Hate speech on boards.ie

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120092056#Comment_120092056

The problem is those are personal type sentiments which of course are perfectly valid to the poster but may not have popular support or be in any way reasonable. Each to their own

Count Dracula

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097408#Comment_120097408

not everything that is muttered warrants respect, no matter what orifice it dribbles out of....

please take heed?

Guess_Who

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097062#Comment_120097062

"Boards was definitely more of an echo chamber back in the day, but it was an awful lot more fun, weird and wacky back then too"

You admit that you liked it better when views that YOU found objectionable were not tolerated so people who thought like you were allowed to be "fun weird and wacky"!!

Anyone that disagrees with you should "find somewhere else to play".

That is a stark admission and one you might need to reflect on and perhaps take your own advice.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097133#Comment_120097133

Are you ok?

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097447#Comment_120097447

Seriously as if I'm going to respond to that type of gibberish

Count Dracula

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097529#Comment_120097529

like you just did?

anything else up there you would like to extoll at this point?

might be best to get it all out now?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097462#Comment_120097462

Nothing stark about it. It was a lot more fun.

A lot of your flamebaiting posts would not have been allowed.

What's the problem? Why do you want to fight all the time? It sounds like you want to wage war on the "fun, weird and whacky". Boards used to be a social site, not a discussion forum. And it was more fun. There was sites like mumsnet and stormfront where my views weren't welcome, so I stayed away. As I keep on saying, the internet is a very, very, very big place. Why do you think you're entitled to be a part of every community on it?

Guess_Who

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097587#Comment_120097587

Why do I think I am entitled to be part of the boards community?

Because I have every right to be.

Why do you think that because you don't like what I have to say, that I should go somewhere else? You mentioned you stay away from sites where your views aren't welcome. Well my views are welcome here. Not by everyone, but certainly some people do appreciate what I have to say.

I don't want to fight all the time, but if I see someone make a point which I strongly disagree with, I will, like you, give a counter opinion.

Can you give an example of flamebait? Because as far as I can see, flamebait is a term used to describe a post which intentionally angers someone. Now that's a little silly. Just because you get angry that I disagree with you and refuse to allow your opinion go unchallenged is not flamebait. Just because you get upset, doesn't make it flamebait.

The difference is, you want counter opinions to go away to their own echo chamber so you can have yours.

I don't like engaging in echo chambers.

,

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097698#Comment_120097698

You don't like engaging in echo chambers? Cool, in that case, OG boards wouldn't have suited you. I don't like engaging with terfs, so I stay away from Mumsnet.

I'm happy to see you know what the definition of flamebaiting is, less so to see you not realize you do it a lot.

"Just because you get upset, doesn't make it flamebait". Actually, yes, yes it does. That misunderstanding is on you, not me. It was a level of civility on OG boards that we didn't intentionally set out to make someone upset. If you didn't like it, there's other places to play.

Oh and btw, you don't have every right to be here, neither do I. It's a free site, now owned by a company that needs to make it profitable, and as far as I can see, allowing the angry posters and turning it into an antagonists paradise probably means more visits/posts and dollar bucks.

But I'm out, I volunteered my time as a mod for 20 odd years, had a lot of fun, but now boards has morphed into something that is making the world a worse place, and I don't want to help it anymore. My account should be deleted soon.

yourdeadwright

Sounds like someone was having a debate & there point of view was picked apart by common sense,

So the next step is to cry FOUL ,

Guess_Who

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097732#Comment_120097732

Well your posts upset me... So by your definition, you have engaged in flamebaiting. I almost always never intend to upset people, but if people happen to take offence to my posts, then the offence is taken and not given. I don't feel obligated to pander to your sensibilities just because you happen to not like my opinion. Much as I wouldn't expect you to do so either.

Robust, diverse and sometimes uncomfortable, conversation is healthy. Echo chambers are not.

The difference is, I don't want you to be silenced or expect you to run away to your own safe space where you can not be offended by other peoples "bad" opinions.

But if that is the path you wish to take, then I wish you well. It is odd to continue posting to what you feel is a world worsening site just because your account isn't deleted yet. Seems a little self flagellating.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097769#Comment_120097769

Who are you to tell me to stop posting?

Oh, the irony.

As for me flamebaiting you, possibly, yes. But back in the day, you would have reported, I would have received a pm from a mod, I'd apologise and we'd move on and talk about something less contentious.

"If people happen to take offence to my posts, then the offence is taken and not given"

That's b*llshit and you know it. I know when someone is going to take offence at a post, because I live in a civil society and I know what affects people. If you don't, that's on you. Just stop trying to be offensive.

"I don't feel obligated to pander to your sensibilities just because you happen to not like my opinion."

