Wet patches in new build

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120101891#Comment_120101891

Eh - read the thread! In particular #45. Ventilation was only mentioned in the context of any small residual moisture.

"If it were me, I'd push for your builder to put on a good thick exterior render. 9" cavity block is often used for sheds and the like but will rely on the render to stop rain soaking in and dripping down to pool at the base. May well also appear as damp spots higher up. I had a similar problem on a self built shed, driving rain came before I had time to tackle the rendering, amazing the amount of water that will get through. So for a good thick exterior render, you need three coats starting with a strong scud coat and then two sand/lime/ cement render coats of a weaker mix. The first of these coats is scratched to allow the final coat a grip. Decorative stone only goes up on the final coat, but I think a nap finish with paint will help you. Use water proofer in the mixes and then when ready, at least two good coats of a good quality exterior wall paint. Problem should be largely solved then. I wouldn't obsess about rising damp unless you're living in a bog but you can assess that after you've dealt with rain water soaking through. That's what I do anyway."

C. Eastwood

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120101919#Comment_120101919

I agree. The builder will no doubt do that unless the OP retains a Construction Professional, because the builder must now be instructed in writing- what he must do.

C. Eastwood

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120101844#Comment_120101844

The OP has Skirting Boards in their Utility - See photos:-

7D7FEAC7-675F-4B0A-95BC-CB822FF8E5DF.jpeg

58FA6E5E-26D7-4858-960A-6FF3A09D27B4.jpeg

There are various reasons to fit skirting boards, and also reasons not to use skirting boards.

The OP has a Utility Room, and the walls are finished in a skim of Gypsum Hardwall Plaster.

Usually a Utility Room would have a Washing Machine and Dryer and Sink and worktop and Ironing facilities etc.

I would always specify Skirting boards in a Utility Room.

The skirting boards protect the Gypsum plaster from damage - where it meets the concrete floor.

The walls are usually finished in water based Emulsion paint and the skirting boards are usually finished in Oil paint.

Brushing and mopping the floor may cause stains on the skirting boards which can be washed off with a soft cloth.

Scuff marks on the skirting boards may need to be painted over, without having to repaint the walls.

C. Eastwood

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120102652#Comment_120102652

If the Builder is instructed to carry out any building works, which are subsequently deemed to not have been necessary- then the builder is legally entitled to full payment for such Works.

The_B_Man

The builders are back today. Was just chatting to them.

All they're doing is removing the dashing from around the doors. They're gonna seal it with shower silicone, then a layer of sand/cement, and then when that's dried in a few days, come back and do another layer of silicone.

You can see the gaps in the photo below. This will be filled with silicone and then covered with cement, like what they had on the step.

They've also exposed the step, and said they'll probably put a decline on it. They said there's no damp course under the door coz the door is plastic/PVC so won't absorb water, or suck it up like a wooden door, and that they wouldn't be able to put the cement on a damp course as it wouldn't stick.

I asked about the DPM and DPC overlapping. They said thats for when u have blocks with a gap between the outer and inner walls, not for cavity blocks. He said something about 13 inch work vs 9 inch work.

And finally, they're digging up the corner inside where the wet patch is. They've found some dampness on the DPM. I asked the guy how is that fixed. He said he didn't know and will have to ask the boss.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120114955#Comment_120114955

You have to lap DPC/DPM in all walls. If anything it’s more important in 9” cavity block walls.

They literally don’t have a clue. Hold on to your money.

TheW1zard

The builder doesn't know, he'll have to ask his boss..

C. Eastwood

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120114955#Comment_120114955

These Plonkers don’t have a clue.

They are telling you a load of porkiest.

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120114955#Comment_120114955

They are taking the p1ss at this stage. Not only have they carried out a botched job on the original build but they are now doing nothing that will remedy the problems and telling you a litany of lies into the bargain.

As has been stated over and over in this thread you need to engage a professional (architect, engineer, technician, surveyor) to examine the works and deal with the contractor.

The_B_Man

I've a friend who's an architect. Gonna talk to him later.

Your man said there was no radon barrier in the corner. I'd imagine there's none at all, not just that corner. So he's put a radon barrier down for the corner and said "Hopefully that'll fix it". It's currently being cemented back up.

muffler

In fairness radon barriers/sump don't have to be fitted in a shed/garage but advisable if you were ever going to use it as a home office or living accommodation in the future.

mickdw

No membrane under door cause it's upvc and doesn't soak up water.

At that point, you should have pointed then directly at the gate.

They are laughing at you.

The_B_Man

They have the membrane up to the door and have it folded back. But he said they don't have a damp proof course. Although on the other door into the utility room, I've a photo showing they have the DPC on the door frame.

