for the country. They are angry. Angry first of all at what is happening with no benefit in return to the country, and angry secondly that their genuine concerns are not being listened to. Their concerns are being shut down. They're being smeared, patronised, gaslighted, and given no legitimate reason by anyone involved why they should support the current system. That's why they might attend a protest - because they have no voice.

I have heard of a few of these extreme nuts actually being asked not to unfurl banners or to not associate themselves with that particular protest, as even a lot of the protesters find these guys unpalatable and want nothing to do with them. Of course they also know one sighting of them amongst a large number of just concerned citizens will instantly turn it into a "far right" protest in the media 🙄

DebDynamite · 05-02-2023 3:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204305#Comment_120204305

It seems you have two options:

Deport yourself voluntarily. We will pay for flights, given you a nice little amount to get settled when you return home, whether that be to go into education or start your own business. Once you do return home, you’re welcome to come back at any stage to begin the asylum process again.
Stick it out. You may as well as all your living needs will be paid for anyway. There’ll probably be another amnesty along in a few years, or you’ll get leave to remain on humanitarian grounds. We don’t tend to do forced deportations here anyway.

https://www.irishimmigration.ie/my-situation-has-changed-since-i-arrived-in-ireland/voluntary-returns/

In addition, a small reintegration grant is available to all returnees to help cover the costs of an income generating activity, such as education; professional training and/or business set-up.

^^ Yep, that’s right. Once you’ve voluntarily removed yourself from the country as your application wasn’t deemed worthy of being granted asylum, we’ll give you a nice little amount of money to get resettled in your OWN COUNTRY 🙄 It really is win/win either way.

Jinglejangle69 · 05-02-2023 3:23pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204767#Comment_120204767

I don’t think people care at this stage.

They know what they believe in so the bogeyman of the far right won’t deter them.

05-02-2023 3:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204870#Comment_120204870

I think a mass of people all using the same lines are weak minded

mykrodot · 05-02-2023 3:43pm

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11715127/Rishi-Sunak-prepares-quit-human-rights-convention-amid-warning-65-000-Channel-migrants-2023.html

UK preparing to quit Human Rights Convention amid warnings of 65K migrants crossing the channel this year! They are not wrong. A little bit too late but better late than never. Can we please do the same here?

Boggles · 05-02-2023 3:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204905#Comment_120204905

Of course they also know one sighting of them amongst a large number of just concerned citizens will instantly turn it into a "far right" protest in the media

What do you mean sighting of them? They are the main organisers and speakers in the vast majority of them. The small crowds are cheering them on. 😂

Thugs, criminals, abusers, terrorists and all round feral scum.

Now there has been a couple of protests I have seen not organised by these dregs, which have been perfectly reasonable if not slightly alarmist. Not one death threat made to anyone. 🤷‍♀️

Strazdas · 05-02-2023 3:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204905#Comment_120204905

It does beg the question as to how spontaneous and organic these protest marches are. Are the marches happening because of genuine anger across the country or because the far right groups and parties (and supporters) are very clever at pulling strings and using social media to push their views?

If there was genuine anger and concern across the nation about refugees and asylum laws, you expect attendance at these protests to be much, much higher, not just 200 people at a time.

05-02-2023 3:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205030#Comment_120205030

A mix of both

MrMusician18 · 05-02-2023 3:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204767#Comment_120204767

That was true of the water charges protests - largely initially a far left movement. The same with divorce and repeal. No outcry over that.

What you are witnessing is elements of radical position becoming mainstream. Why is this happening? Because the problem has been ignored or suppressed for 20 years and the ability for communities to adapt has now reached its limit.

The counter strategy here is the tried and tested one. Discredit all those protesting as being far right easily led morons. Led by by the nose by extremists. We've seen it in all the papers today.

But that is just for one side. During the water charges protests there was no such tarring of the protesters as communists - despite leaders of that movement openly espousing for the confiscation and nationalising of the means of production.

Strazdas · 05-02-2023 4:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205061#Comment_120205061

I would still suggest there is an upper ceiling to the level of support for these protests and groups. They may not want to hear it but there is far more concern across the nation about the housing crisis, the health service problems, the cost of living crisis etc....people are not going to get as agitated about things like refugee centres when perhaps 99% of the population don't even live near one.

Boggles · 05-02-2023 4:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205061#Comment_120205061

The counter strategy here is the tried and tested one. Discredit all those protesting as being far right easily led morons. Led by by the nose by extremists. We've seen it in all the papers today.