Again, you constantly throw civility out the window. You're a troll. A good one, I'll admit. I won't say you go out of your way to be a troll, I think they are firmly held beliefs, but I don't see what good, positive force they bring to the site.

Robust, diverse and sometimes uncomfortable, conversation is healthy. Echo chambers are not.

Why? Why can I not have a fun site where flamebaiting and trolls are not tolerated? What change is fighting here bringing to the world? We had lots of fun before the site was sold. Santa Strike Force was healthy, The table quizzes were healthy, the mods beers were healthy, the football team was healthy, the drama group was healthy etc. etc. Would I feel comfortable and safe meeting new boardsies at an open event these days? probably not.

"The difference is, I don't want you to be silenced or expect you to run away to your own safe space where you can not be offended by other peoples "bad" opinions."

Again, horsesh*t. You want to win. You feel you have THE RIGHT to post here, I'm saying you don't (Neither do I), it's a privilege and privilege's can be taken away if you don't play ball.

"It is odd to continue posting to what you feel is a world worsening site just because your account isn't deleted yet. Seems a little self flagellating."

There's literally no need for that snippet at the end, yet you put it in. Talk about lack of self control and civility!

I don't wish you well. I hope you push yourself over the line and get sitebanned. I don't see any positives that your style of posting brings to the site. (That is a complete attack on the poster, as I rose to his flamebait. Something that wouldn't have happened years ago as we both would have been told to cool the jets by now.)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097133#Comment_120097133

I’d have left that one in drafts lad

Guess_Who

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097868#Comment_120097868

"Who are you to tell me to stop posting?

Oh, the irony."

I never told you to stop posting... I didn't say anything remotely like that. In fact, I said the opposite.

"As for me flamebaiting you, possibly, yes. But back in the day, you would have reported, I would have received a pm from a mod, I'd apologise and we'd move on and talk about something less contentious"

A rather unique admission that your posting standards were intentionally baiting. I appreciate your honesty.

"That's b*llshit and you know it. I know when someone is going to take offence at a post, because I live in a civil society and I know what affects people. If you don't, that's on you. Just stop trying to be offensive."

A little odd to claim civility while using words like bullshit and then claiming that I am the one being offensive??

"Again, you constantly throw civility out the window. You're a troll. A good one, I'll admit. I won't say you go out of your way to be a troll, I think they are firmly held beliefs, but I don't see what good, positive force they bring to the site."

This again is a little strange. You acknowledge that I have firmly held beliefs, but because you don't like them, you don't see them as positive or good? And because of that I am a troll? And you claim that I am the one being uncivil? It's also against site rules to accuse people of trolling I thought.

"Why? Why can I not have a fun site where flamebaiting and trolls are not tolerated? What change is fighting here bringing to the world? We had lots of fun before the site was sold. Santa Strike Force was healthy, The table quizzes were healthy, the mods beers were healthy, the football team was healthy, the drama group was healthy etc. etc. Would I feel comfortable and safe meeting new boardsies at an open event these days? probably not"

Because by your admission, you have engaged in flamebaiting. So you expect people to live by standards you do not apply to yourself.

You accuse me of fighting, I am not. I am discussing.

The fact that you do not feel safe meeting new boards members because they do not think like you do or have differing opinions than you do is a problem YOU have to deal with. I have no issue engaging with people who think differently. I actually enjoy it. Its a great way to learn and grow.

"Again, horsesh*t. You want to win. You feel you have THE RIGHT to post here, I'm saying you don't (Neither do I), it's a privilege and privilege's can be taken away if you don't play ball"

More of this civility that you keep talking about. I don't want to win. Win what exactly? I want my opinion to be heard and considered and to participate in conversations. Nothing more, nothing less.

"There's literally no need for that snippet at the end, yet you put it in. Talk about lack of self control and civility!"

I refer you to the language you used in this response and to the accusations of trolling and the admission of purposely flaming.

"I don't wish you well. I hope you push yourself over the line and get sitebanned. I don't see any positives that your style of posting brings to the site. (That is a complete attack on the poster, as I rose to his flamebait. Something that wouldn't have happened years ago as we both would have been told to cool the jets by now.)"

I'm not a fan of your style of posting, nor have I seen anything in your posts that I agree with, but I don't want you to be prevented from getting your opinion across.

That's the difference.

But somehow I am uncivil.

Boards.ie: Mike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058279050/hate-speech-on-boards-ie

When a user signs up to boards.ie they agree to terms of use. Which among other things states that you are expected to act reasonably when posting on boards.ie. You the user agree through use of this service, NOT to use boards.ie to:

-Treat others with disrespect.

-Defame, abuse, harass, stalk, threaten or otherwise violate the rights of others.

