Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings - updated 11/5/24*

keynes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222260#Comment_120222260

The "most read" article in the Irish Times today is on two bogus asylum seekers. Seems there is quite a bit of interest in this entire asylum racket, even among the liberal elite reading the IT.

minimary

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120221481#Comment_120221481

I'm always amazed at how much credit they give the far right like if they were able to do everything that the media claims the far right is able to do then the National Party would have a fair few TD's and Councillors. From what I can see the far right in Ireland are incredibly disorganised and turn people away from the cause they are trying to promote.

Instead of turning the far right into a bogey man they should actually listen to peoples concerns, they never learn that demonising people won't make them "think correctly". Its exactly the same mistake they made with Brexit. I was talking to a family member tonight, I would not describe him as far right, I would have described him as a leftie if anything but he was saying that he agrees with the protest because his area has taken a lot of Ukranians and asylum seekers and its really affecting his childrens education. The classroom levels have gone up hugely without a corresponding increase in teachers and also its children without English as a first language and learning Irish etc for the first time. He feels like his childrens education is being sacrificed, hes not being influenced by anything nefarious but he says when he sees commentators and politicans try to claim that no one is being disadvantaged by this he feels betrayed because he knows what his children tell him about what their day at school was spent on

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222410#Comment_120222410

This is a valid point.

Opposing the levels of immigration doesnt make you far right.

It simply means you oppose the current levels of immigration.

There could be many reasons for that and they are not all tied to extremism.

Without engagement from the govt with all sides of the argument there will be more and more unrest bubbling under the surface.

The best way to deal with far right ideals is to engage with those that oppose the current levels of immigration but are no way far right in their belief or outlook.

If the govt doesnt engage with these people, guess which way those people are lilkley to turn for support.

These people also now appear to be the majority.

56% and rising.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222289#Comment_120222289

I still have my doubts how much traction this has. It's very topical at the moment because of the large numbers of Ukrainians arriving and the current housing / accommodation shortages but will this still be front of the agenda by the time of the next general election (late autumn 2024)? Witness how Covid and lockdowns have already retreated into being a non issue, after totally dominating the Irish news cycle for 18 months or more.

screamer

They’re going to look to use schools as summer accommodation now. Totally messed up all of this. The bigger issue is that because we are too soft on non genuine refugees and granting them asylum they can then bring in their whole family, so 70k is just the start. How we are going to fund all of this, God only knows maybe that’s why Bertie is back, to grow magic money trees again.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222464#Comment_120222464

That's because COVID lockdowns have ended. If we were still in one, I can guarantee it would be dominating the news agenda.

This topic is not going to go away quietly unless there is a major turn of events. Either the state somehow magics up 10000 beds by April, and continues to magic them up until the end of the year or the war in Ukraine ends or some other reason that makes migrants want to leave rather than come here.

From the initial reports from the EU summit, it looks like the mood has significantly changed at European level. Talking about things such as only processing asylum claims in the country of origin are a complete departure on the old way.

Vestiapx

Take this as you like it but it's the truth.

I came out of a shop yesterday and the cops were clearly running towards something. So being an innocent and politically uninvolved man I followed them. They we it was a protest where anti immigration and pro immigration / Ukrainian / refugee / I don't know , people were shouting.

The pri immigration people were just people, right or wrong they were just people.

The anti immigration or anti refugee people were clearly taking advantage of the COVID thing, they were wearing masks and goodies and being quite anonymous. One of the males stared at me, just his eyes and he probably forgot he was all masked up so didn't realise he was looking like an ninja buts he was quite intimidating,

I suppose my point is that the pro refugee or immigration people seem friendlier than the others .

Friendly wins in the long term

keynes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222464#Comment_120222464

No end in sight to Ukrainians (and many more) arriving and accommodation issues will only get more acute. People have been sleep-walked into this mess for the past few years and now they have woken up, so the political calculus has all changed. There is lots of discontent to come, not least of all from the refugees who won't take well to being shipped around like cattle to various fields, schools, and run-down office blocks. It's only a matter of time before they, too, start protesting. The whole affair is an almighty mess, but this is what happens when your politicians are serving Brussels, and not their own people. Validation from Brussels is all that matters in that game.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222464#Comment_120222464

Just wait until they fast track Ukraine EU status. We can add another 20k to the housing lists overnight 👍👍

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120221882#Comment_120221882

Protesting outside government buildings would be completely ignored by government and media

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222221#Comment_120222221

Major changes in government policy were in enacted last year.

2 tier system for "safe countries" and the suspension of visa free movement back in July.

So no, absolutely nothing to do with feral scum threatening to kill people.

Beechwoodspark

Boggles - Fair play to the protestors, they need to keep at it now and get real reforms to the sh1tshow system currently in this country

hotmail.com

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222721#Comment_120222721

Well this is the type of divisive far right language we don't need. Feral scum.

People really do hate people from social housing.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222738#Comment_120222738

They would be better off reforming themselves.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222747#Comment_120222747

What would you call someone who threatens to burn people to death?

