Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings - updated 11/5/24*

grumpyperson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613404#Comment_120613404

With the exception of Ukraine, I expect doctors and nurses could apply for a work visa? I think you might be disappointed if you're expecting a deluge of doctors and nurses from the asylum seekers.

This is not to denigrate asylum seekers but just to point out I do not think your assertion is correct.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613794#Comment_120613794

I didn't even see that until now, but once I saw the rest of your posts I saw I had misjudged you.

I apologised earlier in the thread and am happy to do so again.

grumpyperson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613929#Comment_120613929

No worries. I posted before I saw your retraction, sorry about that🤗

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613923#Comment_120613923

I never said anything about a deluge. I said any were welcome as they are. They can apply to work once here six months on asylum.

But its not just healthcare.

They are working in schools and many other jobs.

They only get a tiny stipend as provision, not dole so the incentive is there to work unlike the sssertion made by posters that people were here for benefits or the money.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613716#Comment_120613716

By your own post.. They listened, but they didn't agree. With the protestors I mean.

Do those protestors speak for everybody in the area?

There is a difference between listening and engaging and doing what certain people want over others.

Maybe middle ground somewhere.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613842#Comment_120613842

Ok. Do you think people in Clare should not be asked to take on refugees but people in Portobello should?

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613760#Comment_120613760

Whoever I responded to said the people we have emigrating are highly skilled, I refuted that. And there probably are 1000s arriving every year in Australia, certainly in the UK, just most of them don't stay there forever.

jackboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613993#Comment_120613993

I can guarantee the protesters in Clare need very very little to stop the blockade. The government don’t want to give anything though as that would set a precedent. This is the government who have literally been dumping refugees on the street, but only some nationalities, now that is real racism. If the government agreed to provide the refugees in Clare with basic services then blockade over, but the suspicion that they are just being dumped with very little supports is a legitimate concern.

Galwayguy35

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614007#Comment_120614007

Well thats kind of the problem, nobody asked them at all they were just bussed in to the place.

The government has form on this and up to now thought they could get away with it.

Same thing happened last year here where I live but it was Ukrainian women and kids so none of us said anything but if it was unvetted men they put here we would feel the same as the folks in Clare.

squonk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614007#Comment_120614007

People in Clare have taken in a lot of refugees to date. Lisdoonvarna is a small town with several hotels which are all full with refugees. My point if you didn’t get it is if get a large influx into a relatively small area with a small population and a similar level of local services is not the same as a district in a very large city. And, no, nobody in Lisdoonvarna was explicitly asked. It just emerged that tge refugees were coming. Now those refugees are holed up in a small one horse town with nothing going on. Getting to anywhere of interest requires a bus journey and there aren’t many of those daily. A situation like this is only exacerbated in a place like Inch which has less going on even. I’d venture that the bus service in Lisdoonvarna is better than inch, if it even has a bus service. Do you get that?

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614083#Comment_120614083

The bribing has began

https://twitter.com/conwayforclare/status/1659121402606125063

WheelieKing

Funny how none of these refugee centres are earmarked or put in well off Dublin locations (Foxrock/Goatstown/Malahide etc..) and only pop up in rural or working class areas. Surely everyone has to play their part right?

Beasty

hymenelectra threadbanned

squonk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614412#Comment_120614412

If I sent that guy to the shop for potatoes he’d come back with apples. Funding, yeah, great but I don’t see how that immediately helps tge people in the Inch community given tge issue there is the immediate facilities.

JP Liz V1

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1659130914515869696

Was there not lots of objections to travellers getting houses and halting sites etc., by even TDs but now no one can object protest etc.,

bokale

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613827#Comment_120613827

What areas do they live in?

realitykeeper

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120612140#Comment_120612140

Yes based on what I suggested, new builds would increase because cash rich property owners would be selling their existing properties in order to buy new builds. Existing houses (of which there are many) would fall in price because the owners of those properties would be selling to people who are just starting out in life and it is those buyers who would determine the market price for those properties. The prices would keep falling until the buyers can afford them.

It is a mistake on several levels to say the state should build houses. For one thing, it was the state that caused the housing crisis by inflating existing housing stock and rendering new builds unviable. My suggestion would make new builds highly viable and deflate the cost of existing houses. If the state were to build houses, they would hire private companies to do it. And, of course whenever the state does anything, there are opportunities for corrupt politicians and civil servants to make a buck for themselves and that feeds back to the taxpayer or forward to the end user in the form of mouldy ceilings, fire hazards, hypothermia in the winter and so on.