-Post any abusive, harmful, vulgar, obscene, sexually explicit, indecent, profane, inappropriate, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable material.

-Post material that contains violence, or offensive subject matter

Everyone is responsible for the words that they post up here. Regardless of their views or opinions everyone is expected to be respectful and to the follow terms outlined above. Hate Speech although not directly stated surely comes under this. It is derived from these negative comments designed to shut people down and intimidate them. This should not be tolerated at any level virtually or otherwise.

Boards is a platform that allows and encourages healthy discussion debate and advice. Countless users have found the information they need, happiness and a good laugh. I know I certainly have since I joined. It is sometimes darkened by the behaviours of a few. This doesn't however have to dictate the mood here.

We can be left, right, middle, up or down. We should all be able to post our views and opinions allowing for healthy discussion and debate, to get help or advice or whatever we are searching for without being subjected to directed attack or abuse.

To allow the site to function properly we have a great team of volunteer Moderators and Admins who freely give up there time to facilitate this site. There are procedures and processes in place which they all follow and apply on a case by case basis. With all the information they have to hand, both past and present.

In short the fundamental rules have always been.

-Be Civil.

-Attack the post. Not the poster.

-In an ode to the original ethos "Don’t be a dick"

If we could all play the game by the rules without "flame baiting", uncivil, hateful, directed negative comments then healthy debate and discussion can resume.

Board is not about taking sides or promoting/obstructing views or opinions. I hope this post serves as a reminder of what Boards should be and we can move forward allowing everybody to enjoy the space together.

-Mike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097998#Comment_120097998

Lovely platitudes Mike, but flamebaiting and trolling are constantly allowed and pandered to.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097942#Comment_120097942

I figured out the correct way to read your responses. In the style of Tucker Carlson's whining and needling. It suits perfectly.

Guess_Who

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120098058#Comment_120098058

Again, your post is a contradiction.

You bemoan the fact that flamebaiting and trolling is allowed, and then proceed to just insult me, with absolutely no reference to anything in our discussion, presumably to provoke a response and that I will respond in kind. As you said earlier

"I hope you push yourself over the line and get sitebanned."

EmmetSpiceland

A lot of the “hate speech” on this site is usually wrapped up in the racist, transphobe, bigot, misogynist, homophobe’s favourite camouflage, the ubiquitous nuance. The gravitational lens hinting at the “dark matter” behind it.

What I, personally, find very odd is how upset these guys get when they get called out for what they are. I’m fully aware that there is a strange “quirk” on the site where you can’t call a racist/transphobe/bigot/misogynist/homophobe etc. a racist, transphobe, bigot, misogynist or a homophobe but it does happen and when it does, boy, do they kick off. It’s like they’ve been shot!

For me, as stated previously, I think it would really benefit the site if it could all be contained in the “Current Affairs” forum, there’s no real place for it in other, more normal, parts of the site. There is far too much “cross contamination” going on in AH.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097998#Comment_120097998

You should have a read of the Russia thread..

Guess_Who

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120098107#Comment_120098107

I think that is an oversimplification Emmet.

I think the issue stems from the fact that the terms 'phobe, bigot or a racist etc are more often than not used incorrectly and people who are at the other end of those accusations are rightly agitated by it, because they also find actual 'phobes, bigots and racists to be disgusting.

For a lot of people, anyone who doesn't view the world EXACTLY like they do, any deviation or concern about an issue is immediately chalked down to bigotry, racism or one of the many phobias.

Being not on-board with primary school curriculum to teach about transgenderism is enough to get labelled a transphobe

Having issues with illegal immigration is enough to be accused of racism.

So of course when people are accused of something they are not, they will react accordingly.

And as for you seeing all this  "ubiquitous nuance" and the "gravitational lens hinting at the “dark matter” behind it", perhaps it's because you are trying too hard to read bad intention towards people who just simply have a different opinion than you.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120097998#Comment_120097998

Actually Mike,

What is the current policy in boards regarding the existence of trans individuals?

There's so much fighting because some people say, "trans women are women" and others say, "Trans women cannot be or are women".

I have a friend who is a trans woman, and this is an example of abusive behaviour on boards.

In Ireland we have the Gender Recognition Act 2015, which should have put that discussion to bed. Debating the existence of trans individuals or whether trans women are women should be against the rules of this site.

If there is no policy, then you should look into it, because there are many things that are not up for discussion on boards, but for some reason abusing trans people (who already have it stacked against them) is given free reign.

Chips Lovell

The "nothing should be off limits, if you disagree with something you should argue against it not have it shut down" argument only sounds reasonable on the most superficial of levels. That's because if you take this approach, there will be a coterie of people who'll gleefully take advantage of it and drag everything down to the lowest common denominator. You want to have a polite discussion about the issues of the day and you find yourself having to argue against assertions that the Jews are trying to take over the world or black people are less intelligent than white people or whatever.

