€1,350/cow payment to cut suckler numbers

Birdnuts

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119966698#Comment_119966698

True - but intensive livestock systems here and across the EU need to stop importing soya feed from that region too for the very same reasons as outlined by the link below

https://www.globalwitness.org/en/campaigns/environmental-activists/toxic-takeaways/

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119967931#Comment_119967931

All the schemes will reduce sheep the same as cattle, farmers have been getting the majority of their subsidies into their pocket since 2000 yet they farmed on. I farmed the schemes since then plus managing the land with a profitable enterprise

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119966478#Comment_119966478

I have to preface any comment by saying I'm a long time disinterested in commodity farming. More looking at making my own market now. I like the native and hardy breeds, easier kept saving time & money risk.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119968562#Comment_119968562

I wouldn't destock for €12/ewe, nor €120/ewe

I'll be very hard to convince to reduce carbon production too until i see other sectors buying in, eg reducing waste, car use, foreign holidays, f..k em

Sheep breeder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119968562#Comment_119968562

What is a realistic price from the processors, the price is dictated by the consumer end of story.

Dunedin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119968771#Comment_119968771

Agree. Same here.

Siamsa Sessions

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119968799#Comment_119968799

The price is dictated by the supermarket. Consumers have little real choice and supermarkets know that

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119967996#Comment_119967996

Wonder how much impact Brexit had on that. i.e. if the UK was a net importer, then you suddenly took it out, then you'd get a bump in your net export figures

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119967269#Comment_119967269

Wrangler you want to get the stories right.

That an old Kerry one. It one of a duo.

Both set in Dingle and Sleagh head.

Neither involved a Dub both involved a Yank with sunglasses and a camera

Yank to the Dingle native

'' Gosh it must be great to wake up to a view like that every morning ''

The reply was similar to your ditty

''you cannot ate a view ''

The other one was the Yank stopping the car and asking the Native Gaeltacht man.

'' Which way is it to Donegal''

to which the reply was

'' if I was going to Donegal I would not be starting here''

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119967931#Comment_119967931

Its amazing the amount of cribbing over a voluntary scheme and trying to find flaws in it. The rag crying over it, the farming organisations trying to hide over it and Larry whining over it.

From all that you can assume that its a logical scheme. The only crib I see about it is the funding is cheap for the government. At present they are subsidising suckler production to the time of 200+/calf (allowing for mortality)

1350 is for partial reduction, complete suckler destocking is being proposed at 1150/ cow.

Now if farm organisations were like trade unions they be trying to negotiate the best deal possible for there members ( any decent organisation should be able to double the paltry sum proposed and get add on support as well(, but the shower that represents farmers are afraid of the demise of the great beloved suckler cow. The greatest harbinger of poverty to farmers since the blight caused the potatoes to fail and bought on the famine.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119967995#Comment_119967995

Class...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119969584#Comment_119969584

A lot of lads don’t bother with the suckler schemes as they aren’t worth the hassle or cost associated with them. You have to pay to weigh stock and do genomic assessments and don’t get me started on the poop samples all that nonsense.

Id be in favour of a dig out for the calf to beef lads.

A lot of lads are making a margin in suckler based or finishing systems by focusing on feed efficient stock.

These big tanks of suckler cows are a waste of time. Equally these 30 month old bullocks that come to a dw of 330 kgs are a dead loss. Feed inefficient stock that take forever to finish wont make money.

You can finish bullocks out of dairy cows at 23 months over 300 kg. Likewise, you can finish suckler bullocks at 26 months at 400 kg.

In relation to climate change we need to think bigger like New Zealand. We can’t expect solutions to come from eu level as the eu either want a plant based diet solution or some kind of synthesised protein solution. You can see the Dutch government investing in mosa meat etc.

Siamsa Sessions

Processors and supermarkets, aka the “industry”, don’t want a reduction in numbers. Lower supply = higher price.

That’s why IFA and IFJ are against it. They always reflect whatever the industry wants.

I said on another thread here that one of the top-table boys admitted last week that farmers have told him they want to hear more about the dairy retirement scheme but the IFA continue to state that they are officially against it.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970018#Comment_119970018

Good farmers don't want a reduction in numbers, national commitees in IFA are dominated by better farmers,

Subsidy chasing is not a good image for Irish farmers, but that's the way the powers that be have made us.

At the oral hearing for the motorway here, one of the farmers was appealing a decision.

He claimed his farm was being farmed in an ''environmentally sensitive'' manner.

Whereupon the agri consultant for the National Roads Authority retorted ''let go wild is what I'd call it''

There'll be lot's of land ''let go wild'' from now on claiming big subs

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119968998#Comment_119968998

It's costing a good bit more to run the plant now, the lamb has to pay for everything. I see icm have pulled the price again.

I learnt years ago that playin the market with beef or sheep was a waste of time, I always sell now when the animal is fit.