Also, the state really only want to house the masses and they want to do it cheap. Suppose you don`t want to live in a cheap house the state built. Suppose you want to be able to afford a nice house in a nice area of your choice? Suppose you want to be able to afford a house with a bit of history and character? My suggestion would make that possible.

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/sligo/news/county-sligo-apartments-to-house-over-115-asylum-seekers/a406359431.html

Another 120 refugees going to Ballisodare in Sligo. I'm sure that accommodation isn't already needed there!!!

Got a message from a friend earlier. Their rent is being increased by €400 per month to €1200. A young family! House is not in a RPZ so landlord can do what they want! Every town and village in the country is a RPZ if you ask me.

It's all a vicious circle and this country is going to the dogs.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614083#Comment_120614083

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614216#Comment_120614216

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614274#Comment_120614274

I get that. So is it more buses or what people are looking for ?

Maybe you could explain what it is that locals want ?

All refugees are checked out for criminal records prior replacement btw galwayguy , but it's not the same in depth vetting thatyou or I would go through before taking up a job with vulnerable people obviously

However it's more than some of those protesting , in Dublin anyway, have had , the necks on some of them !

squonk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614707#Comment_120614707

Why are you looking at this in terms of short fix solutions? There aren’t any. It boils down to bussing a load of foreign nationals into an area with low facilities and low services won’t work. People feel sorry for the refugees stuck in Lisdoonvarna. Dumping people in the middle of nowhere solves the governments problem by being able to say they’ve housed that batch. For the refugees it’s pretty bad. You have absolutely nothing to do and all day to do it. Yes better transport infrastructure might help but that takes ages to sort out. Better local facilities like libraries and schools, GP clinics, other support services again won’t show up by next Monday morning. I don’t know the locals in Inch but I suspect this is what they’re talking about. I suspect there’s no plan in place once those people get dropped off at the hotel but it’s job done and their immediate needs are being met which is grand but by the June Bank Holiday they’ll be sick of the place and their access to services won’t be that great. What’s your answer to a problem like this?

squonk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614707#Comment_120614707

Right. So basically according to you the protesters are racist and should welcome any number into their community with open arms even if it means a huge drop in services for everyone? I don’t know where you are based but I sense the effect isn’t as accute where you are.

MrMusician18

I wonder will the locals protesting in Inch back down? Govt is digging in since if they give an inch (pardon the pun) it's game over for this whole affair.

That said a reckoning for the policy has to be coming - there are only so many people you can fit in hotels without collapsing the tourism industry completely.

dmakc

Two things the government have been terrible at: 1) housing & 2) public transport in rural areas. Now they're dependent on public transport in rural areas to facilitate 'temporary' housing of refugees

squonk

I hope they keep going but I can see the government using the Gardai to get a few arrests and hope they can dispel the protests that way. I think they’re buying off the tourist industry right now with the 9% VAT rate and other local initiatives. The day must be coming where the arse falls out of it all though. I’m hoping it won’t take an injury or worse to make them realise it’s time to rethink all this.

squonk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614794#Comment_120614794

Would you trust them on that though?

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614756#Comment_120614756

Wow some leap there !

Dublin, 2 centres nearby and many more living around us . Same services stretched as always . Don't talk crvp trying to bait me .

Give your head a wobble there and be honest . If you agree with blockades and heavy handed protests over meeting and discussing things with your democratically elected reps then you are on the wrong side of this . If you genuinely worry for these refugees you would not agree with intimidation or harassment .

squonk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614844#Comment_120614844

Calm down. The issue here is that the government want to steamroll any and all opposition. I’ve a feeling the protestors in inch would gladly engage with elected representatives and did with the local ones. The minister is tge one who pushed back. Now they’ve sent the junior minister out which is a step in the right direction. I’m still going to reiterate that Dublin I’d vastly different to a small rural area. I agree services are stretched everywhere but if you asked me would I prefer to be a refugee in a small rural town with poor services or one in an area of a large city with stretched services, I’d take the city any day. The options are far better, quality of life would be better.

GNWoodd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614802#Comment_120614802

Gardai won’t arrest anyone there. These are local people protesting against a decision that makes no sense.

