Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings - updated 11/5/24*

0ph0rce0

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609440#Comment_120609440

You'd be surprised by the people around this area. They wont take any **** if these lads move in and kick off.

Just what we needed anyway, more lads sitting on the church wall all day with the junkies 👍️

0ph0rce0

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609474#Comment_120609474

The front doors are pretty much facing each other

MegamanBoo

I've heard some crazy sh1t on boards but blaming refugees for the state of our healthcare system tops the lot.

We've near doubled our per capita spending in the past twenty yet services are largely worse.

30bn on the HSE and how much of that going to gougers? Management consultants, pr firms, quango charities, luxury offices.

How much to private temp agencies pocketing multiple of hourly rates for nurses and care workers?

How much managing the logistic mess that is our public/private split on antiquated IT systems.

How much to FFG cronies for mystery consultancy fees, remember Rehab?

All FFG can do is spend ever more on privitization and put the likes of Harris, the college dropout and office assistant in charge.

All of that and more, and people can point the finger at a few poor, misfortune refugees as the problem.

A new low.

Build homes not hate.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609408#Comment_120609408

That’s an absolutely crucial point…. They hadn’t got the want or will to do it for people who share the same passport,country and who pay their wages… but as soon as a little international pressure is on for refugees getting help…he is all over it… almost like someone else is pulling the strings, almost like our politicians are in zombieland as regards their own citizens and paymasters but will sit bolt up and prepared to move heaven and earth for anyone in trouble in an international context.

Goldengirl

By virtue of the fact that these people are refugees, and are claiming asylum, they are not vetted before they flee (how could they be?) and as their asylum application is processed their records will be checked if available.

If it is found that they are criminal they will, eventually face deportation. If they are refused asylum they are asked to leave or deported but they, many of them, go underground before that can happen.

Many will leave Ireland for Europe illegally as Ireland is too small to stay unnoticed for long, even in cities.

I don't agree with all the hype about certain refugees culture and supposed crime waves. It hasn't materialised despite much touting from interested parties.

We have plenty of indigenous scumbags in this country who are well capable of worse. And have been running rings around our gardaí and legal system for years.

I do agree that with a small country with limited resources housing, education and healthcare but not money or jobs, we need to take stock. A discussion about how much is enough /too much, and put more money into policing, processing and deportation, as well as communicating better with communities all over the country so that the extreme right don't fill that void with hate and panic.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609505#Comment_120609505

Yeah, when did you last phone your GP for an appointment (that you will pay for) and how long did it take?

A month plus round here to get an appointment in the local town.

MegamanBoo

Here's those figures on healthcare spending.

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/IRL/ireland/healthcare-spending#:~:text=Ireland%20healthcare%20spending%20for%202019,a%203.24%25%20increase%20from%202015.

Furze99

We may wonder if any of these lads are not actually fleeing war but death threats from drug gangs that they've crossed? Are we importing criminals?

hamburgham

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609440#Comment_120609440

I think you’re dreaming if you think that building in Dun Laoghaire will ever accommodate immigrants. Funnily enough,the Santry and Clondalkin centres are already kitted out and ready to go. We’re told the DL centre won’t be ready for months. Ha ha, it will fade out of memory. That Dun Laoghaire centre was just thrown in to stop people saying that these centres are always located in relatively poorer areas.

Galwayguy35

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609537#Comment_120609537

Well according to Peadar Toibin on RTE the other night most of them wont be deported because although a couple of thousand orders were signed over the past few years only about 400 actually left the country.

Until we have a system like they have in other countries where the person is actually put on the plane out of here when an order is signed the illegals will just disappear into the rest of the population.

But sure we give an amnesty to overstayers and those who ignore deportation orders here so all they have to do is wait until the next one is announced.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609558#Comment_120609558

Might we just need more GPs?

How much have waiting times increased in relation to the population increase brought about by refugees?

I'd wager a pretty penny the figures don't come close to matching.

