What program are you currently following and what do you have planned for 2023?

Black Sheep

The Forever Strong is paid programming delivered via the Train Heroic app.

It's not one program (like WS4SB, for example), it changes over time, usually every 12 weeks.

From the top of my head, we've done maybe 4-5 programs at this stage.

They've varied between 3-4 days training, and usually have been 'push/pull/legs' and then if there was a fourth day that was either a rehab/recovery type day, or it was a full body day.

Obviously because it's been several different programs, the details of what the Lower days look like depends on the specific program but in general they have been something like-

-Mobility stuff at the beginning

-Some kind of 2 or 3 exercise circuit to warm-up, using things like banded leg extensions and leg curls, hip bridges, DB RDLs, single leg exercises... Just a way to get a sweat going

-Main lift has sometimes been a deadlift or a squat variation of your choice, and usually 3-4 sets, and often the last set might be some kind of max reps or max effort set. But on at least 2 of the programs the main lift has been DB bulgarian split squats, going heavy, like 3-5 reps...

-Supplementary work has been what you'd expect... Hip bridges, RDLs, back extensions, leg curls... Often super-sets

If you've been following DeFranco for a while you probably know that his outlook these days is that there are no essential exercises, so if straight bar deadlifts are consistently messing you up then I think he would probably note that you could pull off blocks, or do trap bar deads, or whatever else. The point in his programming is not to increase your deadlift max, he would probably say the point is just to have a main lift that's glute, hamstring and low-back focused and pick one you can put in a good effort on.

nates

Hey, ty for reply.

Sorry for my late answer, i had some problems with my PC.

Ok, its sounds good for me. I give it a try.

Iam over 40 and i think they days chasing PRs is over ;).

Luxembourgo

On Rebuilt 2.0 at the moment, it's certainly very different and a nice break from the barbell.

Let's me exercise outside for the summer. Interested to see how my body reacts.

nates

I paid the program. And did the first 2 days (push and lower body).

It was "interested" to train in this style, but i got inner fights :(, one time a week legs/chest, no overhead press... All gains lost immediately 😏.

Just joking. I didn't trained like this for 20? Years.

Next cycle start next week.

swededmonkey

Currently running Legs, Push, Posterior, Pull, Anterior 5 day plan. The sole focus is to strengthen core area after a spate of back injuries. Going super light on squats and deadlifts but increasing each week.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120369821#Comment_120369821

After holiday/illness induced time off, have decided to sign up for Team Forever Strong.

Enjoying it so far, and takes all the guesswork out of selecting a programme, will do for a few months, and likely revert to simpler training (with less space needed for the colder winter months)

Black Sheep

Been continuing to run the Joe DeFranco / James Smith programming from Team Forever Strong.

Last program, just finishing up, was an upper, lower, upper plus 'summer challenges' that were basically outdoor conditioning workouts.

Some progress on bench 1rm but probably regressed a little on my front squat 1rm. Pull-up numbers jumped up.

Overall reasonably happy, I've learned that you can rarely make all the numbers go up all the time. You have to pick your priorities.

If numbers are going down across the board, or in the majority, that's a red flag for me BTW. You don't have to be arbitrarily assigning importance to a given set of lifts, it's more that if you're getting weaker in several ears then it's probably a bad sign, unless there's some really specific circumstances where it's OK (Like being a very large powerlifter who wants to go in a complete different direction with their training, losing body mass, lifts dropping etc But developing greater all-around fitness, more relative strength etc.).

There's some discontent in the TFS online group at the moment because errors in the programming have been appearing, causing people to have to query what is correct in a given workout and what might be an error. It's usually minor stuff - a set too much here, lack of clarity on whether it's a close grip bench vs regular bench - stuff like that, but overall there's a little bit of a sense that no one is at the helm / regularly checking in.

I know the week after next we're doing a three week transitional programme that is based around the idea of super high volume. Almost like a challenge rather than a programme.

After the three week transitional program there's a 'summer challenge'. Again, I'll take a look at what it is, because we can see the upcoming programming a week in advance, but if it doesn't float my boat then I might go on pause for a few months, and do something like a basic upper / lower.