Ironically if the owner of Magowna could have continued to make a living from it as a thriving rural pub that it once was, there wouldn’t have been any need for it to have to be used as a centre for accommodation. Maybe locals are sick of several government decisions.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614858#Comment_120614858

I engaged, you went for me , so I responded .😉 But fair enough . I do think they need to communicate better.. if nothing else then, this might improve now .

Not happy with protests after personal experience of the thugs threatening and shouting all sorts, stirring locals up . The lies they told ...leaflets with complete bollxxx and some people were really scared and panicked.

None of it came to pass . The disruption for that time has died down and nobody wants to even think about it now .

The refugees are integrating with schools and some working , but yes there is bound to be an effect on essential services . There is a limit everywhere to capacity in services , not just in rural areas .

Also they have to try to integrate people all over the country .

Ghettoisation of refugees in cities and large towns is not fair to urban dwellers nor refugees.

I think it might be better to locate families/ older people in rural areas rather than young men but they are desperate to place people .

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614695#Comment_120614695

The people of Sligo need to get their act together and block this nonsense. Otherwise this will never stop.

Its 115 men again.

Translation:

Young lads seeking a bit of craic and working the system so they get free bed and board.

squonk

Fair point and tge refugees already here are making positive contributions and integrating in the area which is what everyone wants.

The locals in Inch don’t sound like they’re being influenced (yet) by those troublemakers who always show up to these kind of things. I believe what I e heard though when they say the facility isn’t suitable. It’s not my area so they obviously know it better.

The patronising tone from the government is very unwelcome. It’s stopping just shy of intimating that they are racially motivated and that is the real crime here. Having to be dragged kicking and screaming to even engage with local residents isn’t a good look. What’s more they’re not helping their cause in the longer term. In the end refugees get lobbed in the middle of nowhere with no natural engagement with the local community and just far enough away from major population centres to make getting there impractical unless you can get a taxi and that’s not cheap nowadays.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120610876#Comment_120610876

The ‘still more’ and ‘no limits’ brigade will and indeed just have marketed that as a failure of the health service rather the rapidness of the out of control population increases putting skyrocketing and unreasonable demand on it… from the Dublin Neurological Institute website…. “Given the high demand for neurology appointments, the wait to see a neurologist can be up to 36 months.” Obviously that is depending on the condition… it’s completely unfair..

Add to a shortage of neurologists, a shortage of physiotherapists and clinical nurse specialists into the mix…all of which is documented and acknowledged…. Professor Tim Lynch and Dr Roisin Lonergan are doing their best but with limited resources, and next to zero government support…

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614958#Comment_120614958

i was told by that institute due to the urgency highlighted on my referral they can’t even offer me any possibility of an appointment. So if you are deemed urgent neurologists generally deem it inappropriate to even put you on their list. So one must seek care overseas. I’m sure others have found the same in other areas of medical care, this is just my own personal experience.

Kermit.de.frog

The reason the promise of local consultations isn't getting results for the govt is because everyone knows it's just a one way rachet . Even if everyone in the community said no they'd go ahead anyway.

I don't think many people have much faith in consultations.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120613564#Comment_120613564

According to the UN 90% of those fleeing Ukraine are women or children, according to the CSO 80% of those coming to Ireland are women or children.

It would suggest that single men and men with families are more likely to make the journey west and that women who have left their husbands behind are sticking around Eastern Europe with their kids.

We are still talking about a very small sample taken though, of the 8m that have fled Ukraine, 75,000 are in Ireland, or about 0.9% of the total. Ireland have 1.1% of the EU population so we are still over 10,000 off our fair share

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615204#Comment_120615204

Heard on the radio this am, the protesters say they don't want any more refugees on the grounds as the hotel part of the accommodation is not fit for purpose. Fire safety being quoted as the reason

The govt said it won't be fit for purpose for 4 weeks and works are ongoing so have promised no more asylum seekers for those next 4 weeks and the protesters are happy with that

Seems the situation in Clare is about to be diffused

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120611263#Comment_120611263

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120611296#Comment_120611296

Talk about propagandistic massaging of the truth. The Journal has always had a comment section that has been heavily overtly anti immigration for well over a decade.