The fact that the price was so good this time last year would be a reason for me to expect the price to fall now, no two years are alike

Anto_Meath

@barktastic , I hear what you are saying about the big tanks of cows, however if you looked at the cull cow trade this year there was some money paid for these big cows, any continental cow grading R+ and over 700 kgs was making over €2,000 all year nearly. I sometimes think beef factories are more interested in cull cows than prime beef from a bullock under 30 months. Look at any of the special suckler / breading heifers sales at the minute, its the big musseled animals that are making the big money, especially if they are roany.

You are paid per KG so the more KGs you can get on the hook the better paid you will be, the balance is to get the most meat on a hook as cheep as you can.

If you are doing your job right the proposed €1,350 / cow payment isn't worth even discussing, anyway it was only a throw away article in the IFJ and has no substance. I have a feeling there will be lots of these silly articles over the next year or two as the temperature for change is measured. If milk prices drop 10 cent / L then there would be twice as many dairy cows culled in a year as any scheme like this could achieve. Seen somewhere is is costing circa €2,400 per year to maintain a dairy cow.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970587#Comment_119970587

Ok from my point of view I prefer a cow that weans a calf that is a significant portion of her weight at weaning.

This has been a good year for cull cows. Even so the big cow might push 2k but she’d eat nearly as much as two cows that would be around 1500.

I amnt a big fan of these muscled up heifers making big money calving at 30 months with vet assistance.

Anto_Meath

@[Deleted User] nor am I a fan of them them, not able to handle them really on my set up. I prefer a cow with milk at around 600 kgs that will get a calf to around 350 kgs at 6 months. Again I would be using easy calving LM bulls so thankfully its very rare that I would need a Vet. If you are dropping €300 - €400 to the vet to get a good mussled calf on the ground it would take the shine off it fairly soon. But there is plenty of lads doing it by the looks of the Carrick On Shannon sale last week.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970852#Comment_119970852

This is it. Hard job on the cow and the vet. I pulled one out of nearly 50 this year and no vet.

Theyd be ok as a hobby.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119967995#Comment_119967995

Class...

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970018#Comment_119970018

You're naive to think that someone who says no doesn't want to buy...

JohnChadwick

Is the 1350 paid for getting rid of the cow, in addition to the money you get from the factory...? I.e. if you get 2k from the factory you're getting 3,350 for selling a suckler...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119971684#Comment_119971684

Obviously. But you can’t replace with another cow

The scheme is actually perfect for someone transitioning to organic suckling as you need to give the cows an air hanger to lie in for organics

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119972206#Comment_119972206

I think you're exaggerating your own importance there, meat processors will just upsticks and go somewhere they can get supplies,

And that's if they stay in the meat business at all, there's loads of opportunities out there for people with the sort of assets that meat barons have , they don't give a **** about farmer, they'd move on no problem

Sheep breeder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970587#Comment_119970587

Agree with a lot of what your saying, cull cont cow beef has always being in demand and brings a good trade, most of the beef consumed in France is cow beef and all factories like to have cows to go to Paris market. Neighbour sent a cul Charcow in September to the mart @ 1020 kg and made 2650 after 7 calves and a similar cow last year made 1850, a suckler cow is all about what market you are chasing our system a good lim or char cross cow to produce as heavy a muscle and weight for age and colour for export job, achieve by type of ai/ bull easy calving etc. The suckler cow mirrors the type of land and the farmer, like the way the poor dairy cross store bullock buyer who thinks he is making a forTune above everybody else with under performing dairy cross cattle and them complains about the factory screwing the farmer.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119972920#Comment_119972920

The fellas buying and finishing freisian bullocks is the biggest sub going and it’s for the dairy lads. 30 month old cattle in the low 300 kgs dw.

Its some waste of tax payers money to fork out millions(correction) to reduce the suckler herd by 200k. Sure natural wastage will achieve that anyway. Tax payers screwed yet again.

Sure cattle numbers haven’t changed much in 40 years. Why not take a serious look at methane reducing supplements and better breeding.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119973197#Comment_119973197

It’s still 270 million of tax payers money down the drain when numbers are declining naturally.

How has suckler farming made billionaires out of beef barons? There are suckler farms in New Zealand the land of no subsidies or tams or tax free deal to farmers that rent out their land.

Silverdream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119973274#Comment_119973274

It would still be cheaper for the tax payer if it reduces the carbon fines that Ireland has signed up for. At the end of the day 270million is only the overspend on decorations in that new hospital.

1350 isnt enough either, the farmer needs a longer term support if they are removing part of his livelihood

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119973299#Comment_119973299

Surely the New Zealand approach around methane reduction supplements and better breeding is a better option.

Its not fair to have a cow reduction scheme that excludes dairy lads as well.

Fellas banging on about the gravy train of subs for suckler farmers. It’s Mickey Mouse money really for genomics and weighing. A lot of lads skip it.

Subs have been reducing over time too. No inflation boost there.