Alf Veedersane

Rehab and machines (when I can) post hip replacement.

There was a 2" difference between legs...probably accumulated over time as I could do less and less and had a heavy limp.

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120963033#Comment_120963033

Takes guts to get the hip replaced - fair play. I'm sure once you have it rehabbed you'll have a new lease on life.

Cill94

Currently lifting 5 days. Three upper and two lower. Also running 2 days per week. All my own programming.

Recently achieved a big goal for the year which was getting my first muscle up.

Goal for remainder of this year is to run 10km and maintain as much strength as possible in the process. Will bulk again after that and try hit some PRs.

Alf Veedersane

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120963952#Comment_120963952

I didn't have much choice in the end. The femoral head was knackered so it needed to be done sooner rather than later before it gave way.

All the other things that were secondary to the original AVN made quality of life a lot worse so it needed doing.

The next day, doing the leg abduction, I already had double the ROM I had before the op. Was about 7 weeks post op when I realised I was walking normally...I had forgotten what that felt like, as strange as that sounds.

What I get back to doing, I'm not sure. Squatting might reduce the lifespan of the replacement...high box squats might be a variation I could so. But lots I can do outside of that anyway.

New lease of life is 100% the case though...even at 16 weeks out. Not a full strength but still transformative from before.

Black Sheep

Going into my third week of running an upper/lower for 4 days a week.

I am still receiving Joe DeFranco programming and I might 'log' that and get to it later, but for now the upper/lower is handy because of scheduling.

I've used this upper/lower set-up previously, but as time has gone on I've gotten a bit smarter about how to make it work better for me in terms of exercise selection, warm-up and not running into a wall too early.

I'm doing two work sets per movement, one 'heavier', one 'lighter', both to failure, and trying to progressively overload week to week. Cycling a few different A, B, C workouts to keep it going. It's Jordan Peters but as I said, I'm being a little more conservative than old Jordan is likely to be, to say the least...

Bellie1

After a year of injuries , been doing Andy Bakers rotating linear progression program https://www.andybaker.com/what-is-a-rotating-linear-progression/

2 upper/2 lower days a week.. It involves first set at pretty much max effort and then 2 backoff sets @10% less weight , with reps decreasing from 8 down to 3 as the weeks go on. Mentally it's great just thinking there's one grinding set . Although the backoff sets, albeit 10% lighter, are still pretty tough. So far so good,been following for over 2 months now,body is reacting well and am back at previous max strength levels( albeit just 1 set , whereas in previous programs I would have done 3 or 4 sets at the weight). Heading into sets of 4 after current deload so I will know soon enough if it's the lower rep ranges that aggravate my facet joint .Fingers crossed not.

nates

Hi,

i tried the Team Forever Strong online programm. I liked the style, but i didnt like the fact, that there are nearly in every cycle of the program (u cann scroll back for a year) just one lower body day a week causes me to finish it quickly.

Years ago a friend of mine gave me an ebook from Joe Defranco called SB911 Forever Strong. Its a 11 Weeks long program with 3 Phases (hypertrophy, mass, power) and a peek week. Its 4 days upper/lower program with the "usua new" Joe style programs. Things like the joes shoulder shoker, or Jims Mass attack are involved there. U are more or less free to pick the exercises, but the targeted muscles are predetermined.

I gave it a try and today i end my first whole cycle.

What should i say, iam very happy with it and i will do a second cycle.

So i would recommend it. Feel free to ask about the prog.

Black Sheep

It's true that DeFranco tends to programme 1 lower body day per week. But sometimes in TFS he has had a dedicated lower day and then full body day later in the week... Or sometimes conditioning days where you're doing volumes of bodyweight movements that include things like walking lunges.

My bench has actually come along well on it, and I'm pain free on it, and on other movements like strict pull ups, but fair to say I had a significantly bigger squat and deadlift when doing conjugate or following Andy Baker.

The TFS is in that "washed up meathead" / general fitness zone, I wouldn't recommend it to someone with a top end strength goal, either upper or lower. DeFranco describes most of the programmes as functional hypertrophy with a longevity twist. He does have increasing relative strength over absolute strength as a stated goal, and I would say I've seen results reflective of that. Pullups and pushups, and probably "general athleticism" (dangerously vague phrase admittedly) is up even if squat variations 1Rms are down.

