NEWSTALK - Ban hunting - debate / conversation

J.R.

This morning:

https://www.newstalk.com/podcasts/highlights-from-the-pat-kenny-show/is-it-time-to-ban-the-hunting-of-animals

BSA International

Heard it this morning.

That Carmody lad has convinced me I'm nothing but a blood thirsty murderer of poor birds and animals. I'm gonna sell me guns, run naked in the fields and hug trees from now on.......Am I feck !!!!!!!

Carmody would make your teeth itch ! Some drivel. Does anyone actually take him seriously?

The lad on for hunting was crap too.

Statement from NARGC was decent.

Pawwed Rig

I just listened to the piece as I saw this thread. I don't think the guy representing the hunters came off well at all. Seemed very unsure of himself and came across as fairly uncaring.

I don't think being a good or bad speaker matters to Newstalk. If a point is brought up that could make newstalks investors uncomfortable, it is answered with "that's a conversation for another day"

JP22

I don't think being a good or bad speaker matters to Newstalk. 

It may not matter to Newstalk but it does matter to those listening.

Carmody was his usual self, what else would you expect,

The other chap was terrible unsure of himself, at least that’s how it sounded to me. People really shouldn’t partake in debates like this unless they are competent in speaking/debating on live media.

Just my tuppence worth. 

Asus1

Not being lazy but couldn't listen to pat Kenny or newstalk as I'd prefer to chew on my dogs tail as I find both unbearable.

Do you have a quick rundown of episode.

I assume the person against hunting and the the people who agree are also against the rounding up of livestock who are then put in holding pens till they are stunned or shot in the head with a bolt before being hung up and having their throat cut to bleed out.Also they should hate the thought of millions of fish being hunted across the vast oceans and then hauled aboard to die a slow death.

I don't know why anybody bothers arguing on the side of hunting as it's a lost cause as most people who eat meat believe there food died a beautiful and dignified death whereas the deer shot on a hill died in terror and stress.

Asus1

And is that lad who opposes shooting not on every year saying the same thing.

Birdnuts

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119522997#Comment_119522997

I remember him writing letters to the papers spouting the same old nonsense as far back as the 70's!!

Pawwed Rig

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119522986#Comment_119522986

It is a 10 minute podcast. Would take me longer to type a rundown of the episode than it would for you to listen to it

J.R.

This is the attitude & mentality of some anti's

Grizzly 45

This was the classic example of what I have been saying about people needing proper media training if you are going to represent anything, or at least having your knowledge base up to scratch. Your man from our side was dreadful.All "ahhs and Ermms" sounding apologetic for what he is.

Carmody had not and made not, one, single, viable or discussable point. He was just spouting, as usual emotionalism and whimsical nonsense as to why hunting should be banned.He is the most easiest opponent to rile and take apart in a debate if you know what you are doing. Our speaker didn't.

I'll say this again. DO NOT engage with Media,if you don't have the confidence or training or knowledge to do so, and better still, if no one engages as we should know by now that this would be clickbait airtime filler considering the time of year. If they don't have an opposing view, they have no story. It's a win for our side if we say nothing,a loss for their side as they get no airtime, and for Newstalk they lose revenue and hopefully retire that utter gowl Kenny soonest .

Grizzly 45

I remember him writing letters to the papers spouting the same old nonsense as far back as the 70's!!

There are two John Carmodys in the Irish animal rights scene.One from Limerick and one from Waterford.

This was "streaker" Carmody as he was known up in Limerick. He ran another "phone box membership"[IE they could hold the AGM in a phone box someplace] anti-organisation called Animal Rights Action Network [ARAN]. Which oddly had a lot of young ladies as members.As how he got this title as he liked to strip down to the Speedos and get covered in fake blood with one or more of these models and wrap up in clear PVC and pretend they were wrapped meet lying on Cruises st to demonstrate against animal slaughter. He left Limerick under a bit of a cloud, apparently, one of his "models" wasn't quite old enough to be getting her kit off in public and doing weird stuff with an adult male...Or so the word on the street was at the time.

The other Carmody is from Waterford and has been on the scene longer. He is more militant and has some form for assault and obstruction,which he got by getting lippy with a Garda at a Stephens day hunt meet in Tramore, Waterford about 20 years ago and is a pal of the great letter writer of Callan, Co Kilkenny, John Fitzgerald,he of Campaign to Abolish Cruel Sports [CACS], another phone box membership group. John Fitz has been scribbling letters to the press since the early 1980s.

Interesting lad our John Fitz in Callan.Was fired from his job in the Co-op in Callan because, according to him,he was fitted up for damaging a coursing venue in Glin, Co Limerick and down in Kilkenny,and for possessing "bomb-making materials" When AGS raided his house in Callan. He threw a satchel of incriminating info out a window which literally landed at a Garda's feet! He got away by the skin of his teeth from being convicted by a faux pas in the court in Limerick in the 1980s. One of the witnesses went and had a chat in an interval with his old pal on the jury. Which was seen by Johns's defence lawyer, who successfully had the trial declared null and void because of that incident. You can read his version in his book Bad Hare days"[for free on Amazon Kindle!It's that bad!]

Ironic,both he and Waterford John Carmody were both PROs for the Irish Council Against Bloodsports[ICABS] in the 80s and 90s and both were fired for their actions from that organisation.

J.R.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119527268#Comment_119527268

I think it was one of  John Carmody’s role models who wrote that book - John Fitzgerald.

dto001

So how do we fight this, not just Carmody but the anti field sports as a whole because if we don't we won't have it in the near future!!