Beechwoodspark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609578#Comment_120609578

Well apparently theres absolutely no vetting so your guess is as good as anyone’s

end of the road

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609421#Comment_120609421

such a party might win votes country wide from the far right and those they whip up certainly but here is the thing, they ain't giving you what you want either.

the tories aren't going to control immigration, if they were then they would have resourced the perfectly good system they had properly and increased resources, but instead they defunded it to create a crisis to whip up the only support base they actually have now because general tories are sick of them and their crap.

the tory party are not centre right and haven't been since 1979, they are a fully right party who bankrupt a country and throw away money on tax cuts for the rich while not investing in the country.

leo is correct that one can't vito who lives in their area, that's how it should be, areas can't stay the same indefinitely, that's just not realistic.

the reason buses of refugees are having to be brought in in the middle of the night is because of the violent far right, because dispite the fact dialogue is being had, the far right are whipping up people who believe crap on facebook.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609633#Comment_120609633

Good try but number of GPs in this practice has increased over the years. Only a small point, but one of the many pressure points when you increase the population, give people medical cards but do sweet FA to develop basic services to meet the new demand.

As suggested above, these lads should be given one year work permits and let them go rent their accomm and pay their own living expenses. After a year, review and any not working - deport. At least then we might have a level playing field in local jobs at lower paid levels where young Irish people start off.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609474#Comment_120609474

Reports say the asylum seekers will be housed in the old Senior college? I'm not sure where that is in relation to the Niche complex?

hymenelectra

What's the plan?

When there is clearly detriment for irish people, then spell out the benefits? What's the problem with that? Is it that there is no benefit, only detriment, hence the silence? That at least adds up.

As far as I can see, I haven't heard anything coming close to a plan. Its just wild abandon.

This is not a political issue, this isn't about left or right or middle. There isn't enough capacity, and no spin is going to change that. We have a tangible, worsening problem facing the country.

This situation is definitively out of control.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609608#Comment_120609608

I think you're wrong as there was previously some years ago another asylum seekers accommodation centre in Dl. Very low key and no issues. But in a very different time.

I actually hope it does get used. Because I think there's a lot of virtue signallers will reconsider this issue differently if their area is flooded by young men hanging round their shops and public spaces.

hymenelectra

If the government and opposition want to put their efforts into helping people that arent Irish without regard for the irish, then they should walk out and join the United Nations.

If they want to follow their mandate, as the Irish government, elected by Irish people, to look out first and foremost for irish people, in Ireland, then these boys are mad incompetent.

They are factually going against the grain of Irish society, and that is simply the opposite of what they're paid for.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609750#Comment_120609750

How much did the population increase by?

I'd guesstimate a 2 percent population increase in the last few years due to protection seekers, that's what's broken health and housing?

Nonsense

hymenelectra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609880#Comment_120609880

What is the plan here though?

What is the vision?

The situation is so far out of control, people are focused on the latest mess, and then the latest mess, and the latest mess. There isn't a mention of a plan.

So the government keeps stuffing people into every building they can find, until what?

They'll knock up prefab units to get people into, they'll set up tents, barracks, hotels, let shanty towns develop, until what?????

The healthcare system utterly collapses? The population is literally unpoliceable? Money runs out? There's a deficit of a million homes? Schooling falls apart?

Which particular red line are we waiting to be crossed before this government dares fart out a thought as to the future?

We are regressing into a malfunctional society, and if you think that sounds dramatic, tell me all about the secret plan that nobody's heard yet.

Galwayguy35

The Minister for Integration will be the position nobody wants, kind of like what Health and Housing has been up to now

Will be interesting to see if the shinners are in power after the next election if one of them volunteers to take it.

hymenelectra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609964#Comment_120609964

The minister for disintegration?

Anytime any person, or td, or government, or opposition wants to put forward anything as to a plan, literally anything, people are waiting to listen. Very impatiently.

Madness as it is.

