Time for a zero refugee policy? - Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24

Goldengirl · 12-06-2023 2:34pm

I am really surprised at posters here denigrating the IRC and telling other posters to open their homes for asylum seekers as I would have considered them very decent posters.

This type of rhetoric seems to be reserved for people you guys disagree with and it is a bit bullying tbh.

I would expect it from a few and would scroll on by.

When the next person who says this in relation to homelessness, fir example, how would you feel if I came back with a (not so smart, in my view) comment that you should house the homeless yourself?

Its not so clever and definitely not nice, is it?

lmimmfn · 12-06-2023 3:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120704968#Comment_120704968

So effectively now we are importing homeless people, the governments policies are an absolute disgrace, close the door!!!

enricoh · 12-06-2023 4:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120705804#Comment_120705804

Build it n they will come, maybe Roderick can translate into various languages as before to spread the good news!

We are not full n can do more- any figures on what 100k refugees are costing per annum. I know the government is spending 30mill a week on hotel accommodation. So 1.5 billion a yr for hotels. Your mosneys etc on top.

Any figures for the combined total- transport, medical cards, extra teachers, dole, modular homes at 280k a shot etc etc?

I see the government shot down a proposed e1000 tax credit suggested for workers in the upcoming budget. Bit pricey at a cost of 800 million. Billions upon billions no problem for our refugee industry tho.

Tim Robbins · 12-06-2023 4:46pm

I'd go the other way and have a goal that we should have at least 10% of our population coming from poorer countries.

For example, if there are 60k births here every year, at least 6k come from poorer countries.

If, we don't achieve that we no Irish person has right to emigrate to a richer country at any point, including when Ireland is in recession. What goes around, comes around.

_Kaiser_ · 12-06-2023 4:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120704767#Comment_120704767

Wrong. It says that members of the electorate feel so disenfranchised by "their" current Government and disillusioned by said Government's refusal to listen to public opinion and concerns that they hope changes at EU level will force a rethink.

It also speaks to how little real-world connection there is to the EU (beyond cheap holidays and not having to change your cash each time) that we are hoping an election in Germany might do the trick.

_Kaiser_ · 12-06-2023 5:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120704968#Comment_120704968

More accurately - why should we care what they think/say??

NGO says we aren't doing enough/need to do more.. boo hoo! What a surprise! Another take could be "NGO says we need to keep the gravy flowing in its direction"

But here's the thing.. I feel sorry for those people sure, but I don't feel obliged or responsible for solving their problems nor do I feel that their needs should be put ahead of anyone else in that situation.

If they aren't happy with our supports (and I can't blame them) there's a whole continent east of us that they can try/return to instead!

Goldengirl · 12-06-2023 5:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120705952#Comment_120705952

Seriously?

Nobody wants the return of the farright in Germany.

When talking AfD you are not discussing a rightwing party. One which conservative voters could support without any issues.

You are talking about extreme views and anti much more than immigration.

I don't believe anybody in Ireland would want this type of politics, except activists or some very regressive characters.

I would not have put you in this latter category. Conservative and right leaning yes, but not extreme.

_Kaiser_ · 12-06-2023 5:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706000#Comment_120706000

If it looks like they might have a real chance at winning an election and forming a Government, it may be enough to spur the more moderate parties into action to keep them out by shifting their own positions on certain issues - after all, FG in particular are obsessed with SF and the idea of them winning an election.. so much so that Leo is promising giveaways in the upcoming budget!

No one wants a far right Government - but if the moderates won't listen to their electorate that's what'll happen. This isn't scaremongering. There's historical precedent for it not all that long ago in the scheme of things!

RobbieTheRobber · 12-06-2023 5:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120705952#Comment_120705952

Oddly specific generalisation there kaiser.

🤣🤣

_Kaiser_ · 12-06-2023 5:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120705996#Comment_120705996

Nope - countries can only do so much and those efforts must not be at the expense or neglect of those who will be asked to pay for it or compromise on their own standards of living and access to essential services to deliver it.

I repeat - I feel sympathy for those people yes... but I don't feel responsible for their problems, nor obligated to support the running of our country off a(nother) cliff to solve their issues either.

_Kaiser_ · 12-06-2023 5:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706024#Comment_120706024

If you mean the package holiday/currency conversion reference then yep :) Let's face it, for most people here that's about the limit of their day-to-day engagement with the EU. Whether some like it or not, we have a lot more in common with our nearest neighbours than we do the "mainland".

It's a huge failing of the EU political structure, but then there IS no "European" identity in the first place in the sense that Americans would consider themselves "Americans" first - here we are Irish, Italian, German etc over and above any sense of EU solidarity or "belonging".

And that ultimately I think is why it'll fail because as we saw during the Financial crisis and even the early days of the refugees floating across the Med, when push comes to shove, each nation will look out for its own interests first!

Gen.Zhukov · 12-06-2023 5:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120705241#Comment_120705241

Of course they need medical help after the ordeal they have been through.

What ordeal?

Are these ordeals like - suffering the effects of chlorine filled barrel bombs dropped from helicopters in cities in Albania, Georgia and South Africa, or the ordeals like getting a couple of flights and being exhausted by the physical act of tearing up a passport?

Goldengirl · 12-06-2023 5:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706021#Comment_120706021

Well I am glad to see..

"Noone wants a farright government" in that post because I was beginning to think people had gone a bit mad here!

Yes, current crowd need a kick up the hvle, but electing those dangerous bxxtarxs is not the way to go (not talking SF here as they haven't shown their hand .. yet :)).

I can only say I will vote for whomever proposes or sorts this issue.. Along with housing, healthcare, disability services....

