Time for a zero refugee policy? - Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24

Red Silurian · 23-10-2023 3:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273474#Comment_121273474

By comparison to the USA, yes, by comparison to the rest of the EU, not really

malinheader · 23-10-2023 3:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121274525#Comment_121274525

Totally agree 100%.

And If we can't enforce proper deportation, and we haven't the resources should we of been taking in immigrants until we have proper logistics set up.

Ukrainians coming in was a different scenario because you can't plan for a war. But the way we just operate an open borders policy for others immigrants just shows what a total disregard for their own citizens this government has.

Proper solution then we can both agree on is close our taking of immigrants until we're properly set up and as many as possible illegal immigrants here already deported. Then start a proper immigration process to take in the skills set we need, like we were told a long time ago. Doctors and engineers, remember that.

Potatoeman · 23-10-2023 4:16pm

I was watching the real time with Bill Maher, he is a left leaning Democrat. He was discussing the refugee problem in New York and the population are not happy, 120k refugees there now and nowhere to put them . Community halls taken over and the airport’s turned into refugee centers. One of his guests said that “we need to apologise to Texas”. It seems the southern states are sending migrants on buses to sanctuary cities. It’s amazing watch this compared to two years ago. A complete turnaround on the topic. It’s amazing how fast things change and opinions flip. A complete one eighty.

thinkabouit · 23-10-2023 4:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121274840#Comment_121274840

I’m thinking in the context of a small country with a population less than Manchester!! Where businesses can’t get staff apparently!!

Mullaghteelin · 23-10-2023 6:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121274398#Comment_121274398

and yet when the American voters decide they don't want to continue funding and fighting wars, western media and politicians freak about America becoming isolationist.

The anti-intervention presidential candidates are condemned or treated as nutjobs.

It turns out western politicians do want the USA to be world's policeman, provided it fights the battles they want it to.

mistersifter · 23-10-2023 6:24pm

If immigration officers know which flight the chancer came off then they can issue removal instructions to the airline and send the person back. Unfortunately it doesn't happen enough though and the passengers are just taken into the asylum system here , even if it is known that they have previously achieved asylum in another EU country.

mistersifter · 23-10-2023 6:28pm

There's also a process whereby a person is refused entry to the state at the border, but will be allowed into open custody and told to come back to the airport in a few days/weeks to be deported.

I'd love to know how many of these orders are issued and complied with. Would be an interesting question to put to the minister for justice.

malinheader · 23-10-2023 6:33pm

Is there many illegal immigrants arriving by plane though. If so.

How can they board a flight to Ireland with no documentation.

If anyone lands in Ireland by plane and presents themselves with no documentation surely the airline has to be held accountable and should be able to verify what identification was used when boarding the plane.

mistersifter · 23-10-2023 6:47pm

Yep, most are arriving by plane. They board the planes with documents and destroy the documents during the flight. The airline don't check their documents as they get off the plane, so they arrive at passport control without any ID. Then they say they don't know where they came from, lie about their identities, origins, say they're minors when they're not, in order to get into the asylum system. Once in the system they're probably not leaving.

Strazdas · 23-10-2023 7:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275575#Comment_121275575

in many cases, they are tearing up fake ID i.e. false passports. But that does not necessarily mean they are bogus asylum seekers. It's estimated that 40% of genuine refugees don't possess a passport and have never held one

jack of all · 23-10-2023 7:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275691#Comment_121275691

Ah sure that's ok so, often wondered about that...

Anyway I have a feeling the game will soon be up for this nonsense; sad to see how business owners and residents in Midleton etc had to beg for assistance after flooding when hundreds of millions is being squandered on this charade.

mistersifter · 23-10-2023 7:21pm

Yeah, they might be ripping up fake passports or real ones. Or they might be ripping up real passports that don't belong to them with a photo that looks like them.

Or they might have managed to board a flight with an EU Travel Document i.e. a passport-type document issued to refugees. Travel documents require visas but sometimes airline staff don't realise this and let them board without the visa (airlines can be fined for this).

Either way, they arrive at the border and their intention is to deceive because most are coming from safe places.

Strazdas · 23-10-2023 7:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275726#Comment_121275726

The passport thing is a bit of a sideshow. International refugee law says absolutely nothing about having to have a passport in your possession - it makes virtually no difference whether you have a real passport, a fake one or no passport at all when you make a claim for asylum...it doesn't establish whether you are a genuine refugee or not.

mistersifter · 23-10-2023 7:27pm

Cabin crew may even call ahead to let border control know that a passenger is destroying their document during the flight.

The passenger can be met by immigration on the plane, and may by law be detained on the plane and returned back.

But guess what, they're not returned! They're allowed to disembark and enter the very very long asylum application process. And once in, they're in.

mistersifter · 23-10-2023 7:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275758#Comment_121275758

Immigration law says you must have a valid travel document to arrive in Ireland.

It makes a difference what document you destroy because if someone is destroying say a Bulgarian or Latvian travel document, it means they have refugee status in that country and don't need to be claiming asylum in Ireland.

malinheader · 23-10-2023 7:40pm

I think it’s fair to conclude then that we do operate an open borders policy with absolutely no one turned away even with no documentation.

I think we can also conclude that anyone not wanting to be flagged because of previous conviction in another country can just destroy their identity papers and enter Ireland freely.

So people saying we don't operate an open borders system and checks are carried out on individuals would seriously need to have a seriously good think about this.

Strazdas · 23-10-2023 7:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275783#Comment_121275783

Yes indeed, and Irish immigration officials have been intercepting people at foreign airports trying to travel to Ireland on false documentation.

But once in Ireland, the passport thing becomes largely irrelevant to their asylum claim - the decision to grant asylum would be based solely on the person's circumstances and history, nothing to do with what passport they had in their possession, whether real or fake or no passport at all.

malinheader · 23-10-2023 8:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275815#Comment_121275815

How can you base asylum on someone's circumstances and history if they have no documentation to determine where they came from. Is word of mouth acceptable for asylum status.

Beasty · 23-10-2023 8:12pm

Honesty Policy threadbanned

Gatling · 23-10-2023 8:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275929#Comment_121275929

You can't we've seen cases where people have claimed to have fled from Kenya but when asylum cases came to Court the appointed translators come out and say this person speaking isn't from Kenya but from Nigeria.

And we've seen the case of triple killer from Zimbabwe arriving here to claim asylum under a false name

Galwayguy35 · 23-10-2023 8:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121275950#Comment_121275950

Yeah I remember when the story first broke about the murderer the Twitter gang said it was racism and far right propangda but suddenly they all disappeared back into the shadows when it turned out to be true.

Gatling · 23-10-2023 9:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121276038#Comment_121276038

It was very publicly debunked by boardies to the point I made up the whole story......

Aged well didn't it

https://www.sundayworld.com/crime/world-crime/man-wanted-in-zimbabwe-for-triple-murder-had-been-living-in-ireland-under-fake-name/a330331179.html

hynesie08 · 23-10-2023 9:38pm

Ah yes, Peter Dube, Interpol's most wanted, who didn't have an Interpol notice against him. who was in Ireland, then wasn't, then was. Who was arrested in Ireland, where the Zimbabwean police contacted the Garda to say he was a wanted fugitive, but instead Ireland, the country that doesn't enforce deportations according to boards......... Deported him to Malawi.

There's no holes in that story whatsoever.