Stephen_Maturin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609915#Comment_120609915

We’ve had a near 2% increase in population in the last year from protection seekers alone - that’s a massive jump in so short a time.

Nobody is blaming refugees for the state of housing and the healthcare system, but please explain to me how adding tens of thousands of people into these already strained systems won’t make things even worse?

Not only are we spending billions on all these newcomers, it also means more competition for scarce housing etc for us i.e. the people that are paying for all of this in the first place. It’s a lose lose for Irish taxpayers.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609505#Comment_120609505

The Children's hospital was supposed to be less than 500m and be built by 2018. It's now well over 2 billion and they have no final cost figure or opening date. Some folks connected to FG are making a killing on it. Reilly knows...

Gen.Zhukov

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609608#Comment_120609608

You might be on to something there

Last Feb the situation was like this below - Gannon (SD's) had to drag this info out of Rodders

DL post code is A96 I believe and doesn't register. AS's and not UA's

D14 was doing really well at a massive 0.1% and Balbriggan too (which is interesting)

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609627#Comment_120609627

I said that in my post.

Read it through maybe.

People used to be actively deported, then the money to do it was pulled. Now people are meant to have to fund their own' deportation '! They just disappear.

Choices will have to made. Either go down the illegal route like UK which has not been found to work, or let people in, process quickly, police properly , so they can' t disappear when its not going well and deport those that don't pass , actively , as in we put them on a plane with 2 guards like we used to .

First way lies chaos, second way more expensive but less chancing the system, eventually, once they know we are in charge of it.

And the real refugees are not penalised.

As I also said in the previous post, a discussion on how much we as a society we can cope with has to happen.

Cluedo Monopoly

Why is O'Gorman still in charge of housing refugees? A first term Green TD. How is he qualified for this role during a housing crisis? Why aren't the other cabinet members standing up to help and formulate a credible plan or policy? The experienced FFG boyos are keeping the head down. He has asked for assistance and was ignored. Why is that?

Real Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120606019#Comment_120606019

Such shoite

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609625#Comment_120609625

Alleged ...by whom ?

And we have our own to worry about in Tallaght , don't you know ..

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/man-charged-in-connection-with-murders-of-his-three-siblings-in-tallaght/41963620.html

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610041#Comment_120610041

I get what you're saying but I think the impact is far less than people here are making out, and I really don't think any of the effort being made to house refugees was going to be put to the general population anyway.

If you take the alternative approach and go for a further right, zero refugee policy what would that achieve?

How attractive do you think we'd be for foreign investment and skilled workers, including doctors and nurses, if we followed a hard right or Brexit style isolationist approach?

Jeff2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120601745#Comment_120601745

Lucas on the tonight show VMTV 1.

Because of Irish he lost his document from Brazil and Portugal.?

Thelonious Monk

Delighted they're putting a centre in Dun Laoighaire one of the nicest parts of Dublin in my opinion. This is what you all wanted. Bet there'll be no concerned locals out protesting and blocking roads over it either because they'll be busy working and living their lives.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610041#Comment_120610041

"Irish tax payers" include non nationals by the way. An estimated 500,000 workers and tax payers are immigrants (2022 figures).

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610311#Comment_120610311

What you doing here spreading ...sense ...like that?! 😊

Real Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610302#Comment_120610302

Agreed, put all the AS centres in south Dublin.

hymenelectra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610286#Comment_120610286

If importing doctors and nurses were improving the health system, they've had many years to prove it. In many ways it is worse than ever. So that's a natch, that old wives tale can be put to bed.

As to the handwringing about the magical economy and we'll scare it off, well wheres all the money then? A glorified unfinished wing on a hospital?

If the economy is so outrageously great, why is everything falling to bits?

There's more than a hint of a magicians trick at play here, I'm sure more and more people are questioning it too. It simply does not add up.

This is not a political issue. The facts cannot be altered by saying it in a different way, or from a different mouth.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610343#Comment_120610343

Or spread them throughout the city and country

hymenelectra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610358#Comment_120610358

Until what?