Black Sheep

I did an upper and lower body day with my wife when we were on holidays.

She follows figure programming from Mark Carroll. It's basically high volume bodybuilding but modern exercise selection.

Anyway, yesterday was

4x12-15 high bar squats

4x10-12 good mornings

Superset of 4x12 single leg elevated hip thrust and Bulgarian split squat

4 rounds of side plank

Can barely walk today from DOMs... The high bars... Jesus **** Christ...

Black Sheep

New DeFranco program starting next week.

It's as if he was listening in to this thread, because (as with previous programs, in fairness), lower body is trained twice in the week.

Monday is a full body day that includes a 3x7 compound squat variation. Then Thursday is a dedicated lower body day. Not sure anyone except those with very specific goals requires much more.

nates

Hi,

i resubbed too.

It seems that they got lack of people who do their program. On social media they posted a discount code for 1,50$ (first month).

My Evil me saved Legend123 and Goliath2.0 :/.

Black Sheep

Right now, liking this set up in my current programming which has compound lifts (bench and squat) set up on Mondays, using 531 percentages. Then the rest of the week has pull, legs, push. The pull and push leg days have quite a bit of unilateral work in them. It feels like it all makes sense in that Joe DeFranco way of doing things.

Black Sheep

A productive month long block of Joe DeFranco training just concluded. 531 squat and bench, resetting now, for another month of the same. The compound lifts remain on a Monday, with accessories spread out over the rest of the week.

Mellor

Started a new program. Higher reps, built around the main lifts and accessories. Wanting to rebuild some resilience.

Week 2 of program. Land badly on shoulder. Feels like something is bruised/torn around my AC joint. Typical

Mr. CooL ICE

Don't have time for long sessions in the gym any more. Got notified of some training templates for people with little time, detailed here: https://www.minimumdosetraining.com/

Started the singles + backoffs template last week. Basically, a single @ RPE 9-9.5, followed by 2x3 @ 80% of the single for SBD. It's not going to work miracles but for someone like me, it suits.

Cill94

Still doing three days upper, two lower, and two running. Minor back tweak from the running recently but that's almost resolved now. Feeling best shape I've ever been.

Alf Veedersane

Getting in 3 days a week and what days I'm crossing the country for work dictates what I do but it's still broadly rowing followed by hip stuff followed by full body made up of (pushing, pulling, legs). If it ends up that 2 of those days are back to back, one day will be primarily lower body and the next upper.

But ultimately its getting the hip back up to par and then bringing the left leg, which had atrophied more than I had realised over the past 3 years) back to the right.

xckjoo

Still running the 5/3/1 and enjoying it. Hurt the back deadlifting a few months ago (form was going to shite and I kept chasing numbers). Took some time off and brought the lower body weights right back down and building more slowly this time while focussing on form. Still finding it good. Feel stronger and looking better than ever. Overhead press is a bit of a struggle to make progress in, but shoulders have had issues over the years so probably a factor. Think I started bench at too low a weight too so only starting to feel it being a challenge now.

Every now and then I get tempted to jump to a different program focussed on upper body, but I think that's just for vanity so I've talked myself out of it so far. Just need to keep reminding myself that the work is paying off and keep to the program. It can be a bit disheartening if you miss a target weight and feel like you're going backwards next cycle, but the AMRAP approach for the last set means you're still progressing.

Overall I'd recommend it for someone looking to move from a general weight lifting program to something more focussed on strength.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121164784#Comment_121164784

Nothing on the X-ray, nothing on the ultrasound.

Meh, i'll just have to avoid overhear pressing for a bit. High rep bench press ahoy. (recipe for further injury)

Black Sheep

I'm halfway through a second block of this DeFranco programme, so that means I'm also halfway through my second block of 531, as that's the rep scheme he's using for the main lifts on it.

Observations...

The first couple of years I did 531 I was more of a novice, and I think because my numbers were low, I was super hesitatant to take Wendler's advice to lower your estimated maxes for the purpose of working out percentages you'd be lifting at. I basically always did my true 1rm. Aside from a lot of grindy reps, the end result was that I very quickly hit a wall in trying to beat rep maxes, or add weight on certain lifts.