If you are protesting a phantom rapist or turning up at a school because racist Helen saw some cleaners you are probably at best dangerously stupid. If you are encouraging the burning down of buildings because of hearsay on Whatsapp, then you are stupid a fúckwit. They are just facts.

That's not not medias fault or counter strategy, that's easily led morons who lack the ability of critical thought or because it suits their racist outlook.

When these same people are cheering on the feral scum that organise and speak at these "protests", I'm sorry they no longer deserve the benefit of the doubt.

bertieinexile · 05-02-2023 4:26pm

No need to speculate any longer

MrMusician18 · 05-02-2023 4:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205114#Comment_120205114

The problem is that the migration crisis feeds pressure into all of the other crises you mention as being more important. Say housing for example: State is not building enough houses but continues to accommodate all that turn up. It's even directly building houses for them. It's not an argument against the individuals that arrive here, but government policy.

So it's not migration on its own, but that migration makes the other day to day problems worse.

There will be an upper ceiling for support for these kinds of arguments - there always is. I think the Independent today are reporting that 56% of those polled think the State has admitted too many refugees.

If this is where support peaks, then the government need to get ahead of it quickly. Given that they are facing a shortfall in beds, continued arrivals and are looking for every and any structure with a roof and heating, that seems unlikely.

bertieinexile · 05-02-2023 4:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204462#Comment_120204462

That's a very reasonable comment about what might turn you off protesting yourself.

On the other hand I'm sure you'd acknowlege the other comments above pointing out how the media are picking unrepresentative elements in order to cast the protests in a bad light.

The real question I have is even if you have been turned off the protests themselves would you recognise that they have changed the mood in the country and, in particular, they have moved the goalposts on what it is socailly acceptable to say about immigration.

It's not so much about a head count on the street it's about how the discussion has been moved in to territory that would have been unimaginable six months ago.

DaithiMa · 05-02-2023 4:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205114#Comment_120205114

Yes, but those concerns about the housing crisis and access to healthcare are being exacerbated by the current government policy on immigration. They are looking for school classrooms now for god's sake and the 180k expected this year will eventually have to be housed somewhere and many will have to access healthcare somewhere.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/president-michael-d-higgins-condemns-those-sowing-hate-and-building-fear-around-refugees-as-poll-shows-56pc-believe-ireland-took-in-too-many-42328205.html

The latest Sunday independent poll on the matter says that 58% of the respondents think we've already taken in too many refugees and asylum seekers in comparison to 30% saying we haven't.

What Michael D's headlined quotes have to do with the poll I'm not sure, the results are in that article though.

DaithiMa · 05-02-2023 4:38pm

And also, if the pollsters had asked the question 'Do you think the country can acommodate and cater for a further 180k arrivals on top of those that are ready here?' what do you think the poll result would be?

MrMusician18 · 05-02-2023 4:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205120#Comment_120205120

The people you describe are some of the protesters, not all of them. Yes there are nutters, conspiracy theorists, racists and criminals in their ranks - but that is true of every movement.

Do you think that the water charges protests were a disgrace because of the communists and anti semites in the Irish far left that were involved the movement?

From the Irish independent poll, the largest proportion of those polled believe it is local opposition rather than far right agitation at the heart of the protests.

jackboy · 05-02-2023 5:13pm

If the government persist with the current policy of taking in vast numbers with no planning, the protests will get so big that the far right element will be completely swamped. The current everyone is racist gaslighting strategy may break down then.

olestoepoke · 05-02-2023 5:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205023#Comment_120205023

That's a couple of times you've slipped in "small crowds". Hugging yourself for comfort telling yourself repeatedly they are only small crowds and they are all "for roish" mindless "feral scum" or worse common as muck uneducated, unemployable (your words) Irish people complaining about the "Meedja" I think that's the term you used to attack working class peoples accents. It is displays of utter ignorance and disregard from people like you and our countries leaders for ordinary people that got Mr. Trump into power.

Yes there are Far Right agitators at these protest using it as an opportunity but there are many many more at home that do not show up at protests that are disgusted at how our government has handled this debacle. And many like myself are liberal minded people who voted for gay marriage, believe in equality, inclusion etc. and are a million miles away from the real far right not the watered down neoliberal version.

Loafing Oaf · 05-02-2023 5:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120204046#Comment_120204046

Well why are you singling out Aontu among the smaller parties as the one that might 'stand up to this madness'? What USP have they other than 'Catholic conservatism'?

Luxembourgo · 05-02-2023 5:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120205436#Comment_120205436

They were the only one who asked questions during covid, and about the only opposition party that didn't want to close the airports and have zero covid.