Asus1

If shooting an animal who more than likely will die within a few seconds is cruel and looked to be banned,then surely fishing which brings tons of fish aboard and allows the fish to die gasping for minutes on end should be preferably banned first or are fish not cute enough to care about

Grizzly 45

Not by engaging with MSM unprepared,or by playing to their narrative and stereotypes to stick on the TV news clip.

I refer to the NARGC interview in the Covid year when the shooting season looked at being closed down. Could the two lads have dressed any better to portray a stereotypical character of what Joe Public thinks us hunters look like? Tweed suit and flat cap and quilted vest and baseball cap out at a pheasant pen... Yayyy for really emphasizing a negative stereotype? Does Wayne La Pierre conduct media interviews for the US NRA in a baseball cap and tactical vest outside Joe's Gun range, with "from my cold dead hands" emblazoned on the cap? LOOKS are a big thing today in this instant media world.

Imagine how that Newstalk interview would have gone there if your man had read a couple of chapters on debating by Jordan Peterson or Ben Shapiro and used that as well as having some memorised prepared facts on Carmody, or anyone else? Their emotivism and argument would have lasted three seconds to anyone rational when given facts. Even Min Noonan's statement that PK read at the start should have been seized on by our spokesman and used to show that if it wasn't for hunters these ground-nesting birds would be a lot less and that hunters contribute 100% more financially and in practical conservation than Carmody and the likes of him have ever in a decade of protest.

We have to fight smarter and pick our battlegrounds better before just jumping onto any type of access to the media.Do we really think we will convince people one way or another in a 5-minute soundbite?

I would add that "hearts &minds" also play a big part on us keeping our sport. But I would settle for "getting off asses" as a great advancement here in Irish shooting.Even if every one of us made a conscious effort of trying to recruit two newbies to shooting of any kind per year,it would be an incredible boost to the lifestyle.

J.R.

Stars In The Sky: A Hunting Story

2018 ‧ Documentary ‧ 1h 15m

available on Netflix

Interesting perspective in this documentary on why we hunt

J.R.

The debate about hunting and hunting seasons continues today on radio.

The continuing debate around the open season order saw NARGC National Chairman John Butler and Vice Chairman Dan Curley discuss the topic on the RTE Radio 1 - "This Week Show"

Fast forward to 46.25 mins.

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/this-week/programmes/2022/0828/1319249-this-week-sunday-28-august-2022/?fbclid=IwAR0P4CbqTZ8TwrqeodDpuHsH5Dwmow5eKO0m85gwYyLF08khqWTjVYIFnV0

marlin vs

Grizzly the John Carmody that you speak of from Waterford is actually John Tierney, a militant and a fool.

JP22

What’s new lads, nothing.

It’s just the usual annual media event which comes around year after year, like the Late Late “Toy Show”. RTE and other media outlets have to fill the slots to generate income to keep shareholders happy.

As several other members have said, our down-fall is not being “media savvy”, only those who know their subject and are experienced in media debate should take part.

Enough said. 

deeksofdoom

CRINGE!!!!!!!!…

Whenever are the NARGC going to let people who are properly trained and coached in Media / PR to field questions on the Media in these debates with Antis.

Could the NARGC themselves not come up with a list of standard questions or points fielded by the likes of John Carmody in these debates and have prepared answers statements with backed up factual scientific data ready for them.

The day of representatives of hunting bodies stuttering and stammering through debates with antis is not good enough anymore.

Grizzly 45

^THIS!^

useurowname

I thought the NARGC guys on RTE Radio were pretty good in fairness.

The guy on Newstalk was up against it as he was wheeled out for balance against the anti who’s position is fundamentally opposed to hunting, in fact killing animals for any reason. The host seemed quite up to date with the debate, which didn’t help because he listed what the arguments are in favour of hunting, but in so doing in a flippant manner really debased the pro hunting argument, clearing the way for the anti to nail his points. In fairness the manner of both was quite civil. The hunting guy came across as a decent and down to earth citizen who happens to enjoy hunting. Testament to this was that the anti acknowledged he sounded like a decent man at the end of the interview.

J.R.

RTE News

https://www.rte.ie/news/environment/2022/0828/1319243-gun-clubs-conservation/

Grizzly 45

Journos,MSM TV reporters, ETC Take Note!☝️☝️

The above article is how it should be done. Both sides got an equal expression of POV and time in an un-opinionated article.No stupid and arranged posing of/by Niall to "convey a message in a picture"[A picture says a thousand words] either.

Old school reporting by a journo who knows her trade still.

So it looks like a battle between us and Birdwatch Ireland in the future. Hard one to call as it becomes hand-to-hand fighting of experts of differing views and facts& figures aplenty flying about. BWI has had a contingent of Watermelons embedded in it for years.

useurowname

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547205#Comment_119547205

I wonder if the journo got out of the shop without being asked if he’d consider a Blaser?

Asus1

I shoot and trap foxes for ground bird protection with a branch of birdwatch Ireland's full backing also do the same with Grey's and magpies and recently jackdaws as they have become worse than the Grey's.

I think most groups interested in nature will always have people who only go by books or what they were taught in college and they are usually against any hunting or predator control.The others in the groups that actually head out and do the nest surveys, ringing chicks,etc these people are usually realistic and know what needs to be done but for fear of being looked down upon usually never say it to the top table

J.R.

CLARE FM

Link below to interview with John Butler, NARGC national chairman.

Fast forward to about 7.45

https://m.soundcloud.com/clarefm/morning-focus-hunting-debate-continues?utm_source=Email&utm_campaign=social_sharing&utm_medium=widgetutm_content%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fsoundcloud.com%2Fclarefm%2Fmorning-focus-hunting-debate-continues

deeksofdoom

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119559709#Comment_119559709

Thats more like it, well done John Butler!