10+ years later now, I am more than happy to use a -10% estimate for my maxes, and as a result my "max rep" sets are generally in a higher range - usually something like 5-10.

It's too early to be definitive, but it feels a lot more productive and like I have leeway to add weight if I wanted to, or I can just focus on beating a previous rep max if I don't.

I don't generally hold with advice to lift sub maximally, I do think progressive loading and being a bit ambitious is very important in many programmes, but I think with 531 the weight lifted is less important than making a really concerted effort to have a product final set, no matter what weight is on the bar. I think if you understand that and really push to beat previous numbers, you will progress even if you are only adding weight once per block, the way Wendler proposes.

Black Sheep

Joe DeFranco's group training is heading into a phase where it appears randomised / fun protocols will be built in... Things like deck of cards workouts.

I'm not really a fan of that kind of thing, not really big into novelty in training, so I'm ducking out.

Starting a Mark Carroll 12 week programme. Upper, lower, upper, lower, arms. I'll run it over 10 days rather than 7 (Couldn't do 5 gym days a week on top of BJJ). It's high volume compared to what I've been doing, and a lot of super sets and tempo work.

Honestly, it'll be so different to what I've done for the last 2-4 years, it's hard to see how it couldn't give me some kind of training effect, just from changing things up. I expect to be sore AF.

The first block uses agonist supersets, that is, same muscle groups. So DB incline bench followed by DB flyes ... High bar back squats followed by leg extensions... It's going to be gruesome.

Black Sheep

I'm already massively regretting getting involved in this programme.

Lower body 1 today:-

5x8 high bar back squat, superset with 5x15 leg extensions

5x8 RDL, superset with 5x15 leg curls

3x30 duck leg press

4x20 sets seated calf raises

This programming kind of flies in the face of a lot of what I think I know to be good programming, but honestly, if I'm struggling this much with it, then part of me thinks it must be going to cause adaptation.

My wife is saying "give it 12 weeks and then revaluate". I'm not sure I will last it out, and I normally hate quitting programs.

Bellie1

That's alot of volume

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121396928#Comment_121396928

"Any fool can create a programme that is so demanding that it would virtually kill the toughest marine or hardiest of elite athletes.

But not any fool can create a tough programme that produces progress without unnecessary pain."

~ Mel Siff

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121390741#Comment_121390741

That's disappointing about the Team Forever Strong, was on it until a month ago when a never ending rotator cuff injury meant it wasn't worth it anymore.

Black Sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121401693#Comment_121401693

In their defence, it's a transitional programme, I suspect it'll only run for 3 or 4 weeks then they'll do something else. It's not visible in the group yet. Maybe the random elements will only be once a week. At I'll, probably not for me.

I did learn a lot / am learning a lot from the programming there, although the group chat is pretty basic.

That's annoying re the rotator cuff. Had issues with my right shoulder for 2-3 years. It's hard to resolve.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121401870#Comment_121401870

Yeah been to the physio and got some exercises to do. Just a matter of minding it as much as I can and build it up bit by bit.

Think it was actually the last transitional program with the stupid amount of bench presses that did it.

Do agree though, some interesting programmes, and did like the set ups.

Black Sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121401981#Comment_121401981

Yeah the recommended RPE / % 1RM for the bench in that particular programme were excessive - I had to cut it back, I actually remember that specifically.

Black Sheep

For anyone interested, a "deck of cards" workout from the 'randomised' programming that I'm discussing above, from Joe DeFranco.

This is an upper day, and it begins with some assistance work, super-setted, and then three sets of a normal bench progression. Then there's a "deck of cards" workout, which involves running through the whole deck. Different suits are difference movements, and face cards have numbers assigned to them (11, 12, 13 etc). Numbered cards are the suit's movement, and the number on the card.

It ends up working out as 90 of each of the movements, which are ... A push-up progression... DB lateral raises... Band pull-aparts... Plank.... Chin-ups.

Aside from the randomised structure, it's a fairly balanced upper body workout in the end.