Just 'reasonable protest', it's the gubbermints fault?

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222738#Comment_120222738

Fair play to the protesters for cheering on threats to burn down DP centres?

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222747#Comment_120222747

Pretty appalling rhetoric alright. The low level insults are a manifestation of increasing desperation, as certain individuals throw their toys out of their prams.

It's mildly amusing to witness.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222987#Comment_120222987

So you are offended by me calling people who threaten arson and murder feral scum?

Jesus, that bar has been thrown out the window, hasn't it? 😕

pauly58

Those people saying we have room to take more immigrants, I would ask have you used the health service recently ? My wife has been waiting for an operation since last year & we went to the South Infirmary in Cork yesterday to see a surgeon. It is pandemonium there : appointments are running way late, they used to be pretty good years ago. Staff are great by the way.

Yes, I know another hospital should have been built in Cork ages ago but it won't be, we're falling into the same traps as they did in the UK.

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222998#Comment_120222998

Not offended, just amused by the disingenuous histrionics 'Boggles'.

hotmail.com

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222998#Comment_120222998

Vast vast majority not engaging or approving any violence.

You know this but chose to tar all of the protestors as feral scum. Terms used regularly to slag off council estate people.

Stuff you'd normally hear the far right saying.

enricoh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223006#Comment_120223006

We need more foreign nurses n doctors to join our health service but there is literally no where for them to rent unless it's extortionate, so they go elsewhere. The councils n charities are renting everything going for a never ending supply of our own n imported who won't contribute. Doesn't sound too sustainable to me.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223100#Comment_120223100

You clearly don't get the rules of our new world, the world that preaches about "equality" all the time. Generalizations about "good" groups, are all but evil, if you dare make a generalization about any of them, you're a terrible monster. Those rules don't apply to the "bad" though, it's perfectly fine to generalize every single of them because of the actions of the few.

Boggles

I thought these self declared right types were supposed to be tough on crime.

Seems not.

🤷

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222738#Comment_120222738

Even Leo has gotten the message (even if he is saying it because he's always keenly aware of what way the wind is blowing for his own benefit):

IRELAND needs to be “firm” with people who arrive in the country with a false story or under false pretences and return them to their country of origin, Taoiseach Leo Varadkar has said.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/taoiseach-says-state-needs-to-be-firm-with-people-who-arrive-in-ireland-with-a-false-story-and-return-them-to-their-country-of-origin-42334365.html

Too little too late at this stage I fear, and we'll just ignore I suppose how his FG colleague and Minister for Justice Helen McEntee is a big part of the reason why we are in the mess we are now, but just as with the Irish Water protests, the message can eventually get through!

The bigger problem is the cheerleaders who for their own reasons seem to have a real problem with the expression of views they don't agree with, and would actively try to limit or discedit the rights of fellow citizens to express them through protest. It's ironic that they label these as "far right" when their own attitudes are far more concerning in a modern democracy.

Patrick2010

MEP Barry Andrews on Newstalk today giving out about Leo and the EC yesterday talking about tightening immigration barriers, says barriers never work. Sounded like he wants open borders. Also wants resumption of ship search and rescue missions off the coast of Africa, says theres no evidence it encourages people smugglers trafficking people into Europe.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223503#Comment_120223503

Are the Irexit "party" that are organising some of these protests left of centre?

Did I miss a memo? 🤔

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223530#Comment_120223530

You're missing a lot alright but the main thing seems to be that the wind has shifted on this issue if even Leo is coming out recognising it.

You can continue to rail against the reality all you wish but changes are coming it seems.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223588#Comment_120223588

So that's a no then.

I mean for someone pontificating about mislabelling, you seem to struggle to actually call what these "parties" and their supporters are.

Why is that I wonder?

minimary

The results of the summit are very interesting

"The summit also reached agreement on a “principle” under which one EU country can use a court decision in another EU member state to return an irregular migrant to their home country"

I wonder how that would work in principle like if I apply for asylum in the Netherlands and am denied and then make my way to Ireland, is the original decision by the Netherlands applied and I'm deported, surely I can appeal my Irish deportation order, you can appeal everything here.

That list is going to be a helluva lot longer than the liist we currently have

"The EU leaders also agreed “to increase the use of the safe-country concepts” that will open the way to the bloc formulating a common list, von der Leyen said."

According to Barry Andrews the whole European Council is now far right wing. Its getting to the stage where if everything is far right then nothing is

https://www.thejournal.ie/eu-rules-for-asylum-seekers-5991941-Feb2023/

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223619#Comment_120223619

Hard to believe that a politician could be so out touch - aren't European elections next year?

hotmail.com

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223530#Comment_120223530

Does anyone other than do gooders mention left and right? I just don't hear these terms used in Ireland by anyone else.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223790#Comment_120223790

Lately? the person I was responding to. I doubt they would appreciate the "do gooder" quip though.

But you are right, I prefer the term "Far Loon" far more apt.