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615222#Comment_120615222

Thats assuming every country takes in the same proportion , while in reality most Ukranians end up in nearby countries eg nearly 2 million in Poland.Ireland with a population of 5 million have taken in 85,000, France with a population of 67 million have taken in 140,000. I think we've done enough.

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615243#Comment_120615243

You were here 2 days ago making allegations against me and another poster about racism. I asked you 3 times to quote the relevent comments I supposedly made.

Any chance you can quote my racist comments?

Right now you are coming across as just another do-gooder who just throws out the racist card when your defense of these asylum tourists wasn't holding up.

A bit of substance to you claims and you might have some credibility around here.

Guildenstern

What hasn’t been mentioned much by the media that this drive to put people who are constantly arriving into the country on a daily basis into urgent temporary accommodation, is that it is just continuing the Direct Provision nightmare – for both the State and the occupants.

If there is nowhere else for them to go, new arrivals will have to stay in this temporary accommodation. No amount of new modular housing will be able to keep up with demand, unless that demand becomes a trickle. The IT this week seriously pointed to the issue that some in government will hope that word will get around that Ireland just hasn’t the accommodation, and they’ll look elsewhere. Some ‘plan’ that is.

Lofidelity

Where will it all end? There is tens if not hundreds of millions worldwide who qualify for refugee or international protection status. Legal and moral obligations will have to be set aside as Ireland and the EU cant take them all.

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615416#Comment_120615416

Forget about moving away from direct provision. If it's own door accomodation for everybody then the influx will only accelerate.

I'm not sure what alternative plan you think we can have other than give people crap accomodation in the middle of nowhere and hope they their friends not to bother.

We need to deter this type of low spending tourist.

dmakc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615425#Comment_120615425

Exactly. Feels like if we get 500 off the street, the floodgates open for the next 500. We had one family move into our rural community and they weren't long finding their way to a boombox and drink and the neighbourhood hasn't slept since. They laugh at the Gardai and jeer them out. No one can do a thing about it. It's a massive culture clash. I feel sorry for what's in store for Ballisodare

Guildenstern

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615287#Comment_120615287

You mean it reflects majority opinion in the country? Democracy in action!!

StrawbsM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120614942#Comment_120614942

Go to oceanfm.ie and click listen live. They will be discussing it shortly

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615243#Comment_120615243

Seems the situation in Clare is about to be diffused

Yep, over the whole country

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615243#Comment_120615243

I suspect the protestors will regret basing their objections on the fire safety issue and that some will continue to protest on other concerns.

Patrick2010

As predicted, many Ukrainians will be staying and will be bringing extended family.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/over-30000-ukrainian-refugees-could-get-full-time-residency/a1289527330.html

MORE than 30,000 Ukrainians could be granted permanent residency in Ireland if they are in secure jobs or education, while tens of thousands more could be paid welfare in order to return home, under plans being explored by the Government.

Ministers have been warned, however, that granting residency to some Ukrainians who are employed in Ireland may result in them being joined by family members – potentially putting further strain on the State’s already creaking system for accommodating refugees.

Draft proposals for the future of the estimated 75,000 Ukrainians in Ireland were discussed at a cabinet committee meeting earlier this month.

Ministers were given survey data from Ukrainian Action in Ireland, showing that 41pc – or just over 30,000 of refugees currently benefiting from the temporary protection – have decided to stay.

jackboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120615659#Comment_120615659

The fire cert is just one of the issues. The main issue is that the refugees are potentially just being dumped at the location without the required supports. Any community would be nervous about a large group of men dumped at their location with no money and really deficient supports. Even if they were all Irish this would make people just as nervous.

marno21

This means Ireland can set no limit on the numbers who may arrive here, Ireland as we know it will be changed beyond recognition and as an older person I have no interest whatsoever in integrating with new arrivals,life is hard enough to get through as it is. I have enjoyed my life though, I live in a nice area surrounded by good neighbours and its safe.

If Ukraine joins the EU (which is some time away), any Ukrainian person landing here will have the same rights and entitlements as any other EU citizen. Which means they will have to enter the Irish rental market. That alone will stop any influx or anything as such.

waterwelly

If the Ukrainians are "normalised" then it will no longer be Treasure Ireland for them.

They will need to fight for houses, school places etc. the same as everybody else. And I'm fine with that.

The problem here is the soft landing we give to asylum tourists.

Bed, board and living expenses while they build up their network of friends, contacts and work in the black economy.