There's only a small minority of people who'd have any stomach for this kind of carry on. The rest just stop showing up and the place gets dragged down into the mire.

In short, there is a line. There are some debates that have been resolved and anyone attempting to reopen them is just being malicious. If you really want to be one of those people, then go somewhere else. It's not like there's any shortage of alternatives.

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120091892#Comment_120091892

"Don't be a dick" was an extremely nebulous guideline. But without a doubt, the biggest problem facing the site (and every other social media platform) is the reality of posters who are only interested in scoring internet points and looking to "win" something, rather than actually having a discussion about a given matter. This has only become worse in recent years where everything has to be boiled down to a simplistic left/right playing field.

Far too often any real discussion value is completely lost and drowned out by the noise of people's petty political viewpoints which inevitably ends up obscuring information in favour of grandstanding and, as you say, "shiting" on others.

In saying that, Boards is still a place where a decent discussion can still be had, especially in comparison with other platforms. But the number of good threads where a level headed discussion is present is outweighed by the number of threads that have descended into gibberish.

Jequ0n

You got to love how a general thread on hate speech has turned again into another trans one…because that’s seemingly all that matters.

If this is such a contentious topic then maybe all trans relevant discussions should be moved into the appropriate forum. This is getting as ridiculous as accusing posters of trolling just because they have a different opinion.

Women should not be forced to agree that transwomen are the same as us. That is completely undermining of women and our experiences and history. Transwomen are transwomen.

Guess_Who

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120098168#Comment_120098168

If that is to be the case, I suggest that perhaps any discussion regarding anything remotely to do with trans, should be moved to the LGBT forum, where the posting rules ensure the safe space that you are looking for.

I don't think it would be healthy or useful to have any discussion where people would not have the ability to discuss biological reality without infraction.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120098224#Comment_120098224

There was a whole page or so about Ukraine and Russia, but you carry on with your cherry picking.

all I see on this thread is a lot of crying about things that were said by people other people didn’t like. But is that not exactly the point of boards, sharing topics and discussing those topics, including individual opinions.

Seems like you’re being a bit of a crybaby if you’re that upset someone called you an idiot or whatever. I admit it’s not as clever as the old way where you’d say “your post is an idiot” but it’s like the site can’t win sometimes

Before it was too heavy handed in moderation now there’s not enough (which I agree there could be more) but when things got a bit heated before you’d almost hit “post” and be refreshing the inbox waiting for a PM with a warning or whatever haha. Point being I think a bit of tolerance to rather mild things like calling someone an idiot for saying something stupid isn’t any harm. If something being said is that upsetting you have a plethora or options to ignore and avoid it.

Obviously now I’m not excusing being racist or whatever but at the same time it’s hardly the place to be accusing anyone of anything based on online posts. For example I don’t necessarily think because someone is ignorant regarding the use of pronouns for example that they’re a transphobic. I think you’re an idiot but I’m not allowed say that either so.

My best advice really to anyone who has a big problem is to log off and do something else. unfortunately it’s not for you if you get triggered whenever you read something you don’t like. I don’t mean boards i mean the internet at large. I don’t understand why we’re where we are these days, but time was someone said something you found distasteful you just stopped talking to that person, now everyone wants the lynched and excluded from society.

People have stupid opinions and in some cases downright disgraceful borderline dangerous ones, they will share them (unfortunately) it really is a matter of what you choose to engage with. To me it seems more like some folks are just ticked off they can’t either change their mind or have them silenced permanently by admins, which is stupid. Just because a poster has some **** opinions on something you feel passionate about doesn’t mean they need to be silenced either. It’s their will not to be more educated on the topic, move on.

Sure it was a few weeks ago or so someone had said Fine Dining is pretentious and stupid, I work in a Michelin restaurant and would like that poster banned permanently for hate speech.

Grow up a bit lads

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120098168#Comment_120098168

Just to be clear on one thing, abusing trans people on boards.ie is absolutely not given "free reign" on this site, and as a former mod I know that you know this.

Discussions may not be completely closed down to the level that you desire, but to say there's no action taken against transphobia is false.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120098253#Comment_120098253

If one forum is necessary to be a "safe space" for a topic, then you acknowledge there is a need for a safe space as it is currently unsafe on the wider site. Thanks.

As a say, this website was pretty close to a safe space, not any more.

I don't care what you think about discussion on boards.ie. We have different viewpoints.

I personally don't believe you are interested in discussion, but are interested in point scoring.

Can you point out one time you publicly changed your mind on a topic after being presented with facts? Or even apologised to someone publicly for getting something wrong?