I imagine the majority of the Irexit supporters haven't a clue about political ideology and are just brought together exclusively by their irrational fear of foreign people, or vaccines, high speed internet access or whatever nonsense they are protesting on that given day.

batman_oh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223790#Comment_120223790

It's like they are hoping that they can create the same mess that the Americans are dealing with now. Weaponising language and driving division.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223857#Comment_120223857

driving division

That's the sickest part. They then turn around and label anyone who reacts to the problems that they've created as being "divisive", when their own ideology, and the policies that they support, are some of the most divisive and destructive things I've seen in my life. Leo's rant was a great example of that, far right this, racist that, yet not once did he look in the mirror and accept the slightest bit of blame. They love to do that though, ignore that they've caused of all this, and focus solely on the reactions in isolation.

Backstreet Moyes

We have two groups of Loons in the country.

A small number of far right loons.

A small number of far left loons.

Then you have the majority of people who are fed up paying for everything while the services they pay for get worse.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120222558#Comment_120222558

Housing crisis was a huge news story 12 months ago whereas the issue of refugees wasn't even being mentioned. By and large, Ukrainian or other refugees are not causing the housing crisis as they are not being accommodated in any houses or apartments that would have gone to Irish or legal resident people.

It should thus be stressed that the refugee situation is mostly putting huge pressure on the *temporary* or *emergency* accommodation facilities in the country, not on the regular availability of houses or apartments.

creeper1

My fear is that there will be some presentation of being tough on immigration but in reality it being all a charade. Just like the discussion of the opportunist Leo.

The Tories done it in the UK. Before an election they came up with the Rwanda plan knowing in all probability it wasn't feasible. Not one single migrant has ever been sent to Rwanda but it done it's job of getting Tories votes.

I'm very sceptical mainstream parties heart is in getting tough. I'm still recommending people to vote for the Irish freedom party who really do have Ireland best interest at heart.

Backstreet Moyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224076#Comment_120224076

Are you telling me no Ukrainians are living in houses or apartments?

enricoh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224076#Comment_120224076

There's gonna be 180k refugees here by year end the government estimates. These will be moved out of temporary+ emergency accomodation as houses come available for the government to outbid ordinary joe soaps. That's the 'housing crisis' sorted for the next decade.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224158#Comment_120224158

Here's the Irish government's version of that ill-fated Tory plan

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224269#Comment_120224269

Did somebody once tell you, that posting memes from decades' old shows is funny?

Newsflash: It isn't. Might it be time to consider refreshing your feeble attempts to entertain?

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224192#Comment_120224192

They are indeed, but are not being given houses or apartments that were destined for Irish people or 'legal' immigrants.

No Irish person has missed out on a house or apartment because it was given to a Ukrainian person / family instead. It has also been pointed out by charities and others that no Irish homeless person has missed out on an accommodation place in the last few months because of refugees.

Backstreet Moyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224352#Comment_120224352

Can you explain to me how no Irish person has missed out on a house due to Ukrainians.

How are you coming to that conclusion.

Can you provide me links to comments from charities and others that you have seen claim that?

StrawbsM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224352#Comment_120224352

I beg to differ. Homes outside of major cities and very large towns wouldn’t be renting for nearly as much. €800 tax free per month and not bound by the rules of the rented housing act is a great incentive.

I know of one house that was always a rental. When the most recent tenants moved out (they had built), it wasn’t advertised for rent again and recently a Ukrainian family moved in.

I don’t blame the landlord at all. Makes perfect business sense.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224401#Comment_120224401

I'm assuming that few Ukrainian arrivals can afford to rent or buy a house or apartment. If some of them have been lucky enough to find a fulltime well paid job and are able to pay to rent their own apartment or house in Ireland, then that is hardly a big issue or a controversy.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223857#Comment_120223857

Like the protestors are doing?

Open Borders this illegals that and obsession with “the left.” Mighty fine glass house.

Galwayguy35

You know the D4 media are desperate when they had to wheel out Lucky whats his name last night on Prime Time to tell us what big bad racists we all are all the while Fran McNulty hanging off his every word.

Then today Andrews wetting his pants crying about the "far right"

The cat is out of the bag at this stage though, the protests won't stop and the economic migrants will keep coming.

I was giving it until summer before the sh1t hit the fan but it looks like things are going to come to a head sooner than that.

Backstreet Moyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224534#Comment_120224534

You made a statement as a fact that no Irish person has missed out on a house due to Ukrainians.

You even made a statement of charities saying the same thing.

Can you provide links and explain how you are coming to that conclusion.

I am more interested now because in the scenario in your last sentence it is a scenario where Irish people would miss out on a house.

I have no problem with Ukrainians by the way.

batman_oh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120224622#Comment_120224622

You seem to be unable to go a day without going on about the far right. If it does actually come to be an issue here it will have been created by people like you pretending this current course is perfectly ok and doubling down on it without listening to any opposing views and labelling everybody that raises concerns with slurs. Exactly how Sweden got their right wing government.

Weirdly even the EU are starting to show concern about this issue now - you can slap the far right label on them now too so that should keep you happy for a while.