Real Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610358#Comment_120610358

No, better to put them in areas where they are welcome

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610365#Comment_120610365

Until they stop them coming or whatever? Meanwhile they have to be held somewhere until we stop taking them.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610333#Comment_120610333

Yes, we keep on hearing about immigrants being a supposed "burden" and "drain" on resources and infrastructure, but completely ignoring that these half a million migrant workers are tax payers and consumers just like everyone else.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610252#Comment_120610252

Ryan should have pulled him from that role ages ago. He was Minister for Children and got this hospital pass unwittingly. It will destroy Greens like Irish Water destroyed Labour. Ryan is too dim to see the damage. FFG should be forced to own this along with the general housing disaster they created.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610376#Comment_120610376

But I thought working class areas don't want them, rural Ireland doesn't want them and posh areas would be up in arms? So distribute them evenly to all.

hymenelectra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610381#Comment_120610381

And yet, just like the magic economy numbers, many, many pillars of a functional society are crumbling.

More and more people, more and more money. But not enough teachers, schools hospitals, staff, infrastructure, gp's, gardai, firefighters, not enough housing, shanty towns, unaffordable this, unaffordable that.

How do you square that?

There's something seriously backwards about this whole purported mess and it's illusionary effect is wearing off big time.

72sheep

Condalkin and Santry are good to go for nearly 700 "single men" - doubtless these are all persecuted poets for having distributed peace pamphlets in distant war torn regions! Meanwhile over in the mean streets of Dun Laoghaire, we're going to need to wait for some landscaping work before it's ready to open for these visitors ;-)

Just watch as our govmt "works so hard" on these unprecedented problems #sosomuchcare

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2023/05/17/asylum-seekers-to-be-housed-in-three-new-centres-in-dublin/

hymenelectra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610379#Comment_120610379

Do you, in all gods honesty, think that the nation is going to swallow that???

"Until they stop coming or whatever"

Ireland is a speck of dirt size-wise. Just one single of these disaster zone countries could fill it 20 times over.

But fair play to you for saying it loud. I'd absolutely love to hear just one of these politicians speak that honesty

"Until they stop coming or whatever"

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610340#Comment_120610340

No of course not ..but was he given asylum ?

Should everybody seeking asylum be tarred with the same brush because of one ( and am sure there are more but there are checks that are gone through as soon as they are processed as above ) .

By that token nobody should ever be taken in seeking asylum ...is that what you are advocating?

It's really not a question of " importing " or " letting people in " as some people would like you to think .

People have to go through an internationally recognised system and as a country that wants to be taken seriously in the world Ireland cannot just ditch this framework just because it no longer suits / is becoming a but onerous .

We are an attractive country now, because believe it or not , we are deemed to be wealthy and prosperous. Yes hard to believe because our government are not acting like that, only developers , vulture funds and energy suppliers reaping the benefits at the moment.

Our government need to accept that they cannot keep putting extra money aside for a rainy day because the country needs it now !

Healthcare, housing , policing , education and more people on the ground to deal with it all .

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610424#Comment_120610424

Well we do have to put them somewhere until they stop coming or we send them back at the airport, or whatever, no?

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610381#Comment_120610381

Think the thread is concentrating on 'refugees ' and not on the end product .

I do agree that some controls need to be in place , if only to catch up, however . But how to do that? These people are not the same as migrant workers although some may be just that. At least with migrant workers the government can limit the amount and type of visas if they want .

hymenelectra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610434#Comment_120610434

It just doesn't add up. An accountants fever dream.

The more people that arrive, the less people we have available (guards, doctors, teachers, firefighters etc). WHAT? COME AGAIN?

The more money we have, the less housing, healthcare, transport, infrastructure etc we have. WHAT? COME AGAIN?

The whole thing reeks to the high heavens. Told one thing, reality presents the opposite. Again and again.