This issue while important would not be the main decider for me anyway, and I think that I am not on my own here, on which party I vote for..

_Kaiser_ · 12-06-2023 5:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706051#Comment_120706051

I am taking the above as sincere and well intentioned, and fair play to you for that.

But I'm afraid that in the real world, things don't work that way. Compromises and choices have to be made. Those are influenced by local politics and lobbying and yes, money. In that world we can't even provide (and haven't for decades now!) adequate services for those already here and in need of them - let alone tens of thousands of others!

Reality will always trump ideology and good intentions unfortunately!

Patrick2010 · 12-06-2023 5:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120705904#Comment_120705904

Not this rubbish again, the Irish emigrated to countries by legally applying for visas, not hopping on a plane and applying for asylum.

Goldengirl · 12-06-2023 5:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706058#Comment_120706058

Maybe not our generation.... sorry might be generalising ages here.

But our children have grown up with the euro, EU funding for infrastructure, EU equality laws and social democracy values, EU funded college placements and Erasmus years.

They consider themselves Irish first, but identify also as European.

It is not a cultural takeover but it is a slow generational change in identity.

JP Liz V1 · 12-06-2023 5:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120705804#Comment_120705804

We have record number homeless and you want us to take in more, these are all not fleeing war, they are coming from safe countries all the way to freebie Ireland, some are from long term settlements in UK and France etc., as Ireland has more on offer, it has got to stop as our services will not be able to cope

This government really needs to start listening to the people and acting on their behalf

_Kaiser_ · 12-06-2023 5:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706121#Comment_120706121

Generalise away.. I know I'm no spring chicken 😂 Or as my son calls it, rapidly approaching half a century!

I think you're overstating the EU's influence though. Yes all those things exist, but children don't think about where funding comes from, or the Euro being anything more than a way to buy stuff or a convenience if on holiday in the Zone. If anything, I think they generally stick together more abroad in the safety of their familiar identity rather than taking on some new European persona.

Maybe I'm wrong! Maybe I'll be back here in a decade to say that my offspring is a fully realised EU citizen (well assuming this site exists by then which is probably as uncertain as the EU itself making it that far!), but I doubt it. The same divisions, grudges and alliances are still there at State levels and this is getting worse as they expand the Bloc.

Personally I think we'll end up with a two-tier EU (it arguably already exists as we saw with the treatment of some countries during the financial crisis), or more Brexit scenarios and a second grouping formed - but it will be made or broken on how the institution handles crisis like this one and the next financial challenge (given that these things are circular).

But I'm more concerned about how the folly of our current position is going to affect not just the immediate and near term resources and stability of this country, but the long term future and opportunities for people like my son and others. Those who are entitled to expect their home to support and give them chances just as we had.

Goldengirl · 12-06-2023 5:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706065#Comment_120706065

Don't think he was referring to people from those countries.

But fair dues you pointed them out :)

Goldengirl · 12-06-2023 6:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706188#Comment_120706188

Again fundamentally agree.

I despair that my kids will be able to do anything more than emigrate to live away from home the way housing is now.

We came up against the EU identity thing recently when one child could not attend the university of his choice because UK was no longer in the EU and with a raft of sprogs we just couldn't afford the fees plus accomodation for it..

Ended up in an excellent uni on the continent, just not the first choice.

Its those specifics that emphasise the EU ness now and again.

Others away in Canada and Oz atm, and yeah, they are Irish and do blend with their UK cousins more easily I agree.

StrawbsM · 12-06-2023 6:25pm

“Nobody wants a far right government”

Well obviously many citizens in different European countries do. How else do these political parties get into a position where they could form a government other than a majority of “nobodies” voting for them?

In the next local, European and general elections, I will be giving full consideration to all parties/persons that are right of centre. I must admit that I never gave much thought to the allegiances within the European Parliament but I will do next time. I will not be voting for the current coalition or any left of centre party/politician.

Did you know that Giorgia Meloni who is the “far right” leader of the Italian government topped the approval ratings of all European leaders? She also ranked highest in the approval ratings of the G7. I know Italy goes through a ridiculous amount of governments but so far the country hasn’t imploded having the “far right” leading it.

Edit: predictive text error

end of the road · 12-06-2023 6:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706296#Comment_120706296

they get in by promising jam tomorrow and all sorts of stuff they have no intention or ability to deliver.

or in the case of the uk getting enough votes to be the first passed the post.

far right, alt right, right of centre parties will never deliver what you want.

by all means don't vote for FFG but forget about any right of centre or further right parties, they are a bunch of jokers that will wreck the country.

Patrick2010 · 12-06-2023 6:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706366#Comment_120706366

Suspect that if left parties like pbp and politicians like Paul Murphy get voted in you'll be a while waiting for them doing anything

StrawbsM · 12-06-2023 6:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706366#Comment_120706366

As I said, I will be giving them all serious consideration.

JP Liz V1 · 12-06-2023 6:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706176#Comment_120706176

By leaving every John Joe from anywhere in, isn't sending a good message either, a task force and stricter enforcement on entry is needed and if refused asap deportation

end of the road · 12-06-2023 7:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120706390#Comment_120706390

possibly, possibly not.

or they may do a lot of stuff but stuff that we may not always necessarily agree with.

either way though, they are a far better bet then the jokers on the right who have had plenty of opportunities to deliver but have failed, every time.

Patrick2010 · 12-06-2023 7:19pm

See the problem is that Irish people are very positive in trying to help people in poor situations but like everyone, no one likes to feel they are being taken advantage of. Why on earth should we be taking Georgians and Albanians who clearly view us as a soft touch.