I was talking to a couple of them. Mostly the senior fella, who's carpenter so i wouldn't expect him to be the expert on that stuff.

The annoying thing is they cemented over the corner damp patch. Dug it down to the "hardcore" layer. But now the concrete will be a darker colour and probably won't show up any damp patches.

But then the question is, what did he actually do? Is the radon barrier damp proof? All he did was replace the concrete so is there any logic in this? How does this stop water?

TheW1zard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120115723#Comment_120115723

Put the hose on the wall again, see if it comes in.

byrne249

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120115408#Comment_120115408

I know very little about building, but this made me burst out laughing, thanks for the entertainment at least! Sorry for your troubles with the build.

Honestly, at that point you need to ask them to leave, stop what they are doing, and get someone in who knows what the craic is

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120115723#Comment_120115723

Radon barrier is impermeable.

I'm pretty sure the radon barrier is used instead of a normal DPM when the radon protection is required (as in, you don't need both), so if he said there's no radon barrier in the corner that presumably means there's part of the floor that had no DPM at all.

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120116736#Comment_120116736

Correct.

C. Eastwood

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120115265#Comment_120115265

Totally in agreement with this comment.

C. Eastwood

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120115723#Comment_120115723

A DPM prevents ground moisture rising in to the floor of the room. It is a waterproof membrane. However Radon Gas can pass through a DPM.

A Radon Barrier prevents Radon gas rising from the ground in to the building. It is also a moisture barrier.

However, a Radon Barrier must terminate at the external edge of the Concrete Block wall.

Kincora2017

I’d imagine a professional wouldnt touch this with a barge pole. It’s a nearly impossible scenario for them seeing as it appears there was no written contract (could be wrong) and the OP has only a little bit of retention held back. They can’t force these cowboys to do the remedial work out of the goodness of their heart.

It may be that the best a professional can do is give a scope of remedial works, or a spec for these works that complies with thr building regs, and from then on I’d imagine it’d be up to the OP to deal with the builders. My two cents is there are 2 options, neither of which are very palatable.

1. Cut your losses option. get rid of them now, withold the last amount and pay a competent builder to do the remedial works.
2. No more mr nice guy option. Get the scope of remedial works from a pro and retain if possible to act as your agent. Depending how it goes make it clear that you’re willing to take this as far as possible I.e small claims court etc as there is a verbal contract which they’ve broken by the sub standard nature of the works. From my experience of dealing with cowboys this option rarely, if ever, works as it’s rarely worth the hassle.

Still stihl waters 3

No one in their right mind would come in after a cowboy like that to remedy the problems he caused, you'd never see the end of it

standardg60

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120116736#Comment_120116736

That's what i'm thinking too, assume when the builder said Radon barrier he meant Dpm, and OP said they dug down to hardcore which supports that. Can't believe they left a corner with nothing.

The fix on the doorframe is nonsense, they don't seem to understand that the blocks laid for the threshold are the conduit for the damp evident inside. And the flashing detail needs to extend all around, the builder only flashed the area where the OP ran the hose, it's obvious what would happen if he ran it elsewhere.

The_B_Man

No I was there looking over his shoulder. There is a DPM. It was wet. He said he wasn't sure how to fix it so there was some standing around and i had to get the kids from school so I left. When i came back he was putting in a square of a radon barrier. He left the roll there and i had his colleague turn up today to collect it, and he said it was a radon barrier. So now there's a DPM and a square of radon barrier in top.

You can see the black radon barrier there.

Still stihl waters 3

I've only ever seen red radon barrier

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120122224#Comment_120122224

Mostly red, or red and black, but there is black only radon barrier.

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120122090#Comment_120122090

You cant patch a radon barrier/membrane or a DPM by simply cutting a piece of the floor away, dropping it in and refilling. If the DPM is wet then you do have serious issues as the the water is on top of the membrane instead of underneath it.

Kincora2017

OP I feel for you. These lads are absolutely clueless. Whatever you do from now on you absolutely must not give them another cent. Nothing they’re doing or proposing to do are adequate remedial works.

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120122090#Comment_120122090

A radon barrier on top of another DPM is entirely pointless as far as moisture is concerned.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120124360#Comment_120124360

It probably serves to deflect the moisture if it's coming off the wall anyhow. So they "made the problem go away".

10-10-20

Well lads, I had to second-glance at this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYUM4ixOIfk&t=37s

I thought it was our new build!

Has Roger lost his marbles? An Aco isn't going to fix that load of crap! Then he says "not necessarily the builder's fault if they were just obeying orders", well...