PPS & PS Card Application - no photoID

Discodog

I am trying to help an neighbour who wouldn't be good with online. He is Irish but was adopted unofficially in the UK - now aged in his 60s. He needs a PS Card to apply for a provisional license but doesn't have a PPS number. He also doesn't have any photo ID but does have proof of Irish address etc. Has anyone else experienced this ? Looking online he needs a PPS number in order to apply for the PS Card.

Dempo1

Hi , this is not going to be straightforward unfortunately. You mention your friend was illegally adopted in the UK and was born in Ireland 🤔. I'm involved with Tusla in a search for my own records albeit slightly different situation. There is now a right to birth information but your friend needs some info & ID to start that search.

I assume your friend worked and lived in the UK, Does he have any UK tax number, work history, pension entitlement , or was he only in the UK briefly 🤔

I'm happy for you to PM me re the Adoption situation as its quite complex.

I'll link the process for obtaining a PPS number below but identification required & POA also. He'll likely also need to start a long process of obtaining a birth cert ,assuming the one he has may not be correct 🤔

PM me if you wish

https://www.gov.ie/en/service/12e6de-get-a-personal-public-service-pps-number/

Discodog

Thank you for your advice & kind offer. He was bought to the UK as a baby to live with an "Aunt" - I suspect that he's illegitimate. There's no birth cert & no living relatives. I did find a link to a TD question that asked how ID would be established.

A Public Services Card (PSC) may be issued to a person who has successfully completed a SAFE 2 registration. As part of the SAFE registration process, a person’s identity is verified, usually by means of acceptable photographic ID.

Where an Irish citizen person does not have acceptable photographic ID, their identity may be verified by means of an interview process.

ML10 forms are issued in certain circumstances by a Garda for use by financial organisations for anti-money laundering purposes. However, the form is not, in itself, acceptable as evidence of identity for the purposes of SAFE registration.

I hope this clarifies the matter for the Deputy.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2018-03-20/930/#pq-answers-930

Dempo1

Morning, yes an interview process is an option but I would strongly recommend he engages with Tusla or a number of organisations helping with Birth Tracing. There has to be a record of his Birth and obtaining a Birth Cert is crucial.

You don't mention if he has work /Taxation record from the UK and this could be helpful if he does.

Without going into to much detail , I was brought up in residential care for 16 years, I do have a Birth cert & aware of a number of brothers & sisters living in Dublin & currently seeking records.

Whilst your neighbour may only be looking at a provisional licence, there are other supports available to him. If he presents with very little information when applying for a PPSN , I fear he'll run into obstacles & delays.

Discodog

I have been told that many births, especially illegitimate, weren't registered - in some cases because people didn't want to pay or travel to their nearest registrar. He was told not to pry into his past.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137898#Comment_120137898

Many weren't registered correctly and indeed illegally, hence the numerous mechanisms now in place to address these issues. Obviously your neighbour may not wish to go down this route and of course I respect this. But he should know there's numerous supports out there including redress and there's also pension entitlements, medical card etc .

I wish him well but feel he'll face obstacles without a Birth Cert & ID in relation to obtaining a PPSN number.

If he doesn't wish to go this route, he must have some record of his time in the UK, work, tax ,POA etc and these may help.

Cherry Blossom

My mum did an interview for PSC card two years ago, she is cognitively impaired but has a great grasp of things that happened many years ago 😂. The interview was not too invasive, she was able to confirm her work history, she has not driven for over 20 years and didn’t have any photographic id. Her issue was they had two separate sets of records under the same pps no. that had to be collated. I think before and after she was married. I don’t remember what she needed the psc card for, she had the old one with no photo. She does have a birth certificate though. I think she would have got nowhere without it. I accompanied her to the interview but I wouldn’t have been able to help with the questions they asked even if that was allowed, which it wasn’t. It wasn’t a long interview.

Dempo1

I'd imagine her work history and employer records helped with the process and especially her Birth Cert.

Folks would not believe how complicated things can get without a Birth certificate & sadly many people never had one or one that was not registered correctly.

I actually thought the requirement of having a PSC for non welfare applications was abandoned due to data protection commissioner decision but I see its still listed as a requirement on the NDLS website along with a verified mygovid account 🤔

gipi

I understand the requirement is only for online licence applications.

A face to face application appointment can be made at NDLS, and I think this gets around the PSC requirement.

Not sure it'll help the OP, as there seems to be limited documentation available.

Dempo1

I thought this myself 😏 and yes the lack of documentation will be a challenge, unfortunately.

Discodog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120140137#Comment_120140137

The NDLS require a PPS to book an appointment & then you have to bring photo id to the appointment.

https://www.ndls.ie/how-to-apply/applying-in-person.html#photo-id

TooTired123

There is confusion on this thread about the difference between a PPSN and a PSC.

Cherry Blossom

I think the OPs friend has neither.

Discodog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120141713#Comment_120141713

Correct. You need a PPS to book an appointment for the PSC. I am hoping that he can get an appointment to do both together as it's in the same building.