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Is showing someone your middle finger a crime?

  • 12-11-2022 12:03am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 75 ✭✭


    When I was in a bus a pedestrian gave the driver (or possibly a passenger) the middle finger.

    Just wondering if it’s a specific offence.



Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 720 ✭✭✭Lemsiper


    No



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,605 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    There are public order offenses that can be a bit of a catchall for these kinds of things

    Probably not enough to get any kind of conviction, but may be used to detain someone who looks like they might be about to start a fight



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,344 ✭✭✭NUTLEY BOY


    Look at this (threatening, abusive or insulting behaviour in public place)

    Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act, 1994, Section 6 (irishstatutebook.ie)

    Better always to keep that finger down and just count to 10 !



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,523 ✭✭✭✭Esel


    I always use my little finger, to indicate to the other person that they are a little prick.

    Not your ornery onager



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,306 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Arguable it could lead to a breach of the peace and thus be an offence contrary to Section 6 of the Public Order Act.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,450 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Requires an intent to cause a breach of the peace. That, I think, would be difficult to establish from a simple flash of the middle finger!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,211 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    It doesn’t appear to require intent, merely being reckless as to whether or not one’s actions may contribute to or cause a breach of the peace, could mean they find themselves liable -

    It shall be an offence for any person in a public place to use or engage in any threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour with intent to provoke a breach of the peace or being reckless as to whether a breach of the peace may be occasioned.


    An actual breach of the peace doesn’t have to have occurred in order to be convicted of an offence -

    Held by Clarke J (with Denham C. J. and O"Donnell J. concurring) that in terms of the public order offence, the District Judge had been required to decide whether it could be inferred from the evidence that the appellant knew that there was a substantial risk that a breach of the peace would be occasioned by his planned behaviour and that he carried out such behaviour anyway. It was also said that the fact that no such breach was in fact likely to occur in the circumstances was not relevant. On a consideration of the appellant"s behaviour at Kilmainham Garda Station, it was held that it had been open to the District Judge to infer that the appellant"s behaviour, which had clearly been abusive and threatening, gave rise to a substantial risk of a breach of the peace as far as the appellant"s perspective was concerned. On that basis, it was determined that the District Judge was free to convict the appellant on the evidence.

    https://ie.vlex.com/vid/clifford-v-dpp-garda-793916201



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