Black Sheep

Binned the Mark Carroll programming, back to Joe DeFranco. I managed a fortnight, and I was literally feeling hungover after four days a week of 15-17 sets a workout.

I have even greater respect for my missus, who has been doing his physique programming for about 2 years. She sniggered when I said I was switching back.

xckjoo

Still on 5/3/1 but trying the Boring But Big 3 Month Challenge. First week was tough but feel fine this week. Month 2 and 3 might be a different story. Christmas is also falling a bit awkwardly (probably wont get to the gym much that week) so might end up restarting in January but I'll see how it goes

Alf Veedersane

Doing this 8-week program for a 2000m erg test.

https://www.concept2.com/files/pdf/us/training/Training_2000mRowingErgometerTest.pdf

It's time-based 'sets' so it's felt like a change but its been tricky trying to manage the pace so that the last set - emptying the tank - isn't too much faster/slower than the others.

I've no idea how it will translate though. At least with lifting, I found the RPE diagram to be pretty good for gauging where you are in relation to a max. But no idea here.

The target is 7 minutes or less but I don't know of that's a bridge too far just yet. But the pace on the 6-minute sets is a few seconds slower because I have to manage the gas tank.

nates

Hi there,

since 2 Month or something iam following the Programm from Jason Brown, which is a mix of Conjugate Training and Condition.

Actually i skipp the Conditiondays and row at home.

I rly like the programm so far.

https://www.jasonbrowncoaching.com/blog/the-best-system-of-training-for-the-everyday-athlete

Its via train heroric.

cheers.

Black Sheep

The past few weeks, training 2 upper and 2 lower per week, and with a relatively high volume of accessories has conspired - along with the December drinking season, and work stresses - to leave me flattened.

Just feeling absolutely shattered. Old aches and pains making a comeback, which is always a sign, to me, of recovery in the doldrums.

Lately I've been unsure what I'm moving into in 2024. This week I have opted to just 'punch the clock' somewhat, I'm doing a bro split week that looks like-

Chest / triceps

Back / Biceps

REST

Legs

Shoulder / traps

REST

REST

Not the optimal ordering, but it really doesn't matter.

All workouts 4-5 exercises, and relatively low volume, 2-3 work sets at most.

In the new year I am going to weigh up choosing between (1) Whatever Joe DeFranco offers for January, (2) a continuation of this bro split, in some form or (3) some kind of 3 day a week programming, and to try to be more consistent in my BJJ. Could go with any of them, at the moment.

Luxembourgo

Might be a bit off topic, but have been doing the 14 day squat mobility challenge on The Ready State App, and as someone who is stiff as **** it's made a massive difference already.

Back pain almost gone as well (though this might coincide with no work).

2024 will definitely include more mobility work....

Black Sheep

I'm back at the Yoga for Bjj myself. I did the level 1 cert and was big into it for a while. The most flexible I've ever been. Just dropped it because as I got more advanced it took more and more effort. It seems more practical for me to take more a "minimum effective dose" approach, rather than feeling I have to develop it further and further.

j@utis

Once my hip injury is completely healed (it's gonna be 4 weeks this Thursday since I busted it, ouch), I'm hoping to stick to 3x weight training sessions per week, plus 1-2 interval runs (5-7k, maybe some sprints if I'm able) and 1-2 rucks per week (the target here is to get up to 1/3 my body weight on my back and be able to walk same pace or very close pace as unloaded). Wish me luck and fingers crossed!

p.s. also the plan is to stick to mostly meat, eggs, cheese and some fermented veg and fruit diet.

Black Sheep

Ended up just continuing with Joe DeFranco's programming now that the Christmas chaos has resolved. I'm a creature of habit, I guess. Been on his programming for 1-1.5 years now, I think.

On week 2 of a 12 week upper / lower program. Two upper, one lower per week. Works out as a chest and tricep dominant upper body day, and a shoulders and biceps dominant upper body day. Back sprinkled relatively evenly in there. The lower days have a quad dominant day and a posterior chain dominant day.

As is becoming common with his longer programs, he has it broken down so that there's an eccentric block, and I think we can expect something like an isometric strength block next, or similar, and so on.